Girl or woman?

[fundies_like_zombies]

Are all fundie females called girls until they are married?

When does a fundie girl start being classed as a women? Sure I have seen some blogs where a grown married woman refers to herself as a girl.

Wonder if it is something that the girls/women decide for themselves not comfortable with woman and connotations of that or if it is a culture thing. Girls are weaker, more naive, less responsibility etc.

[snarkbillie]

I'm still a little uncomfortable about being called a woman and I'm well into my 30's. I think there's something sexual about it. I was raised fundie/fundie-lite so I have all kinds of contradictory shit floating around in my head unchecked by reality.

[kb2]

I call adult female humans "ladies." Woman somehow seems disrespectful, like slutty-sexual. I suppose it's wrong somehow to have that dichotomy (can I keep my feminist card, or do I have to hand it in now?), but I'm kind of afraid I'll be offensive if I try to "take back" the word woman.

But also, after you are no longer a teenager you are not a girl.

[fundies_like_zombies]

Adult female humans gets my vote!!

Ladies either seems to be aimed at the over 60s or said in a kinda patronising way. It does seem more polite tho!

[gardenvarietycitizen]

Adult female humans gets my vote!!

Ladies either seems to be aimed at the over 60s or said in a kinda patronising way. It does seem more polite tho!

Yeah, I don't like "ladies" either but I think it's completely just due to how you've heard the word and what connotations it ended up having.

"Woman" (as in "she's a woman" or "I'm a woman, so 'Ms.' works" or whatever) doesn't bother me generally but on the other hand, the phrase "she's a woman now" or similar are absolutely cringeworthy!!

As for girls vs. women, if you map that to children vs. adult, I think in a lot of fundie circles (at least as far as I read them on the internet) there is a sense that getting married is what makes you a full adult. Probably some of that does have to do with the idea of "she knows about sex now" and probably some of it is the "she can finally move out of the house" thing.

Interestingly enough, when it comes to being considered an "adult independent" able to not count your parents on assets checks for figuring out financial aid or tuition payments for US colleges, one surefire way regardless of your age is to get married. The other is to join the military.

[Minerva]

This is the first time I've heard of the word woman being sexual or inappropriate. Growing up, it meant adult human female, and lady was just another word for it. Lately, it's dawned on me that the word "lady" can be used in a patronizing way, but "woman" has always just been a word.

Staying on topic, I'm sure fundies start calling women women at a certain age even if they haven't married by then, but they certainly call their daughters "girls" long after they've become adults. (Which to an extent is done by mainstream people, too.)

[hearyoume08]

I think it depends on who you're talking to. My 75 year old grandmother calls her friends the girls or the ladies.

I was taught to use lady with my elders and I consider adulthood stating at 25 because that's about when physical development stops (bones, the frontal lobe, etc). I'm 23 and I consider myself a girl, granted I'm emotionally only 13, so that creates issues.

[Izzybee]

Yeah, as a nearly 35 year old, I still think of myself as a girl. On the other hand, I'm not sure how I'd feel if someone I didn't know referred to me as such.

I certainly wasn't a woman when I got married (at 19). I'm not really sure when that transition happens.

[PennySycamore]

I am woman, hear me roar! Adult females are women or womyn. I don't mind a group of older female friends calling themselves girls and I dislike calling teenage females women. They are still girls. Lady had certain connotations to it. It can be patronizing or classist and implies someone demure and voiceless.

[uber frau]

'm not a fan of the term "lady". I feel it ties worth to a set of particular (often restrictive) behaviours. I prefer the term 'woman' but I find to the adult femalesof fundidom tricky because they have such a strange, drawn out process of leaving childhood. Even women who are my age (30) and married with a van full of kids are still treated like they aren't quite grown up by their husbands.

[Claddagh]

I'm 30 and will sometimes still refer to myself as a "girl."

As for when fundies call their daughters "woman" I always thought it was when the daughter gets her first period. I just creeped myself out now. :?

[kb2]

This is the first time I've heard of the word woman being sexual or inappropriate. Growing up, it meant adult human female, and lady was just another word for it. Lately, it's dawned on me that the word "lady" can be used in a patronizing way, but "woman" has always just been a word.

Staying on topic, I'm sure fundies start calling women women at a certain age even if they haven't married by then, but they certainly call their daughters "girls" long after they've become adults. (Which to an extent is done by mainstream people, too.)

Oh, this reminds me that my parents like to refer to people in their 20s and 30s as "little girl" or "little boy," especially if they've known them for a while. I'm always taken aback when they say something like, "Jane Smith married that little boy from church," before I remember the little boy is probably Jane Smith's age.

[DamnPrecious]

I still think in terms of girl/boy. I don't think I would even blink if someone called me a girl.

[Mama Mia]

I tend to think of people as being "boys" and "girls" when they are my kids age or younger. I might theoretically know that a young twenty something is a man or woman, and certainly wouldn't argue the point that they are adults, in my head I'll be thinking "boy" or "girl" .. of course as my kids move into their 30's I see the obvious problem with this :lol:

If for some reason I need to refer to someone just using their gender, which really doesn't come up all that often - I would probably attempt to say "woman" unless they were very young. In most situations though I'd be more likely to refer to someone by the function if I didn't know their name -- I'd be more likely to say "Can you get the clerk to help me" than " Can you get that girl /woman to help me"

If it is a more casual situation with a group - I think it's more common to say "girls" as in "girls night out" or "boys night out" .

[Ramona]

i'm in my mid thirties and still think of myself as "girl" most of the time.. i like "lady" from certain people... i don't like "woman" at all.. i don't know why, i just never did. it sounds... strange.

[valsa]

I find it kinda creepy when grown women think of themselves as "girls".

I don't know any grown men who think of themselves as "boys". I think it's one of those insidious patriarchal cultural things we don't often think about because it's so ingrained in us.

Plus, probably as another casualty of patriarchy, women don't really have an informal name to call themselves. "Ladies" and "gals" aren't used anywhere near as widely as the male form "guys".

[PennySycamore]

I find it kinda creepy when grown women think of themselves as "girls".

I don't know any grown men who think of themselves as "boys". I think it's one of those insidious patriarchal cultural things we don't often think about because it's so ingrained in us.

Plus, probably as another casualty of patriarchy, women don't really have an informal name to call themselves. "Ladies" and "gals" aren't used anywhere near as widely as the male form "guys".

How about broads, dames or dolls?

There is nothing like a dame!

I'm a tough old broad.

The Nellie Thursday Home for Old Dolls

These terms have a certain Damon Runyon feel to them and the last one is straight from a Damon Runyon story: The Lemon Drop Kid. They're tough, too, and you don't mess around with broads, dames, or dolls.

[veron1que]

In my neck of the woods...

You're a girl until puberty....and then you are referred to as a young woman, or a teenage girl (never just a girl because that's considered juvenile)

And then an adult (26+) = women.

Generally "ladies" is used as a polite way to address a group of female peoples, any age.

I do find it weird in fundie world when prospective husbands refer to the young woman of interest as a "lovely girl".

[JenniferJuniper]

I find it kinda creepy when grown women think of themselves as "girls".

I don't know any grown men who think of themselves as "boys". I think it's one of those insidious patriarchal cultural things we don't often think about because it's so ingrained in us.

Yup.

And having entered the corporate world in the 80's when it was still extremely common to hear professional women marginalized by the word "girl", it's personally painful for me to hear grown ass women say they like the term.

I had a colleague around 1990 who was a Radcliffe grad in her mid-50's and one day a youngish male client met her in the office. Noting her Harvard accent, he said "You must be the girl I spoke to on the phone yesterday", he said. "Sir", she said, "I assure you we do not hire children at this establishment!"

[Cordelia]

In my group of friends/family we almost never use men or women. We do use girls or ladies (though none of us would be considered quiet or demure). The males are the guys or the boys. I think it is more of a casual vs. formal thing.

[docmom]

Growing up in Glasgow, I was called "hen" (JFC will understand :lol: ) I don't like "lady" and I hate the use of Lady-sports mascot used in many high schools here in the US. It sounds so patronizing. I'll be a woman, I guess. I'd rather just be known by name quite honestly.

[OkToBeTakei]

Growing up in Glasgow, I was called "hen" (JFC will understand :lol: ) I don't like "lady" and I hate the use of Lady-sports mascot used in many high schools here in the US. It sounds so patronizing. I'll be a woman, I guess. I'd rather just be known by name quite honestly.

Hen, yup or even better Quinie :lol:

Another female told her child to 'mind the lady' today in the supermarket. I looked behind me for my Mother. I don't really mind any term it is the inference in which it is used. If I feel a particular word is being used as an agenda or patronising in any way I would take issue. Most times just harmless.

(I will admit to love being called Ma'am when in the USA PURELY because it is a novelty to me culturally. The 'Have a nice day,' not so much. Again culturally I feel like saying 'Let's face it you ACTUALLY don't give a flying shit about my day really, do you?' I promise I'm well behaved and don't say it. :lol: )

[mockingbird]

(I will admit to love being called Ma'am when in the USA PURELY because it is a novelty to me culturally. The 'Have a nice day,' not so much. Again culturally I feel like saying 'Let's face it you ACTUALLY don't give a flying shit about my day really, do you?' I promise I'm well behaved and don't say it. :lol: )

LOL :lol:

I'm from the US but I like "ma'am" because I am pretty short and can look young, and that way I at least know the salesperson (or whoever) thinks I am an adult.

I think both "lady" or "woman" can be derogatory, or not, depending on the context. I don't usually call myself a woman because it feels weird to me, I feel like I am still too young even though I am in my 20s. Not because I am not married or not pregnant or any fundy standards, it's just that I feel like I was a teenager yesterday and surprised that I am still not... I also sometimes will slip up and tell parents/friends about "kids in my class" (at professional school lol) even though I am on the younger end! I think I just equate kids with school because that's how it always was.

[nothingclever]

I'm still a little uncomfortable about being called a woman and I'm well into my 30's. I think there's something sexual about it. I was raised fundie/fundie-lite so I have all kinds of contradictory shit floating around in my head unchecked by reality.

I feel that way when referring to myself as a woman, but not about others. I only ever use lady as a pet name for friends. As in "Hey, lady, how's your day going?"

[samithemage]

I had to think about this for a bit. I tend to use girl when referring to small children or informally when I'm talking about or to my group of friends. I tend to use lady informally referring to an adult female that I saw somewhere throughout my day ie: "this lady at Target was super annoying" or "so I was talking with this lady about xyz..." When I use woman, it tends to be more formal and usually in a professional reference ie: the woman (teller) at the bank etc. When I talk about hanging out with my friends, it's a girls' night. When I talk about myself as a professional, I refer to myself as a woman. It's sort of the way I use boys, guys, men. Boys for small children or friends, guys for informal situations, and men for more formal or professional situations. There is of course always some blurring between the categories, but that's just generally how I use the terms.