Is Doug Phillips circumcised?

[Guest Anonymous]

He's deliberately vague so he will have an excuse to personally examine his interns.

[Witsec6]

I am told and have not been a direct witness:

If a physician is not employed to do the circumcision which is now uncommon because many third party insurers no longer want to pay, I am told that most hire a Rabbi to do it. Some of the families actually have a bris, complete with traditional party to which they invite family and fundie friends. You know who some of them are, too, if what I've been told is accurate.

And about Doug... His father was Jewish at the time and did not convert until after Doug was born. I'm sure his Catholic mother didn't mind at the time, and it was part of the typical standard of care for a newborn at the time that Doug was born, too.

Thanks for the info. I think it logical if you're going to do it, to make it a big deal, so I'm not as weirded out by this as I might be if they were having Bar Mitzvah ceremonies or something.

[Witsec6]

Gothard recommends it. It's one of his more controversial positions among Christians because he twists himself into a pretzel trying to get around Paul's explicit statements that circumcision is unprofitable at best and unChristian at worst, e.g. Galatians 5:1-6, and a mark of the Old Covenant which is superceded (which Christians have traditionally interpreted to mean also that baptism has replaced circumcision as a ritual that initiates members into the community). IIRC (no ATI materials at hand), Gothard goes on about its alleged health benefits, and says that all God's OT commands are, if not absolutely required, at the very least better for us physically and at most a matter of obedience even for the Christian which probably has spiritual benefits as well.

Aha! Thanks to you I looked up the article: billgothard.com/news/circumcision

Circumcision of the heart? :?

[Sweetpea1]

I need a couple of these to get that out of my head... :beer: :beer: :beer:

[Kimerical]

This topic...

[notsocommon]

I really hope that circumcision isn't one of the DIY projects that fundie families start doing at home to save money. It's one thing to cut or perm your kid's hair or to make your own bread an laundry detergent, but I really hope they get professionals to snip the boys.

http://sweepingthehome.blogspot.com/201 ... izion.html

Let's hope no one takes it ro realz

[Brainsample]

sweepingthehome.blogspot.com/2010/05/home-circumsizion.html

Let's hope no one takes it ro realz

ETA: This is a spoof, thank God. But with DIY episiotomies here and there, even people you would recognize here on FJ, I would not be at all surprised. And I was going to add that spelling circumcision with a Z makes it say Zion on the end, so that's proof of it's divine nature, too. LOL!

If I were not familiar with this religious movement, I would not believe this to be true. It looks like it has to be a spoof, but you know how it is... This has be documented. Unbelievable, almost.

Home Circumsizion

Many friends have asked me for advice regarding circumcizing their newborns. Circumsizion is the Christian thing to do because the Lord demanded circumsision in the Old Testament on the 8th day. I have done an extensave study of the KJV Bible, and though most of the Old Testement Law doesn't apply to Christians, I have discovered that this one still does. Also, via my own scientific research, I have found cicumsizion is the healthiest choice. It is also something quite simple and anyone can do it in the comfort of they're own home. Doctor's are always trying to make things complicated so they can make more money.

VARY IMPORTENT DISCLAMMER: I shall also add, that, you should ask for God's Blessing and Guidence before you perform a home circumsizion. If you are not a True Christian like me, espeshally if your a stupid Cathlick, get on your knees right now, repent of you're sins, and accept the Lord as your Savier. Come out of the Church of Satin, hence this surgury could be a tragec failure.

HERE'S WHAT YOU WILL NEED:

1. Rubbing alcahol

2. Oragel or Aspercream

3. A steralized kitchen knife (place in boiling water for 5 minutes)

4. Clean towel's

5. Neasporin

6. Band-ades

HERE'S HOW TO DO IT:

1. Remove babies dieper.

2. Gently clean baby's member with alcahol.

3. Apply Oragel or Apercream on baby's member. (this might help numb it a bit)

4. Have your husband or a true Christien friend hold down baby's arms and legs.

5. Using your steralized kitchen knife, vary carefully cut around the baby's fourskin and remove. Be careful not to cut too deap! :)

6. Clean with alcahol again.

7. Apply Neasporin and a Band-ade.

8. Replace dieper.

If you work quickly and have all suppleys ready ahead of time, it will take less than 5 minutes. Your baby may want to be held afterward, but remember, it doesn't really hurt them that bad. Don't let him be too demanding, lest he become spoilt! "Let not thy soul spare for his crying" (Proverbs 19:18)

Notice how there are only 8 steps and you are to do it on the 8th day. God has obviously designed it this way.

Yeah, like the oragel and/or the aspercream step. (Two entirely different drugs, BTW. If I were babe or man, I would definitely not want aspercream on my willie or on my baby's.)

Then there's the grammar and spelling.

Did God demand circumcision (on the eighth day) before or after He created Rock and Roll, ZZ Top, AC/DC, and KISS? Maybe that's also the day He created Neosporin, because He figured out that people needed it?

Half of me is tearing from laughter, but the other half is terrified. How do you hold that knife? Reminds me of Mel Brooks in "Robin Hood: Men in Tights." The sign read "Circumcision Sale! Half off."

[anniebgood]

That site is a parody of Candy Brauer's. It's for laughs. But I wouldn't have put it past Candy to do it to her sons. God only knows what she has done to her daughters brain though.

My son is circumcised because his father is and I personally think they look like fire hoses if they aren't . JMHO though.

[ladypuglover]

Church of satin huh. Is there a church of lace or of polyester? I know there is a churh of glitter as one very nasty fundy blogger is a devoted member there.

[twoleftfeet]

Instead of worrying about his privates take a look at www.guidestar.com and look at World Vision's 990 (it is a tax return for non-profits) if you look Dougie taes a modest salary of $41k. Go down further and the is a grant to World Vision, Inc (for profit) for $300k plus. I guess this is the fund gravy train!!! Man he is good...I am going to open a fundie website and sell something to these fundie fools....Go Dougie...Capitalism and America are great!

[Olivia]

It's an interesting question. I have several fundie relatives who do not eat pork for religious reasons, but I don't know how they feel about circumcision since when they were born/having children it was still the culturally done-deal to circumcise. DH and I don't plan to circ our sons, but it's not like it was even a question if you would or not until recently for most. Something to discuss with them one of these days when we run out of conversation...

[notsocommon]

Huh? Doug is affiliated with World Vision?

[duplessis3]

quibble: a mohel performs the circumcision. A rabbi is not necessarily a mohel, and a mohel is not necessarily a rabbi. Two different trainings.

I'm sure Doug is, just based on when and where he was born.

And I have no idea what homebithing and circumcision have to do with each other. (Some) Jews homebirth, and circumcise their sons. I had a home birth and took my son to the doc two days after his birth. (He isn't circumcized though. )

[thoughtful]

This thread made me need to watch this:

http://www.hulu.com/watch/2323/saturday ... -deluxe-ii

(they made the rabbi/mohel error, too!)

[GenerationCedarchip]

Huh? Doug is affiliated with World Vision?

Since World Vision is actually non-fundie (they're Christian but definitely not like the bloggers we snark on here), I'm guessing that twoleftfeet means Vision Forum.

All those visions get confusing!

[Crackedeggs]

This reminds me of a funny story. My daughter and her first BF were laughing over a silly sounding word, "Smegma" My daughter asked me what it meant. I proceeded to explain to her about foreskins. I also, not realizing how prevalent non-circumscribed males were becoming in this country, said " But you'll probably never see one, I never did, most everybody in this country gets circumscribed"

To which her first serious boyfriend piped up... "I'm Not!"

Yeah.. Her and her friends manage to get me every time.

[Brainsample]

Since World Vision is actually non-fundie (they're Christian but definitely not like the bloggers we snark on here), I'm guessing that twoleftfeet means Vision Forum.

All those visions get confusing!

I looked at the 990 for VFM, and it does list Vision Forum where applicable (I assume), but does not have any listing of World Vision. You can download their submitted tax forms from the aforementioned website.

Doug was paid $45K (that's just the ministry arm), and then there's another line that says $40K which may be an actual payout after benefits or whatever. Howard Phillips is listed as the Vice President which I did not know before I looked at the form earlier this year (so Howard is just as responsible for the garbage that goes on in Doug's name and in that organization as Doug is, IMO). Figure in there that this is only the ministry arm (and not whatever Doug makes under Vision Forum; and I don't know if the Family Integrated Church is listed separately at this point. I know in years past that they were part of VFM.)

And one of the nice things concerning these kinds of things are the perks that one gets. Your travel expenses are paid for, lots of your meals and the food you may purchase for church related functions. We were once invited to a BBQ, and I'm sure that Doug wasn't coughing up the personal funds to feed the group. (We did not have any interest in going, and I boycotted the whole event from which Doug invited all of the attendees.) Doug's housing is paid. I'm sure his costly homeowner's insurance is paid for him, and his taxes, considering that he's not the one who holds title to the home. I wonder if they also pay for at least one of his vehicles or give him some kind of travel allowance for petrol? I'm sure that they pay for his family's travel expenses.

Anyway, from years past, I looked at one form, and the expenses for the organization nearly equaled the revenue raised. One form from years past concerning Scott Brown's work showed that he brought in almost a million dollars through his NCFIC work, but then, he also spent nearly all that in the costs of doing business. You know. Things like taking your family on a free trip to wherever Doug had a fancy to go that year.

[TMS]

This reminds me of a funny story. My daughter and her first BF were laughing over a silly sounding word, "Smegma" My daughter asked me what it meant. I proceeded to explain to her about foreskins. I also, not realizing how prevalent non-circumscribed males were becoming in this country, said " But you'll probably never see one, I never did, most everybody in this country gets circumscribed"

To which her first serious boyfriend piped up... "I'm Not!"

Yeah.. Her and her friends manage to get me every time.

I had never seen one either, but wikipedia satisfied my curiosity.

[defrauding]

I also, not realizing how prevalent non-circumscribed males were becoming in this country, said " But you'll probably never see one, I never did, most everybody in this country gets circumscribed."

Here's a helpful sentence for remembering the difference between circumscribe and circumcise: "Doug likes his women circumscribed and his men circumcised."

[Witsec6]

Here's a helpful sentence for remembering the difference between circumscribe and circumcise: "Doug likes his women circumscribed and his men circumcised."

Cue uncontrollable laughter.

[mnb357]

Crackedeggs,

Love it. Now, question: I'm new to this board and all things ATI/fundie. That said, am I to understand that a leader of one of these churches actually has a say in what you do with a newborn's penis? Do they check? I'd smack my priest in the mouth if he mentioned it, and run like hell out the door.

As for me, my first two boys were circumcised, but youngest wasn't, because he was born in a state where the ob doesn't perform it in the hospital after the birth, the pediatrician performs it in his office. When we showed up for the appointment and were read the risks of infection, etc, I started blanching. Then, they started prepping the restraints. At that point my husband looked ill, and my pediatrician told me that his son has "all his stuff intact" for the very same reason. My husband bundled up our package, said "thank you," and home we went, with "all my son's stuff intact." If he is ever in a situation where anyon can see him change, and they ask why he isn't, he knows to tell them to keep their eyes off his "stuff." Except for a woman...in that case I hope he says something like "the more the better, baby!"

[Cameron]

I have been following Doug Phillips blog for some time and is how I found this site. I believe his father was Jewish so I would guess that he is himself circumcised. I remember that when his last son was born, they had him circumcised so it is likely that all of his sons are too. From his 2003/12/11 blog:

From the bottom of my heart, I give thanks to the Lord for answering my prayers. At 4:35 am, this morning (December 11), God brought forth a son into the Phillips family. He is beautiful. My bride Beall is well. She was courageous and persevering throughout the birth. I can barely believe how blessed we are. He is our seventh child — a son with a head of black hair, who weighs in at seven pounds, fifteen ounces, and measures twenty-one inches. We will announce his name later in the week, probably at the time of his circumcision. Special thanks also go out to our wonderful midwives.

I remember upon first reading the thought of they make you wait a week to do that? I would have thought it more immediate prior to discharge from the hospital...

[Guest Anonymous]

Well they can't do it before discharge from the hospital if the baby was born at home :)

(I don't read them so I don't know if they actually do homebirths...just assuming here)

[Cameron]

I was meaning more of the time frame than place but yeah, you are right lol. I was a hospital administrator's assistant (completed the insurance paperwork) part-time through college and it was normally done on the first or second day after birth so a week just sounded off to me. Jusaism is the eighth day. I was born in Scotland and it's not really done outside of medical necessity there.

[jan9206]

DOUG PHILLIPS IS A TOOL!