Salvation Army Shelter Turns family away for stupid rule

[PJmom]

This is a local story for me. I read a follow up article saying the shelter has now changed their policies to prevent this from happening again.

[Mecca]

Because you can't. Because it's not.

Go ahead. Tell me how I'm wrong.

See, here's the thing. You can't refute the argument, so you just attack the person. This makes you no different than most of the people you profess to hate. Good job.

I'll wait. Let's see your scintillating point and counterpoint.

I will tell you that you are wrong.

Did you poll every protestor in Ferguson on whether they believe every.single. police officer in the nation is horrible? I dont believe I have seen anyone, including the poster you just barked at, claim that every cop sucks and must be hated. And please spare us the "refute the argument, attack the person" claim when you had no problem making a very broad judgement on the people of Ferguson.

The issues in Ferguson are deep and complicated and cannot be erased or trivialized because a few cops in Johnson City did a good thing. To compare the two stories is ludicrous. And before you start spouting off about stereotypes and cop-haters, maybe you need to reflect on why you always seem to make statements regarding people of a certain race. You are not coming off good here. Just sayin'....

[TXGirlInAMaterialWorld]

Very sad that any Mom would be told that her family can't stay in a homeless shelter because of her teen son. It's crazy that some cities are tearing down abandoned homes because they don't want blight and then there are not enough homeless shelters for families.

[JillyO]

Because you can't. Because it's not.

Go ahead. Tell me how I'm wrong.

See, here's the thing. You can't refute the argument, so you just attack the person. This makes you no different than most of the people you profess to hate. Good job.

I'll wait. Let's see your scintillating point and counterpoint.

Actually, no. You do not make an argument, so there's absolutely nothing to refute here. Police did something nice here = there's no reason to protest police violence, racial profiling, murdering of an unarmed teenager is NOT an argument. Sorry to disappoint.

The only reason I'm answering to your comment at all is to say that I certainly have not professed to hate anyone, so I'm not sure what you're trying to insinuate.

[August]

Very sad that any Mom would be told that her family can't stay in a homeless shelter because of her teen son. It's crazy that some cities are tearing down abandoned homes because they don't want blight and then there are not enough homeless shelters for families.

I think you'll find those things occur n two different places. If there were any jobs in Detroit, people would live there. I doubt there's any shortage of housing in Detroit.

[Mama Mia]

I think you'll find those things occur n two different places. If there were any jobs in Detroit, people would live there. I doubt there's any shortage of housing in Detroit.

Although the estimates vary widely ( homeless counts are notoriously inaccurate) there are somewhere in the neighborhood of 20,000 officially homeless people every night in Detroit. That's according to the federal government. The state estimates closer to 90,000.

Oddly it's really freaking hard to find their number of shelter beds....but doing a quick count off listed shelters and the number of beds ( also a very inaccurate way to estimate beds) -- there seem to be somewhere around 1,500 -3,000 shelter beds.

And their Section 8 list is closed. Places with extremely high unemployment, empty buildings, high fore closures etc. are often very hard hit by homelessness. It seems counterintuitive - because housing is so cheap. But cheap isn't free. And if someone has no income, or virtually none, they still won't be able to rent a place.

[DGayle]

In this case, it makes even less sense. In shelters with separate men's and women's sides, I can see the issue with teenage boys who might be uncomfortable (or make others uncomfortable) on the women's side but aren't old enough to be alone on the men's side*. However, in this case the FATHER was there too; presumably he would have been with his son?

*I'm not saying they should be kicked out of the shelter, of course, just that there might have to be a 3rd option.

The boy wasn't old enough for the men's side. That's the big catch. Too old for the women's side, not old enough for the men's.

This doesn't even start to touch on where transmen and transwomen can go.

[DGayle]

The people in those areas are very fortunate not to live in one of the places where it takes years to get on a years long waiting list for housing assistance, like Seattle, Austin, Denver, Baltimore and Boulder

My area opened the list by lottery earlier this year, for the first time in several years. You could enter the lottery to get on the list to apply. Everyone got into the lottery. Some were lucky enough to get on the list. The list is just to get an application.

I think the problem would be solved if people who owned vacant units that weren't being used as second homes were fined for every month over three months that the unit stays wasted.

[Jana814]

This is a local story for me. I read a follow up article saying the shelter has now changed their policies to prevent this from happening again.

Glad they changed their policies.

[Antimony]

It really does seem like some kind of alternative arrangements could be made for boys that age, especially since this kid's father with present but then again, maybe the shelter had no real way to verify that was actually the father.

Molestation should not be occurring in shelters, is that naive of me to think that? :( Is it really that difficult to provide a safe shelter?

I wish all those people rioting about Ferguson would pause a moment to reflect on that it was COPS who put up their own money to shelter this family. But this family is probably not the politically correct color for that to count or matter, the stereotypes of cop-haters shall remain as is.

1) they don't have any way to prove it's the mother either so that doesn't make anybsense.

2) Institutionalized racism and police brutality isn't fixed because some cops did a good thing. Fact is, cops get away with too much and not enough people are watching the watchmen. Cops also have higher rates of abusers and domestically violent, as well as covering for fellow cops.

I hope these protests do lead to cameras on cops and dismantling of corrupt departments. That's not cop hate, that's people wanted to be protected.

[nelliebelle1197]

1) they don't have any way to prove it's the mother either so that doesn't make anybsense.

2) Institutionalized racism and police brutality isn't fixed because some cops did a good thing. Fact is, cops get away with too much and not enough people are watching the watchmen. Cops also have higher rates of abusers and domestically violent, as well as covering for fellow cops.

I hope these protests do lead to cameras on cops and dismantling of corrupt departments. That's not cop hate, that's people wanted to be protected.

Don't even bother answering this one. She does not come back after someone tells her how racist, classist or homophobic she is. The board is littered with her insights on how homosexuality is a sin, poor people should not be allowed to have more than one kid, and she wished she could have homeschooled rather than sending her children to school with poor black kids. She can't really defend most of her statements so she does not even try.

[formergothardite]

Because you can't. Because it's not.

Go ahead. Tell me how I'm wrong.

See, here's the thing. You can't refute the argument, so you just attack the person. This makes you no different than most of the people you profess to hate. Good job.

I'll wait. Let's see your scintillating point and counterpoint.

I want to start quoting your words back to you every time you enter a discussion about homosexuality because it is pretty damn clear from every thread you have been on where that subject comes up that you cannot refute any of the arguments or defend your stance. So you resort to passively aggressively attacking other posters and then run from the thread. You are no better than any of the people you criticize. :lol:

[nelliebelle1197]

I want to start quoting your words back to you every time you enter a discussion about homosexuality because it is pretty damn clear from every thread you have been on where that subject comes up that you cannot refute any of the arguments or defend your stance. So you resort to passively aggressively attacking other posters and then run from the thread. You are no better than any of the people you criticize. :lol:

I have really started to adore you lately.

[NoneandDoneinCali]

I'm really glad to hear that the shelter has changed their policies! I think it was an oversight, really, As other posters have said, most shelters are segregated by sex (or gender, really), especially those focused on victims of DV. That makes sense - unfortunately, an adult or nearly adult male could be incredibly triggering to a woman escaping DV (and vice versa, though unfortunately I don't know of any exclusively battered men's shelters). However, what was weird to me is that this particular shelter was co-ed, with the adult male father there. Just really weird. I'm glad these cops were able to help.

**This thread has nothing to do with Ferguson, and that situation is far too complicated to cover in a snark thread anyways, so not going to touch that.

[formergothardite]

I have really started to adore you lately.

:embarrassed:

The thing about BrownieMomma is that so many of her posts are completely normal so most people don't realize that they are dealing with poster who makes homophobic and racists remarks. And it doesn't matter if someone took the time to carefully explained why her remark in this thread was racists, because she would just stick her fingers in her ears and scream "LALALALALA". She is much like Lori in that she is never open to learning, or at least doesn't appear to be on certain subjects. I was half expecting her to post that quote Eleanor Roosevelt. That seems to be her go to reply for when she can't defend her stance on a subject and someone doesn't sugar coat how awful her remarks are.

[Mama Mia]

I'm really glad to hear that the shelter has changed their policies! I think it was an oversight, really, As other posters have said, most shelters are segregated by sex (or gender, really), especially those focused on victims of DV. That makes sense - unfortunately, an adult or nearly adult male could be incredibly triggering to a woman escaping DV (and vice versa, though unfortunately I don't know of any exclusively battered men's shelters). However, what was weird to me is that this particular shelter was co-ed, with the adult male father there. Just really weird. I'm glad these cops were able to help.

**This thread has nothing to do with Ferguson, and that situation is far too complicated to cover in a snark thread anyways, so not going to touch that.

It would be nice if it was an oversight, but it's a really, really common problem with emergency shelters.

On the surface it does seem strange that it's a mother/father family with other children and the teen boy still wasn't allowed -- but in actuality that's an average set-up for most mass emergency shelters. There will be a dorm type facility for adult males and another dorm type facility for women and children. And for " children" the cut off age for boys is often 12. It's a set up that also excludes Single fathers and their children.

Actual churches are often set up very well for mass shelter that includes a variety of family structures. Many of them have multiple rooms used for classes that can be divided up by age and/ or sex and/or family type.

Another issue though is that if you have multiple rooms you need multiple monitors - especially if you have separate sleeping areas for teens. And more monitors equals more money.

Sorry to be such a wonk - just a topic I actually know about. And the throw away teen boy issue is close to my heart.

[nelliebelle1197]

:embarrassed:

The thing about BrownieMomma is that so many of her posts are completely normal so most people don't realize that they are dealing with poster who makes homophobic and racists remarks. And it doesn't matter if someone took the time to carefully explained why her remark in this thread was racists, because she would just stick her fingers in her ears and scream "LALALALALA". She is much like Lori in that she is never open to learning, or at least doesn't appear to be on certain subjects. I was half expecting her to post that quote Eleanor Roosevelt. That seems to be her go to reply for when she can't defend her stance on a subject and someone doesn't sugar coat how awful her remarks are.

Yeah, you know, I am thinking she puts a lot of us on ignore. Pretty soon she will have enough people she has to run away from that she will just have her own thread where she can talk to herself about all the lazy black people, sinful gays and dirty overbreeding poor people who are ruining her America.

[Bethella]

It would be nice if it was an oversight, but it's a really, really common problem with emergency shelters.

On the surface it does seem strange that it's a mother/father family with other children and the teen boy still wasn't allowed -- but in actuality that's an average set-up for most mass emergency shelters. There will be a dorm type facility for adult males and another dorm type facility for women and children. And for " children" the cut off age for boys is often 12. It's a set up that also excludes Single fathers and their children.

Actual churches are often set up very well for mass shelter that includes a variety of family structures. Many of them have multiple rooms used for classes that can be divided up by age and/ or sex and/or family type.

Another issue though is that if you have multiple rooms you need multiple monitors - especially if you have separate sleeping areas for teens. And more monitors equals more money.

Sorry to be such a wonk - just a topic I actually know about. And the throw away teen boy issue is close to my heart.

The shelter I volunteer at doesn't allow anyone under 18. If families need help there are a limited number of vouchers for hotel rooms available plus access to the shelters services (social worker, meals, etc)

[Mecca]

Yeah, you know, I am thinking she puts a lot of us on ignore. Pretty soon she will have enough people she has to run away from that she will just have her own thread where she can talk to herself about all the lazy black people, sinful gays and dirty overbreeding poor people who are ruining her America.

And don't forget the whole "Adrian Peterson had his heart in the right place" when he beat his child nonsense.

[formergothardite]

And don't forget the whole "Adrian Peterson had his heart in the right place" when he beat his child nonsense.

Ugh. I had forgotten that. She is clearly just going to stick to ignoring this thread which is her typical reaction when she can't defend what she writes.

Back to homeless shelters. I was looking at the ones in my area and most of them said that there is typically long waiting lists so to call ahead before showing up. That does not seem very practical for a suddenly homeless family or person. But at the same time I understand that the shelters have limited resources so they can't help everyone who shows up.