Why ham and his debate was not a good idea

[doggie]

I said this would cause him to gain supporters and here it is the ark playground that was dead in the water is now getting funded again.

http://m.apnews.com/ap/db_289563/conten ... d=bCimQwR3

[susykt4]

Wow. I knew there had to be something huge in this for Ken Ham. Especially when I watched the debate and it was actually fair with a real moderator. Obviously, no one on either side was going to budge a millimeter in their polar opposite beliefs, so Ham had to have a reason.

I was reading about the Ark park a couple months ago and it seemed impossible that they would ever break ground. They were nowhere near raising the funds needed and under original plans, it should have been completed (can't remember) in 2013 or 2014. I love Bill Nye, but I bet he's feeling like an idiot right now. Outsmarted by the craziest Young Earth Creationist there is...

[debrand]

I think that Bill Nye was correct in debating. So, Ham gets his stupid Ark thing launched. In the United States there are a large minority who believe in creationism. Those people vote and that should frighten all of us. This isn't just an American problem. The United States has a large military and people in other countries have a right to be concerned about the fact that such a powerful country believes that snakes talked.

Once the museum opens it should be mocked often and in as many online places as possible. People's minds do change but it takes a long time to change their minds.

[Loveday]

$73 million for a wooden ark.

I don't want to think about all the good that money could do if it were put to use actually following Jesus's precepts. :?

[docmom]

I think that Bill Nye was correct in debating. So, Ham gets his stupid Ark thing launched. In the United States there are a large minority who believe in creationism. Those people vote and that should frighten all of us. This isn't just an American problem. The United States has a large military and people in other countries have a right to be concerned about the fact that such a powerful country believes that snakes talked.

Once the museum opens it should be mocked often and in as many online places as possible. People's minds do change but it takes a long time to change their minds.

I agree we need to stop pretending these are a small minority of idiots and thus they can't really do any harm. We can't stay silent. The stakes are too high.

[susykt4]

I still think there's a huge difference between believing in Creationism and believing in Young Earth Creationism. I think Creationists are much more likely to believe in at least some aspects of science and some can even combine science-based origins with their bible-based creation. Creationists don't necessarily take the Genesis account literally. YEC terrifies me because my entire extended family on both sides are fundamental Christians and a lot of them are moving toward YEC beliefs. These are not stereotypical trailer trash hillbillies. My family members include well-respected surgeons, many master's and higher college degrees, all upper-middle class raised with at least some real college education for both men and women. Their argument is that if they are going to believe in God and in a strict interpretation of the bible, a literal interpretation of Genesis is the only way they can believe. If you argue ice and fossil layers or tree rings or carbon dating or developed civilizations that existed more than 4-6000 years ago, they just feel sorry for your stupidity in believing in "man's theories" and then they pray for your doomed soul. I find it horrifying that they can live in such denial.

Ken Ham already has his Disney quality museum, I don't care if he builds his stupid ark. I enjoyed the debate as much as anyone, and I've always liked Bill Nye, but I'm still going to laugh that he's going to be credited with the Ark park's existence for a long time to come.

[infooverload]

I have mixed feelings about these debates. On the one hand feeding the coffers of Ken Ham just infuriates me beyond anything, but on the other this gives people a look inside what science actually states and not what Ken Ham tells them it states. We have to remember the debate may have planted a mustard seed of doubt into peoples heads. These doubts may radically transform who they are many years from now. After all look at how many people in the atheist community used to be fundamentalist in nature. I think how religion transforms itself within the next 25 years will be interesting. There use to be denomations, then they went out of favor. Then the mega church "non denominationals" took off, but they are declining due to people feeling they are just too big business with their money going into political causes. People also do not feel the same need to use the church to establish social circles like they did in the past. The whole thing is rather an interesting social study when looking at it objectively.

[redcurls]

The main reason the park is now fully funded is not actually because of the debate. The City of Williamstown has offered up a huge chunk of change, in some form that I can't remember right now. People are pissed. We don't want this ridiculous park in our area. It's small and quiet. While we could use some economic stimulus, this is not the way to bring it about. Downtown Williamstown used to be full of small local shops and it is basically dead now. The park won't stimulate that growth, but it will fuck with property values and bring in some wacko tourists.

[Cleopatra7]

There was a post on SSB several days after the debate, and the general consensus among the commentators was that it was good that Hamm was out there preaching the gospel to the heathen. It was never Hamm's intent to debate the science of evolution or even adhere to the debate guidelines, he just wanted to preach. The same thing happened when the Rational Response Team debated Kirk Cameron and Ray Comfort. This is why these kinds of debates are a waste of time, because the religious party never intends to debate in any sense of the term.

[Nobodysdoormat]

I think these debates are important. A lot of people simply believe what the people around them believe until it is bluntly shown to them what it is exactly that they are agreeing to. Seeing a big ark built will not bring in more believers but it may warm many religious people to avoid the fundies.