Unanticipated gender roles?

[YPestis]

The thread on that stupid congressman who wanted children to be taught "proper" gender roles gave me the idea for this thread.

All this talk about gender roles, even in 2013 made me think of how many women I know who ended up NOT in the place they thought they were going to be. I knew two girls from college who both aimed for SAHM but ended up career mothers (and one is the breadwinner!). I've known female docs who ended up staying home (temporarily) due to hubby's even more hectic schedule or because they couldn't do part time doctoring. If I'm ever in a situation where hubby and I needed a stay at home parent, it would definitely be me because hubby makes so much more (and will continue to have higher earning potential). That's a situation I'd never imagined as a child raised by a old school feminist working mom.

These situations makes the idea of teaching kids to their gender roles so ridiculous. Even college students don't know how they will end up. We don't know whom we will marry, the cost of living, how much our vs spouse's earning potential will be, or any other mitigating circumstances which could necessitate one parent to stay home and the other to provide.

Did you end up in a different role than the one you anticipated growing up? Were you raised to be a career woman and ended up staying home? Or were you raised with the idea of staying home and ended up being the breadwinner? I know the PC thing for parents to do is to tell little girls they could be 'whatever' they want to be. However, I think most parents still insinuate to their kids the preferred "choice". What was your experience of expectations for gender roles growing up? What was the reality?

[Arete]

I was raised by a single father. Prototype rooster in the henhouse. His chicks were taught to hate dependence the way God hates sin. For as long as we all can remember, it was always "You're going to college, you're going to have a career." We were taught how to cook, clean, do basic repairs in the home and on the car because he believed everyone needed those life skills. No men's work, no women's work, just work. He was really way ahead of his time in this regard considering the society he grew up in and the fact he wouldn't have known gender theory if it had walked up and shook his hand.

We all pretty much turned out per his expectations in that we all did go to college and all have careers. The sibs and I have all gotten comments at one time or another that we are more "masculine" than the "average woman", and the people who have made those comments have always let us know that they don't hold it against us, because we did not have a mother in the house. :roll:

[burntnorton]

I'm pretty much where I thought I'd be. My dad is a doctor and my mom is a social worker and nurse who was a SAHM for most of my childhood. She went back to school to get her nursing degree, then back to work while I was in high school. My younger sisters and I were expected to go to college and have careers by both my parents. Indeed, during a particularly ugly divorce involving my aunt and uncle, my father counseled us that we should always have jobs and our own bank accounts to avoid becoming as vulnerable as my aunt was to shenanigans with the money. It's been my mother, never my father, whose brought up the notion of me stsaying home for a few years, but that would be unworkable. Not only do I not want to, but I make much more than my husband, whose salary pretty much pays the day care bill, with a little left over for healthcare.

[FlorenceHamilton]

I was a full time working mom. I wanted to slow down during my children's younger years. Marriage didn't work. I had to be breadwinner. During those years, the only things in my life were my children and my work. I would not trade those years for anything in the world. My children are grown and delightful and my work remains fulfilling. I do not think that gender roles are necessary after breastfeeding and that the transition to "mommy and daddy are co-parents" should begin between feedings and naturally evolve as baby notices more and more outside the world of immediate gratification of feeding.

[aelar]

I always wanted to have just one kid, and knowing that I'm not super maternal, I expected to have that kid and go back to work pretty quickly, which is what happened. But it was harder than I expected it to be, and I really would prefer to work three days a week rather than full time. Instead I'm in the really fortunate position of being able to work from home three days a week and to come home early the other two days and finish the workday out at home, which are options I never could have imagined growing up.

The bigger gender switch for me was that I never ever ever thought I would end up being the sole breadwinner to a stay-at-home dad. I always expected to be with a man who had a normal career, and I think I sort of expected that he would make more money than me, just because it took me so long to find my niche, and because my hard working mom in a man-dominated field never made as much as her male coworkers. I honestly thought I would end up in a marriage where we tried to be equal and ended up having conflicts about chores and money a lot, that hopefully we'd be able to work out. Older Gen X men didn't really impress me growing up as having a deep embrace of egalitarianism.

Instead I ended up in the squishy end of the STEMs, making survival money for Silicon Valley (but great money for anywhere else in the country) with a very masculine guy who nevertheless cooks, cleans (a little) and is not very ambitious or interested in conforming to the working world's expectations, but is very deeply and seemingly effortlessly egalitarian. It's been very strange watching him take on the stay-at-home-parent role, and work out his own version of nurturing that doesn't look like either fatherhood or motherhood did for us growing up. And I guess the flip side to that is that I'm doing a version of providing that doesn't look like anything I experienced growing up either in men or women.

[AnywhereButHere]

My dad was much older when I was born, very traditional, but all of his kids were going to college. No question, no debate, and once we hit working age we would be working, for him or someone else, but again no debate. He did think that once I had kids I should stay home, but he voiced his opinion maybe twice, and then moved on. He had a friend who's daughter was a pathologist, and my dad was so proud of her and her achievments. He really valued education and accomplishments for everyone, men and women.

Honestly, I would love to be a SAHM, but finances dictate otherwise, so here I am. I like my job, and I love having my own income, but I can certainly see myself at home also. If we were ever at a point where one of us had to stay home, it would be me. I'm a hell of a lot more patient with kids, and I'm better at it. :P

We have friends where the wife is in a high powered job, and her husband stays home. He works freelance, so it worked out, but again, he is the one more suited to be at home with their kids.

People most definitely have different strengths and weaknesses, but those are dicated by personality, not boobs and penises.

[JenniferJuniper]

Those of you of a certain age may recall the TV show “A Family Affairâ€.

When I as a kid I imagined I would someday live in that huge apartment in Manhattan, with an elevator that opened right into my unit and a massive terrace with an amazing skyline view at night. (I'd never been to Manhattan).

I lived there alone, because I would be too busy with my amazing career and fabulous friends to ever settle down with one boring husband. At least not until I was very old. Like 29 maybe. Kids were not even considered. My dinner parties would be amazing.

I think this fantasy evolved because of how I perceived my mother's life as a SAHM with a bunch of kids in a small house in the burbs. She didn't even get her license until I was 10. I wanted the total opposite of that.

As things usually work out, my life didn't fall into either extreme. But maybe somewhere tonight in a parallel universe, a version of me is right now on that terrace this beautiful summer evening, sipping a light sparkling wine while admiring the sunset and hoping my guests arrive before the hot hors d'oeuvres begin to cool.

On this planet, it’s pizza night down at the local joint.

[darkplumaged]

I have no idea what I thought my adult life would be like when I was a kid. I thought I would be a completely different person by the time I grew up, so I guess it was just too hard for me to imagine a realistic adult life for myself. It also seemed like being an adult was pretty boring, so it wasn't something I enjoyed daydreaming about.

I wasn't exactly popular with the guys when I was young (understatement), so I didn't necessarily expect to get married, even though I definitely wanted to. I always wanted to have kids--never considered not having them--so my kid-self would be surprised that I still don't have them. On the other hand, my kid-self wouldn't have been surprised that I am not the primary breadwinner, as I never wanted a big, all-consuming career. My mom stayed home until my younger sister was in 5th grade, so I assumed that once I had kids, I'd do the same.

It is absolutely true that you cannot know how your life will turn out, or how your children's will, so it makes no sense to "prepare" them for a narrow existence that gives them no options should circumstances require them to do something else.

[Fundylicious]

I was going to be a doctor after a brilliant ballet career- I never really considered kids and marriage. I am niether a doc or a ballet dancer, obviously- my dad got sick and college wasn't in the cards, and I sucked at ballet. :embarrassed:

I did put myself through school eventually, get married, and am a home school mom who works part time occasionally. It works for us, though from the outside I suppose we seem very entrenched in our gender roles. Thing is, it's not like in here, at all. Dh and I are both feminists. I'm good at educating and organizing, feeding and nurturing. He is too, but not as good as me, and he makes big bucks compared to my niche market skills. We are pragmatic, so I stay home and he works and it all works out. I have reached the stage in my life where I really couldn't give 2 shits about what anyone thinks about my family or role- only those living in this family get an opinion.

We are raising our girls to have the most opportunity they possibly can, but who can say what that will look like for them? which is why I keep an eye on the fun dies, who have already co-opted home schooling...Steveovah forbid they get any more power in this country!

[desertvixen]

I did put myself through school eventually, get married, and am a home school mom who works part time occasionally. It works for us, though from the outside I suppose we seem very entrenched in our gender roles. Thing is, it's not like in here, at all. Dh and I are both feminists. I'm good at educating and organizing, feeding and nurturing. He is too, but not as good as me, and he makes big bucks compared to my niche market skills. We are pragmatic, so I stay home and he works and it all works out. I have reached the stage in my life where I really couldn't give 2 shits about what anyone thinks about my family or role- only those living in this family get an opinion.

This, especially the bolded. The fundie crowd just cannot stand that people are living their own lives, doing what works out best for them, being open to change.

I always assumed I would be a wife, a mother, and that I would work. I never imagined I would be in the Army, but here we are, fifteen years later.

[bananacat]

I'm pretty much where I expected to end up, which is exactly the opposite of a feminine gender role. I went to college for chemical engineering and I'm now working as an engineer. I'm 28 and single and childless. I play D&D as a hobby. I do plenty of things that are typed as masculine, but they shouldn't be. If I ever get married, I will almost certainly make more than my husband, unless I marry another chemical engineer or a man who is significantly older than me. I don't see myself ever being serious with a doctor or lawyer. If I get married and have kids, I would really prefer to not stay home with them, although I guess only time will tell what circumstance I end up in.

[crawfishgirl]

I was reared by an unhappy SAHM who drilled it into my head that I needed to have a good education and be able to support myself so that I would never have to depend on someone else. I didn't get married until my mid-30's, and we earned about the same amount from our careers, depending on the size of our annual bonuses. I continued to work after I had 2 kids. However, I worked for a shitty company and became so stressed out and burned out that it was impacting my health. Eventually my entire department was downsized due to a client loss, so I took the severance package to de-stress and spend more time with the kids for a while. At first I planned to stay home for just a few months, then it turned into a year, then two, and now I'm thinking I'll go back after 3 years. It's been much easier for everyone in the family - the kids don't have to go to after-school care, I can help them with homework earlier in the afternoon, it's easier to take them to their extra-curricular activities, and I'm able to cook from scratch much more often, among other things. Of course, our finances are much tighter, but we are making it work.

I am considering not going back into a similar position, and looking for a lower-level (and hopefully lower stress) job when I return to the workforce. Corporate America has really become cutthroat, and since I was a manager in my prior role, I saw a lot of shit from upper management. I saw how they treated the employees, and it was not right. I felt squeezed in the middle between my staff and upper mgt. So even though I have two college degrees and additional certifications, I'm at a phase in life where I couldn't care less about them - but I think that I am going through a type of midlife crisis, so eventually that might change. Of course, I am fortunate to have a supportive husband who treats me as his equal and not as a submissive female who was born to meet his every need.

[kpmom]

Those of you of a certain age may recall the TV show “A Family Affairâ€.

When I as a kid I imagined I would someday live in that huge apartment in Manhattan, with an elevator that opened right into my unit and a massive terrace with an amazing skyline view at night. (I'd never been to Manhattan).

I lived there alone, because I would be too busy with my amazing career and fabulous friends to ever settle down with one boring husband. At least not until I was very old. Like 29 maybe. Kids were not even considered. My dinner parties would be amazing.

I think this fantasy evolved because of how I perceived my mother's life as a SAHM with a bunch of kids in a small house in the burbs. She didn't even get her license until I was 10. I wanted the total opposite of that.

As things usually work out, my life didn't fall into either extreme. But maybe somewhere tonight in a parallel universe, a version of me is right now on that terrace this beautiful summer evening, sipping a light sparkling wine while admiring the sunset and hoping my guests arrive before the hot hors d'oeuvres begin to cool.

On this planet, it’s pizza night down at the local joint.

I love it! In your fantasy did you have a Mr. French? I loved that apartment, but I never could figure out how a bachelor conveniently had two extra bedrooms for his nieces and nephew.

[SpeakNow]

I've always imagined that I would be just like my maternal grandmother (a teacher with 4 children), and, so far, I'm on track. I've always wanted to be a teacher. I finished my masters in 2012 and just completed my first year of teaching (which was absolutely wonderful!) I've always wanted to have a large family (4-5 kids) and a supportive husband. I'm not married, but my boyfriend is incredibly supportive. He's also an amazing cook and loves cooking elaborate and delicious dinners. I've always assumed that, since I am a teacher, my spouse will most likely out-earn me. While I wish that didn't have to be the case, I've always felt that I'd rather make less money while having my dream job than make lots of money at a job that doesn't make me happy.

[Mama Mia]

I always wanted to be a SAHM, but was encouraged by my parents to go to college and have a career. I ended up being a working mom, but it's not what I ever wanted.

[JenniferJuniper]

I love it! In your fantasy did you have a Mr. French? I loved that apartment, but I never could figure out how a bachelor conveniently had two extra bedrooms for his nieces and nephew.

Of all of the characters on the show, Mr. French was the only one who might have had a role in my fantasy. But he would have been a perfect lurking man-servant, called only when needed.

The two extra bedrooms never made any sense, but even as a child I knew that meant it was one seriously big-ass apartment and I wanted it.

[Mama Mia]

Of all of the characters on the show, Mr. French was the only one who might have had a role in my fantasy. But he would have been a perfect lurking man-servant, called only when needed.

The two extra bedrooms never made any sense, but even as a child I knew that meant it was one seriously big-ass apartment and I wanted it.

When I was a little girl I adored Sissy with her amazingly cool side ponytail :-)

[Drina Adams]

My parents both worked and still do, my dad will retire this year. Going to college was something we all knew we'd do, in school we all did science/maths subjects alongside other subjects, and there was no sense that we were being pushed down one road or another. I am back in work a couple of months after almost a year on maternity leave, and I'll be leaving again this summer to have my second child. I'll be off for almost a year again. When I'm at home, I do take up a more 'traditional' role, but that's purely practical. It doesn't make sense to me to leave cooking, washing and household jobs until my husband is home so we can share them equally, and when we're both working fulltime we spilt those things pretty evenly.

I did think about taking a few years off while on maternity leave but my mum advised me to go back before making the decision, and i'm glad she did. I might take unpaid leave over the summer holidays (I'm lucky I can do this in my workplace) or work a shorter week, but I can't see myself stepping out of the paid workforce entirely. I think I was in a bit of a bubble on maternity leave, but because I knew i was going back I didn't fully consider the consequences for me as a person of leaving the workplace. I've had a job since I was 16 and have never been unemployed, so I'm not sure I'd be a good candidate for being a fulltime parent all the time.

If one of us did have to give up work, there's no question of my husband leaving his job. He earns a lot more than me and his job has a lot more ancillary benefits than mine. Nothing to do with gender, its the industry he works in (which has a pretty even gender split, as does mine).