Ireland to introduce (extremely limited) abortion

[Irishy]

There is proposed legislation in the wake of the death of Savita Halapanavar. It's widely thought that the legislation will go through. There has been huge controversy over the inclusion of suicide as a risk to the life of the mother. The laws will be so incredibly limited that frankly, it would be easier to travel to the UK.

Among other things, it specifies where an abortion can be carried out - only in healthcare facilities providing obstetric and mental health services.

One doctor will be able to approve an abortion in the event of an emergency threatening a pregnant woman's life; two in a non-emergency threat and three - two psychiatrists and one obstetrician - in the case of a threat of suicide.

The explanatory notes say an abortion can only be allowed where there is a clinical assessment that the mother's life is threatened by a real and substantial risk that can only be averted by a termination of pregnancy.

There is a process for a review if an abortion is not approved, which will involve a committee that must be established within seven days.

In the case of suicidal ideation, for a woman to be granted a termination of pregnancy, the three consultants reviewing the case must all agree that this should proceed.

The three doctors - one obstetrician/gynaecologist and two psychiatrists, are required to "form an opinion and jointly certify that a termination is required to avert a real and substantial risk to the life of the mother".

http://www.thejournal.ie/abortion-legis ... 9-May2013/

[AuntCloud]

Sounds good - it's a good start and definitely better than a blanket ban. Is public opinion really that divorced from the official stance on abortions? (I'm seriously asking this. Will most people be happy with this legislation?)

[Irishy]

The Catholic Church in Ireland are dismayed. But Cardinal O'Malley in Boston is taking things to new heights by boycotting an event the Irish PM Enda Kenny is due to attend.

http://www.thejournal.ie/boston-cardina ... 7-May2013/

[Irishy]

Sounds good - it's a good start and definitely better than a blanket ban. Is public opinion really that divorced from the official stance on abortions? (I'm seriously asking this. Will most people be happy with this legislation?)

I would say its 50/50 although the public will not vote on this.

[yewchapel]

I just find it so incredible that the RCC has such a stranglehold over such issues when they're not even the official state church. I mean, in England* we do have a state church yet the abortion law is so different and is very unlikely to change. But the proposals are something at least.

*I'm aware that UK abortion law applies to the whole of the UK, but the Church of England is only the state church in England.

[OkToBeTakei]

I would say its 50/50 although the public will not vote on this.

It's a start Irishy. A start.

[crazyforkate]

Well, at least they're moving in the right direction. Hopefully it won't take more deaths to make them move even further.

[Drina Adams]

I just find it so incredible that the RCC has such a stranglehold over such issues when they're not even the official state church. I mean, in England* we do have a state church yet the abortion law is so different and is very unlikely to change. But the proposals are something at least.

*I'm aware that UK abortion law applies to the whole of the UK, but the Church of England is only the state church in England.

The northern Ireland government has always opted out of the UK abortion system.

It's slightly less restricted there than in the republic but still far easier to travel or buy abortion pills online. Rape victims still won't be able to.access abortion.

[longskirtlotsakids]

Hang on a cottin pickin second. There is a Marie Stopes.clinic in Belfast that does medical and surgical abortions. Been open since October.

[Anycah]

Hang on a cottin pickin second. There is a Marie Stopes.clinic in Belfast that does medical and surgical abortions. Been open since October.

Belfast is in Northern Ireland, which is a part of the United Kingdom. This legislation is for Ireland, not the UK.

[longskirtlotsakids]

Obviously-but fthe whole Island is about the size of WI with no limits on border crosses. I was just there. My point is if you live there gou can get an early abortion.

Of course, I am for Ireland legalizing abortion for all women. Ithink it is disgusting that rape victims and even health reasons are not exceptions. Fucking Catholic church.

[Milly-Molly-Mandy]

Longskirts-but what if you are, like Savita, too ill too leave the hospital?

Or don't have the money or resources to get to Belfast?

It's not that simple-oh just go to Belfast!

[longskirtlotsakids]

Did you even read my previous post?

[Milly-Molly-Mandy]

Did you even read my previous post?

I must have misunderstood you. I thought you said women could always go to Belfast for an abortion at Marie Stopes if they needed one. I apologise if I misunderstood you. The perils of reading posts while listening to podcasts :)

[Irishy]

The new legislation is targeted precisely at women like savita. The recent inquest into her death revealed that yes, she may have lived if an abortion had been performed on the Monday before she died but what really killed her was medical mismanagement in the days before that. She was not given a broad spectrum antibiotic. Rather, some weak prescription which was equivalent to doing nothing.

[Drina Adams]

The rules in northern Ireland are a lot stricter, so women still tend to go to the mainland as there's a broader approach taken to the need for abortion. If I needed an abortion I'd head to Liverpool over Belfast without question and other women I know are the same.

[longskirtlotsakids]

If I move to Ireland I would smuggle in a bottle of Lutalyse or Regumate. Just rubbing one CC on your skin would induce an abortion.

[Minerva]

It's something. But what happens if you're suicidal and one of the three consultants is anti-choice? 7 days is a long time to wait for a committee decision.

[dora]

That sounds quite similar to the laws we have in New Zealand, where in practice there is abortion on demand. They just pretty much rubber stamp it here.