Being saved....

[alysee]

How does one get saved? Being Catholic i "believed" in Jesus and I would like to again but there are so many questions that are unanswered that I would like answered, before I happened o it on't be happening anytime soon. Although I think I believe....at least I believe in a guy who preached about equality, peace and love...but the whole dying for our sins and then the whole heaven thing...where is heaven? These questions I had as a child were given child answers but now I know what space and history about, I need adult answers...maybe I shouldn't ask here but what makes you believe?

[salsa]

I'm guessing that since this is in "snark," it's intended to solicit snarky responses? That said, here goes....

How does one get saved? Put oneself in a Tupperware container. Burp a little air out, put freshness in (or something like that). Then again, marinating yourself in salt might do the trick. Mummification works decently, but you tend to be shriveled up after 4,000 years.

But, to answer your questions seriously - I personally don't like the "getting saved" theology. I'm never sure what we're saved for or from. On the superficial level, we're saved from our sins and the fate of eternal damnation in the flames of hell, but as it works out in practice, it seems that so many of those who are saved have sequestered themselves into a metaphorical Tupperware container.

(getting saved always reminds me of my uncle, who, if I pointed out that he had crumbs on his beard, would reply, "I'm saving it for later.")

Perhaps what you seek is the more personal component of believing in a Savior? Am I on the right track?

I don't know that our conventional ideas of heaven and hell are as we picture them. All we know is that there is some sort of eternality spent with God. And, while the Bible (and Jesus) does refer to images such as a lake of fire or "the abyss" (the multi-personed demon, Legion, who went into the herd of swine), hell is being apart from God. It's just that we've come to take literally what I believe were intended as metphors.

[debrand]

How does one get saved? Being Catholic i "believed" in Jesus and I would like to again but there are so many questions that are unanswered that I would like answered, before I happened o it on't be happening anytime soon. Although I think I believe....at least I believe in a guy who preached about equality, peace and love...but the whole dying for our sins and then the whole heaven thing...where is heaven? These questions I had as a child were given child answers but now I know what space and history about, I need adult answers...maybe I shouldn't ask here but what makes you believe?

I was taught several different methods of getting saved. One involved reciting a prayer asking Jesus into your heart.(Whatever that means) A Calvinist told me that meant I was never saved because I had to admit that I was a dirty, lowdown, worthless, rotten sinner and ask Jesus for forgiveness.

Some people really do believe that if you sin(break one of god's rules), you weren't saved and have to start the process again. I've been told that Christ really can't see your sins once you were saved. Both of these views are not mainstream Christianity. Most Christians believe that the Holy Spirit assist them in not sinning. They feel bad or guilty when they do wrong so the Holy SPirit is working.

Catholics(who are Christians) believe that human kind has good in it and that is why they are curious about god. Yes, we are sinful(original sin) but not to the extend that Calvinsit believe. Faith is comprised of actions and belief. You do certain actions, like take the eucharist because you believe. I've always been told that it means that you have an active faith in god.

A Catholic would probably not use the phrase, "I'm saved." However, their beliefs aren't that far off from mainstream MamaJuneBug who is a Lutherian on this board.

If I got any of that wrong, I'm sorry. It has been a long time since I read Christian literature or theology.

[Helena]

Well, an action movie cliche coincides nicely with the bible.

"Save yourselves!". Complete with fear and trembling.

[formergothardite]

The answer depends on who you ask. According to the Calvinist thread some people can't go about being saved because God made them just so he could torture them for an enternity in hell.

[valsa]

maybe I shouldn't ask here but what makes you believe?

I don't.

I was raised as a Christian but once I got to my teens, I realized that I literally could not have faith. I know a few people (most of them here on FJ) who have mature religious beliefs they approach as adults but, from my view, the very basic ability to have faith in something like God or Jesus requires a childlike level of belief that I've never been able to achieve (even when I wanted to)

However, from the Christian point of view I was raised with, believing in God and that Jesus (both as God and the son of God) died to protect you from eternal suffering in hell is enough to "save" you.

[salsa]

Well, I do believe (and I'm not a sock puppet for valsa - I chose my name before I even knew about valsa), but I'm reassessing some parts of my theology.

However, I never did get into the "getting saved" phenomenon. I know it's very real and very important to some, but not everyone embraces the faith that way. I didn't. Neither the promise of Heaven nor the threat of Hell converted me. What did bring me to conversion, however, was seeing how our faith serves the world in the here and now. I don't know what faces me after my death, but I really don't think about it too much.

eta: the promise of Heaven and the threat of Hell have no efffect on someone who doesn't believe in them in as we're taught about them. The understanding of God as infinitely merciful just doesn't jibe with me on the "you didn't say this prayer, so off to an eternity of torture for you!" I will never be able to embrace that part of Christianity.

[aelar]

I'm an atheist, but I think everyone believes in lots of things that take faith, things that aren't empirically true, or at least not easily proven to be.

Not all of these beliefs are healthy or useful. We might believe that we're full of sin, or that people are inherently selfish, or that there is no meaning to our life, or that God is only happy when we submit to our husband, or that we're fat, or lazy, or one of the few that is going to get into Heaven. Whether a belief is healthy or useful hasn't seemed to have a strong correlation with whether that belief is objectively true or not, or provable or not. But it has seemed to me like there IS a strong correlation between belief systems that are healthy, and belief systems that are examined.

As someone who is starting from a place of questions, I think you're on the right track. But the most important question is probably 'what am I looking for when I seek to have belief in Jesus?'. What is missing in your life now that you don't have faith in Catholicism? Do you miss the social life of church? Do you miss the moral guidance of religion? Do you miss the ecstatic connection to something higher and broader than yourself? Do you miss the comfort and safety of a God figure watching over you, or saints to confide in and intercede for you? Do miss feeling like a good person? Do you miss the promise that however bad things are here, they will be better for you after death? Do you miss the beauty of church and ritual?

There are a lot of things that belief in a religion provides (though as a happy atheist, I do believe that you can have all the benefits of religion without having a belief in the supernatural and without subscribing to anyone else's rules for your life). If you can figure out what is most important to you, then maybe you can find a religion that emphasizes those pieces while providing better answers to your questions, or at least that de-emphasizes the need to believe in things you have trouble believing in. Or you can choose to assemble resources that provide what you miss about having faith, but outside of an organized religion.

Jesus as a mythic archetype is very appealing. Regardless of whether he ever existed, or acted in the way that he is described in the bible, let alone all that son-of God stuff, simply seeking to be more Christ-like is all by itself, a great foundation for living your life. But if you need more to feel 'saved', then start by figuring out what that more means to you. And maybe what you feel you need to be saved from.

[kpmom]

I was raised Catholic too, alysee, and never even heard of "getting saved" until I went to a fundy church for a very short period of time in high school.

As Catholics I believe it was a given that we were "saved" if we followed the rules, i.e., Mass on Sundays and Holy Days, confession, communion, last rites, etc.

Fundies and fundy-lites believe you have to pray the sinners prayer and ask Jesus into your heart to be saved. Apparently you can do this on your death bed after leading a horrible life and you'll be just as saved as a clean living Christian.

Honestly, both situations sound so ridiculous to me now as an adult.

[freejoytoo]

I don't believe in God but my Christian friend told me I had to ask God into my heart. I asked what happened if that didn't work and she basically said it was't open enough!

[3_and_counting]

Hey Everyone, this is Kristina. I do still read here but have chosen not to comment due to the donations that someone said would be made in my name to a foundation that I did not support. But I have decided to come back due to this post. I have read the replies and from what I have seen, the real meaning of "being saved" has not been told. I want to share what it means according to the Bible and not just opinions.

We all know the story of Adam and Eve in the garden of Eden and how Eve ate of the forbidden fruit and then offered it to Adam. It was through Adam's disobedience to God's command to not eat the forbidden fruit that sin entered into the world.

Rom 5:12 Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

We all know what sin is, lying, stealing, cheating, disobedience and ect. We know that ALL are guilty of sin.

To be saved you have to be under conviction (definition - be convinced, compelled to admit truth) We all have to come to the realization that we are sinners.

Romans 3:23 For all have sinned, and come short of the glory of God;

Know that without God there is no way you will make it to Heaven on your own by your good works or self righteousness.

Romans 3:10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:

Because of Adam's disobedience we are all sinners and are to suffer the consequences.

Realize what the consequence of sin is.

Romans 6:23 For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

No one can make it to Heaven on their own and escape Hell because of their own merit or good works. God requires perfection. Humans, as well all know are far from perfect and therefore there is no way that we can make it into Heaven no matter how much good we do in our lifetime. But Jesus Christ was born perfect and lived a perfect, sinless life. He was chosen to come and die in our stead so that Heaven could be available for any and all. He died for the sins of the whole world's past, present and future sins.

What Jesus did on the cross was for you and He was raised again on the third day.

John 3:16 For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

I Corinthians 15:4 And that he was buried, and that he rose again the third day according to the scriptures:

You can't just be saved when YOU want to be, it takes God drawing you and being completely convinced of the fact that you are a sinner that is on your way to Hell when you die. The only way to Heaven is through Jesus and what He did for us on the cross when he died. If there is no drawing, there is no salvation.

I don't believe in Calvinism. I do not believe that God would hand pick who is to be saved and who isn't. He gives all an opportunity to come to Him - He refuses none!

I hope this helps clear it up on what salvation is. Its simple. We are sinners, Jesus paid the price for our sin...all we have to do it repent and believe.

[Guest Anonymous]

Love it when the "You're All Going to Hell" title is so appropriate to a first post.... :lol:

BTW, who is Kristina? I'm guessing the donations were to something like Planned Parenthood? :P

[valsa]

I hope this helps clear it up on what salvation is.

Nope, it only clears up what you believe salvation is.

I hope you can see the difference.

[debrand]

I have read the replies and from what I have seen, the real meaning of "being saved" has not been told.

Kristina, I don't see how what you wrote is different than what I wrote. The only difference is that you wrote from the prespective of a believer and I wrote from the view of an outsider. However, my post seems to have included beliefs that are similar to your own.

[Clementine]

We do have some Pentecostals here in Sweden and some American influenced mega-churches with their offspring congregations and they are the only churches where I have heard that people are "saved".

That usually means that they will publically make some hoopla about it so they can take the stage and witness about it later.

It seems to be very important to them to publically talk about how they went from sinners to "saved" and the moment they "Met Jesus".

The rest of us just... do the Confirmation at 15 and keep our fait to ourself - even the Christians who really believe in God and Jesus and the rest of it and go to church.

[debrand]

Nope, it only clears up what you believe salvation is.

I hope you can see the difference.

A lot of Christians are in denial about the fact that reading the bible can produce so many different views on something as simple as how to become a member of their faith.

[formergothardite]

Here is a link for Universal Reconciliation, what is more what I believe.

http://www.growthingod.org.uk/unirec.htm

[theologygeek]

Kristina, I don't know who you are, but that is your view on being saved, not necessarily Jesus' view. There is too much in the bible that does not support faith alone. Matt 25 for starters.

[formergothardite]

Pretty sure it is Kristina from Kristina's Keepsakes.

ETA: And the Bible can be used to support Calvinism and Universal Reconciliation, Kristina.

[doggie]

Is getting saved the same as becoming a self righteous asshole? What I get a kick is that if people don't belong to the same church then they are not constricted saved. If people can't agree on what is being saved or born again how can anyone really know?

[AudreyE]

I personally do not believe in a Christian God, so being saved is just a myth to me, but...

I've always thought there is a conflict in the Bible between the gospels and the epistles. At least, there is the way I read them. Jesus seems to say that how you act is pretty darn important to being saved, and most people are going to fail to reach heaven, because they will not be willing to make the sacrifices necessary to truly follow God. On the other hand, the epistles preach faith over acts, and that seems to be more popular for obvious reasons. If I followed the faith, I'd be inclined to listen to Jesus. Of course, you can argue that someone like Paul does both (i.e. advocates faith and grace *while* giving up his wealth and social status to live 100% for Jesus).

[AudreyE]

A lot of Christians are in denial about the fact that reading the bible can produce so many different views on something as simple as how to become a member of their faith.

And there were many more views during the first few *centuries* of Christianity. They eventually got weeded out and called heresy, because the people in power chose the perspective that's taken as dogma today. Weren't so in the beginning.

[theologygeek]

I hope this helps clear it up on what salvation is. Its simple. We are sinners, Jesus paid the price for our sin...all we have to do it repent and believe.

I can't stand the KJ bible, but it's clear here too: "For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: 43I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not. 44Then shall they also answer him, saying, Lord, when saw we thee an hungred, or athirst, or a stranger, or naked, or sick, or in prison, and did not minister unto thee? 45Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say unto you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of the least of these, ye did it not to me. 46And these shall go away into everlasting punishment: but the righteous into life eternal. "

[3_and_counting]

My post was no to condemn, it was to explain. Someone asked what it was to be saved so I told what the Bible says about it, not my opinion.

If you read the Bible in its entirety you will see that it doesn't teach calvinism but a whosoever will gospel.

[formergothardite]

And there are many people who have studied the Bible front to back and disagree with you. What you presented was your opinion of what the Bible said, the link I provided was my opinion of what the Bible said.