The Truth About Ruth - Part 2 - Merge

[AKay]

I never knew that this person invented the sin in the camp story. Shame on them. Josh was only a teenager, even if he grew up to be a smug asshat, he really didnt deserve that.

This surprised me. I've seen that rumor repeated so many times on this site that I just eventually assumed the source had to be multiple people and/or a real, verified person, since a lot of people seemed to be treating it as the truth.

Now I'm especially irritated at this scammer for making me feel bad for Josh, ugh.

[apple1]

...*and fairly secretive on some levels -- you weren't supposed to share materials with people unless they went to all the seminars first. When my mom left fundamentalism she sold our Wisdom Booklets on Ebay or something, which as a HUGE no-no...

(I realize this is mostly OT to this thread, but...) The bolded is definitely true. Neither I nor any of my relatives have ever been ATI, but in the past I have been a member of 2 separate (relatively mainline) churches where church leadership (pastor and a handful of other families) got heavily involved in ATI. Most church members did not realize this at the time, some still don't get the connection, because NEVER, not once, was the ATI involvement discussed with the church, not even with the deacon board. There were mentions of taking "vacation" weeks to go to "home schooling conferences" (that was the way the whole thing was mentioned, just like the home schooling conference references on 19KAC) and mentions of "falling into the world's trap" of beliefs about limiting numbers of children. After the fact, and having researched much about ATI by way of the internet, I realize that a huge bunch of ATI stuff was taught from the pulpit and in the small-group classes, possibly the most blatant being the distorted Gothard teachings on grace (which are ridiculously and blatantly opposite to traditional Christian teachings about grace).

End result: 2 separate (smaller but relatively mainline denomination) churches were actually destroyed by this crap. The good: Camouflaged ATI crap (CULT CULT CULT CULT CULT) is no longer being taught in two regular churches. The bad: Numerous individuals, and families, were injured by the related spiritual abuse.

Now: Back to your regularly scheduled programming...

[mrs]

This surprised me. I've seen that rumor repeated so many times on this site that I just eventually assumed the source had to be multiple people and/or a real, verified person, since a lot of people seemed to be treating it as the truth.

Now I'm especially irritated at this scammer for making me feel bad for Josh, ugh.

I know! This is the last thing I thought would happen when reading this thread. I also feel sad that Josh had rumors spread about him when he was still a minor.

I am happy we can now talk openly about Ruth. I know I was scarred to bring up anything doubting Ruth here for awhile. I hope we can use this as a lesson.

Good job everyone!

[debrand]

This is part of what made "Ruth" believable to me. She had supposedly been vetted by Vyckie, Alecto, and Creaky Steel. I'm not sure how they were duped, but I have to admit I'm sorta curious. How did she convince them, while still obviously lying?

Perhaps they wanted to believe in her so they did? I'm curious how they were duped also but I wonder if it was just a case of seeing what they wanted and ignoring their doubts.

Although I had doubts about Ruth, I also have a lot of internal self doubts so I didn't trust my own feelings. I've tried to stay off threads about her because I felt uncomfortable with my own discomfort. Also, I really wanted Ruth's story to be true.

I wonder if Ruth used information from this site to help her make her character more believable?

[nokidsmom]

I think its possible that "Ruth" has done this before and will do this again-these kind of scammers arent going to quit just because they were outed once. I bet we dont hear a resolution to this, the blog shuts and she isnt heard from again, but then she creates a new identity, new blog, joins new forums....shes probably aware of this by now, and is hiding out watching TLC doing research and trying to decide on a new lifestyle she can adopt.

I never knew that this person invented the sin in the camp story. Shame on them. Josh was only a teenager, even if he grew up to be a smug asshat, he really didnt deserve that.

It appears that she knows how to appeal to different types of "audiences". Don't doubt that this won't stop her, it hasn't before, nor who knows how many other personas she has created out there.

That's something about the "sin in the camp" story. No fan of Josh, but that is really a shame to do that to him.

[Ralar]

I also think that Ruth contacted the sister of a member of FJ to get legal advice regarding the sister's pregnancy. At least that's what she said. Was there any truth to it all?

I recall that "sister" posted here offering to connect "Ruth" with her attorney-sister. That poster MUST be one of "Ruth's" socks. Has anyone looked at/for that post?

[mausi]

Perhaps they wanted to believe in her so they did? I'm curious how they were duped also but I wonder if it was just a case of seeing what they wanted and ignoring their doubts.

Although I had doubts about Ruth, I also have a lot of internal self doubts so I didn't trust my own feelings. I've tried to stay off threads about her because I felt uncomfortable with my own discomfort. Also, I really wanted Ruth's story to be true.

I wonder if Ruth used information from this site to help her make her character more believable?

I never got into the *Ruth* (lol) saga, so I am only venturing a guess based on what I have 'gleaned' from post-blow-up pages of the original thread and this thread:: but, I would be surprised if she didn't. Very surprised.

I also find it interesting that she seems to have loosely based at least some of her story from (or drawn inspiration from...) a family the board doesn't follow. That aspect was well done and suggests to me either complete dumb luck or intensive research (of both this board and the fundie blogosphere).

[theCR]

So has she contacted anyone since the truth came out?

[Curious]

Here is my one frustration. I am now fully convinced that RR is Possummommy/jhawksgirl1/Pennmommy. (No need for the admins to confirm or deny.) Most importantly, she will do this again. If individual members here should see RR like posters on other sites, we can alert the Admins. Could FJ Admins to share the IP and other info with Admins on other sites with impunity? Or not? What about law enforcement? A no answer is OK, I'll just still feel frustrated. :)

I would have to confer with the rest of the TT for a 100% sure answer, but my initial reaction to this is we would not release actual IP addresses simply to another Admin on a site. We would be willing to talk to them and help them in ways that don't violate our own ToU, of course.

We will cooperate with any law enforcement investigations fully, of course. This is also spelled out in our ToU, so we are covered there (even though it should be common sense that you'd cooperate with law enforcement officials).

[J'ean Skirt]

Odds, can you get space at Reddit? They love a good Dox'ing over there and have no problem giving the finger to laws concerning outing people committing crimes and scams.

Doxing is one of the few offenses on Reddit that will get you banned.

[Curious]

I was doing some googleing today, and I found this from Princess Jo's blog

http://princessjo1988.blogspot.com/2010 ... today.html

In short, someone left a comment on her blog in 2010, when she began to question Ruth. Does the comment below sound like RR to anyone else?

I'd like to see the IP address that comment was sent from ;)

[flyawaystray]

What was the straw that broke the camels back? I've only followed Ruth a little bit.

I feel so sorry for anyone who has donated money. It's nice to know that there are people on here who are willing to help, though.

Mary/Ruth is probably going to move on and try to scam other people, sadly. Could her blog at least get shut down?

[becky4201]

This probably isn't the place to ask this question, please forgive me, I'm new! What exactly is Chatter? :shifty:

[Curious]

No. As recently as the 42-page thread that morphed into the exposure, a couple of people were clearly hushed for questioning - even slightly - the twisted ovary tale. And none of it has anything to do with new or old regimes.

And the bolded above is really sort of telling me that I should shut up now.

I think Palimpest is referring to letting go of the past in terms of board culture. Not in regard to RR.

[Fundylicious]

I feel hesitant to post this, because I have no links and can barely remember it, it was 3 laptops ago. Around 2006 maybe? I don't know if fj existed then, but I didn't know of it if it did. I have been Fundy- following a long time, since moving to the deep south and starting to home school in 2004. A vision forum catalog given to me was the catalyst. I made an association matrix even of Phillips, Wilson, hslda people, politicians- I was very appalled at how they tied into the GOP.Dominionist, reco structionists, rushdooney...a rabbit hole of garbage. Anyway, a little background. I rarely post here but have been reading since inception, along with most other Fundy following blogs and places. I've never read gomi, though.

I found a reference to Josh as having some sexual sin (I will not go into what) on a gothard message board, buried deep in a thread. Years and years ago. I think this was around the time of the first TLC specials, no show yet. Was that Ruth? Maybe. I have no idea, I could probably never find it again. But I doubt it, I do not think this particular rumor is unfounded.

Please delete this if it is not appropriate.

[Carla Bruni]

For those who are playing along at home: if your google-fu leads you to a name, please be mindful of the fact that there is likely an innocent person you will find with a very similar name whose reputation may be damaged by public doxxing. I fell down the same rabbit hole with a few fellow FJers here, sadly, and spent hours tracking leads on a person who now looks to be completely uninvolved, based on public record research in the jurisdiction in question.

Public records for the real "Ruth" appear to show motive, which is money.

[VooDooChild]

The second bolded sentence seems somewhat contradictory. Did I piss you off too with my Pollyanna-ish comment? I can be annoying like that. Sorry.

As to my comment on the synopsis. I hate to think how many hours Oddeverything put into that brilliant post so I was reluctant to ask her to put much more effort into it. I repeat, it is damning as it stands. In my opinion people are more likely to read and retain a shorter document that focuses on the main points that a massive dissertation detailing minutia. The shorter document is stronger.

If you want to uncover more contradictions and ask her to add them, please go ahead. Again, no-one needs my permission, I just expressed my opinion. :D

Palimpest,

Just to clarify...I take no offense to your reply to my post. I was just hesitant to say anything based on the pile-ons pre-Alectogate, which is in the not too distant past (and, apparently, bothered me more than I thought). Things have been more sane and enjoyable here, lately. But I realized RR was a popular fundie here and I didn't want to cause a stir based on just my feelings, and being that I was too lazy to go try to dig up solid evidence.

[PokaDot]

I feel hesitant to post this, because I have no links and can barely remember it, it was 3 laptops ago. Around 2006 maybe? I don't know if fj existed then, but I didn't know of it if it did. I have been Fundy- following a long time, since moving to the deep south and starting to home school in 2004. A vision forum catalog given to me was the catalyst. I made an association matrix even of Phillips, Wilson, hslda people, politicians- I was very appalled at how they tied into the GOP.Dominionist, reco structionists, rushdooney...a rabbit hole of garbage. Anyway, a little background. I rarely post here but have been reading since inception, along with most other Fundy following blogs and places. I've never read gomi, though.

I found a reference to Josh as having some sexual sin (I will not go into what) on a gothard message board, buried deep in a thread. Years and years ago. I think this was around the time of the first TLC specials, no show yet. Was that Ruth? Maybe. I have no idea, I could probably never find it again. But I doubt it, I do not think this particular rumor is unfounded.

Please delete this if it is not appropriate.

I remember that old message board. I went to it once. I doubt that was ruth.

IMO, ruth pretended to add credibility to that story.

[Queen Of Hearts]

While people are comparing writing styles, has anyone compared RR to writing in the multi-part story about a girl who was raised fundy and supposedly got out? I don't remember the link but I think it was a 10 part story. It seems that every cliche' bad thing a fundy parent could do to a kid was done to this girl and her siblings. Now I am NOT saying this person is RR, or even a fake at all, but it was a story that sort of pinged my fake-dar at the time I read it (as did RR) because of the extreme amount of bad things happening.

[LucySnowe]

Wow, who the heck is "Tracey Seth"? She's RR's number one fangirl all over the comments of that most recent blog entry (30 June). And yes, I get that she could be RR herself.

Becky4201 - chatter is one of the other forums (this is Quiver Full of Snark, and that is Quiver Full of Chatter). You can only see it when you have made 75 posts.

[Curious]

Selfishly, that would mean long-time lurkers like me would miss out on knowing what happens next.

Just a shot in the dark, but I'm guessing there are more than a few current fundie/ATI people who secretly read here because they are starting to have their doubts about the movement, but who are not yet at a stage when they would post. For their sakes, mostly, I think this needs to be kept either in a public area of the board where they have the best chance of being able to see it, or at least in Snark where registered members can read it without having had to make multiple posts.

Also, presumably being put on a JTTH does not prevent RR being able to read Chatter anyway - unless I have that wrong.

You can't read Chatter (and a few other forums) when you are on a JTTH.

[uber frau]

I went off on down a bit of a rabbit hole with the Tracey Seth. Apparently (I'm not sure whether or not to put that in inverted commas) she had a baby with died soon after birth from Hyperplastic Left Heart Syndrome, then 18 months later had a baby with sacrococcygeal teratoma. I was pretty sure it was 'RR' laying the groundwork for another con job but then I did a bit more googling and found her photobucket. Her photos seem to support her story-the same people appear in them consistently over a fairly long period of time, the pic of both babies seem to be legit. I'm not exactly going to be sending her any tip money anytime soon, but I don't think it's a scam. Anything is possible but if it is a scam, it's a whole lot more sophisticated the last one(s). It would have been years in the making.

[rward]

This thread from the yuku board was linked to in the previous RR post.

http://freejinger.yuku.com/topic/1248/W ... eAgkjusjTo

The more support she gets on there (I've donated to the tip jar a couple of times, I know medical expenses can be a bear when you're a student) the better she 'looks' up against him. Ruth, I hope you've informed as many RL people as possible about this.

I really doubt this was RR's first time at the races. She was damn good at scamming.

[Curious]

I hope that this information somehow will reach PrincessJo - I am not sure if she is a member here anymore.

She got a lot of sh*t when she questioned Ruth and I know that she recieved some horrible PM's or e-mails accusing her of horrible things. Three years later, now we know that her doubts were legitimate.

I also wonder what happened with "Ruth's" claims that she had revealed her true identity to Vyckie from NLQ. I would love to hear Vyckie's story.

I also think that Ruth contacted the sister of a member of FJ to get legal advice regarding the sister's pregnancy. At least that's what she said. Was there any truth to it all?

It feels so surreal and almost impossible to write about Ruth and Rachel without adding "" around their names. They never existed and we have no idea who is behind it all.

I am very much looking forward to reading what Oddeverything has found. Can't wait.

Princessjo is still an active member here. I believe she is going through some real life stuff right now, but she does actively read. I always felt sorry for how much crap she took over this, so I hope she and also Red Headed Skeptic (who I believe left during the Yuku days) are feeling vindicated now. I wonder if jo is still in contact with RHS and cant let her know.

[CallmeChaCha]

The strange thing, to me, is that so many of us felt something was “off†with the RR blog, but, at least for me, couldn’t really put our fingers on what the “off†thing was. I read the RR blog after reading a few threads in FJ, where some posters seemed to express some doubt without actually saying they doubted the RR blog (e.g., when people said “yeah, after x,y,z things happening to her, I could see why people would question her†but then they never said they doubted). I went in reading the blog with a bias. I agreed with people who didn’t believe that many bad things could happen to one person, but that’s actually why I read the fucking thing, to figure it out for myself. The end was, I don’t believe her, but I really, really, really want to because what a great story. Hell, I even did my own research wherein I searched the College Navigator website to see what universities in California offered a degree with the word “library†in it. Turns out, no public four-year universities offered such a degree for undergrads, only graduate degrees. Giving RR the benefit of the doubt, I figured by the time I did the search the degree was no longer offered and she was one of the last students to complete the degree in her school before the program was completely dissolved. Except that feeling lasted about a week and I went back to my doubting and figuring eventually some truth would come out. I’m glad that’s finally happened but I’m angry that I almost believed her. However, as others have said, I’m glad to see that not all humans are as vile as the person behind RR and that there are a lot of you that are still very caring and compassionate when you see others need help.

Anyway, I just needed to get that off my chest.