Catholic Hosp Malpractice - Fetuses Aren't People

[happy atheist]

Ah, the hypocrisy!

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/2 ... ostpopular

This poor woman had a heart attack and died. The on-call OB didn't answer his page, so her 7-month twin fetuses also died. But it's totally not a big deal, because they weren't people yet!

But when it came to mounting a defense in the Stodghill case, Catholic Health’s lawyers effectively turned the Church directives on their head. Catholic organizations have for decades fought to change federal and state laws that fail to protect “unborn persons,” and Catholic Health’s lawyers in this case had the chance to set precedent bolstering anti-abortion legal arguments. Instead, they are arguing state law protects doctors from liability concerning unborn fetuses on grounds that those fetuses are not persons with legal rights.

So let me get this straight: When it is just a clump of unwanted cells, it's totally a person.

But when it's potentially viable on its own, and wanted, then it's not. Because those things cost money.

Ugh

[linnea27]

When an unborn baby "inconveniences" the person who, you know, is supporting it with their body and suffers legitimate physical and societal effects of carrying that pregnancy to term: PERSON. When it inconveniences an OB and makes the OB actually do a job they are paid to do: NOT PERSONS.

makes sense.

[micatite]

Correction: When it costs a woman inconvenience/job/money/time/pain/health/her life, they're persons. When it will cost the hospital BIG, BIG BUCKS then they're not persons.

[NjoyingNsanity]

All I have to say for the Catholic hospital, the doctor and the lawyers is, whoops looks like your hypocrisy is showing.

[wild little fox]

Oh, okay. How about the women with ectopic pregnancies who have to wait it out until there is no heartbeat, while in extreme pain?

I want to bite them all in the ass!

ETA clarity

[synchroswimr]

Wow. Hypocrisy of the largest order

[PhiMuLady]

I wonder if this hospital even offered women's services?

I work for one that deliberately doesn't have women's OB or GYN services. Pregnant women needing hospitalization or having medical emergencies are routed to the major women's hospital across town.

[happy atheist]

Oh, okay. How about the women with ectopic pregnancies who have to wait it out until there is no heartbeat, while in extreme pain?

I want to bite them all in the ass!

ETA clarity

I thought an untreated ectopic pregnancy often led to the death of the mother.

[gustava]

Think they should notify the Irish hospital that let a woman die rather than abort her dying fetus?

[Childless]

Oh, so this negligent doctor is a saint and I'm a sinner for terminating an ectopic pregnancy. And my mother wonders why I refuse to go to church.

[Bethella]

I wonder if this hospital even offered women's services?

I work for one that deliberately doesn't have women's OB or GYN services. Pregnant women needing hospitalization or having medical emergencies are routed to the major women's hospital across town.

The article said that the OB-GYN on call that night was her own doctor and that he never responded to the page; that's why he and the hospital are getting sued.

[Inanna]

Things like this happen and all I can do is yell "BUT FOR REAL, THOUGH?!" at my laptop. This + the "babies conceived from rape are evidence, y'all!!!" article are enough to make me just want to do some real harm to the wall with my head.

[znthahmed378]

So let me get this straight: When it is just a clump of unwanted cells, it's totally a person.

But when it's potentially viable on its own, and wanted, then it's not. Because those things cost money.

Ugh

No, when the mother goes in and the on-call OB neglects to treat her, resulting in the death of said mother and the fetus, and the husband files a lawsuit demanding money, then its not a person with legal rights anymore.

Fucking hypocrites. A catholic hospital probably isn't the place to go for care related to reproductive health. I wonder if this hospital was the nearest one she could get to. If that's the case, then it's really unfortunate.

[SoybeanQueen]

Oh, so this negligent doctor is a saint and I'm a sinner for terminating an ectopic pregnancy. And my mother wonders why I refuse to go to church.

That's exactly it. These same people would publicly condemn a woman for making the same choice they're currently defending.

[wild little fox]

I found this about ectopic pregnancies.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/21353977/

Do religious restrictions influence ectopic pregnancy management? A national qualitative study.

Abstract

INTRODUCTION: In the United States, ectopic pregnancies are relatively common and associated with significant maternal morbidity and mortality. The Ethical and Religious Directives for Catholic Health Care Services (the Directives) govern the provision of care in Catholic-affiliated hospitals and prohibit the provision of abortion in almost all circumstances. Although ectopic pregnancies are not viable, some Catholic ethicists have argued that the Directives preclude physicians at Catholic hospitals from managing tubal pregnancies with methods and procedures that involve "direct" action against the embryo.

METHODS: We undertook this qualitative study to explore the relationship between the Directives, hospital policies regarding ectopic pregnancy management, and clinical practices. We recruited participants at non-Catholic, longstanding Catholic, and recently merged facilities and conducted focused interviews with 24 physicians at 16 hospitals in 10 states.

FINDINGS: Participants from three Catholic facilities reported that medical therapy with methotrexate was not offered because of their hospitals' religious affiliation. The lack of methotrexate resulted in changes in counseling and practice patterns, including managing ectopic pregnancies expectantly, providing the medication surreptitiously, and transferring patients to other facilities. Further, several physicians reported that, before initiating treatment, they were required to document nonviability through what they perceived as unnecessary paperwork, tests, and imaging studies.

CONCLUSION: Our findings suggest that some interpretations of the Directives are precluding physicians from providing women with ectopic pregnancies with information about and access to a full range of treatment options and are resulting in practices that delay care and may expose women to unnecessary risks.

Copyright © 2011 Jacobs Institute of Women's Health. Published by Elsevier Inc. All rights reserved.

[wild little fox]

I found another article. I'm posting these because I'm outraged.

The lack if medical care to women who have health risks because of pregnancy.

It is barbaric.

http://www.nwlc.org/resource/below-rada ... men-danger

[doggie]

Got to love this quote "No Catholic institution may legitimately work to undermine fundamental human dignity" Of course unless you don't follow our limited time honored definition of dignity.

Catholic Hospital Fetuses

The bishops of Colorado are vowing to undertake a "full review" of the "policies and practices" a Catholic health nonprofit that has argued in medical malpractice lawsuit against it for the death two unborn children that fetuses are not people.

Catholic Health Initiatives, which runs St. Thomas More hospital in Cañon City, Colo., made headlines this week for its surprising line of defense against the lawsuit, which was filed husband of the women who was pregnant with unborn twins and in its care (the woman died with the babies in her womb). Catholic social teaching says that fetuses are people -- the argument is part of the church's strong pro-life and anti-abortion positions.

(See the original story on the hospital and lawsuit as reported by The Colorado Independent's John Tomasic.)

On Thursday evening, the Catholic bishops of Colorado released the following statement:

The Catholic bishops of Colorado learned recently of the deaths of Lori Stodghill and her two unborn children, which took place at St. Thomas More Hospital in Cañon City, Colo. in 2006. We wish to extend our solidarity and sympathy to Lori's husband Jeremy, and her daughter, Elizabeth. Please be assured of our ongoing prayers.

From the moment of conception, human beings are endowed with dignity and with fundamental rights, the most foundational of which is life.

Catholics and Catholic institutions have the duty to protect and foster human life, and to witness to the dignity of the human person -- particularly to the dignity of the unborn. No Catholic institution may legitimately work to undermine fundamental human dignity.

Catholic Health Initiatives is a Catholic institution which provides health care services in 14 states, providing care to thousands of people annually. Catholic Health Initiatives has been accused by some of undermining the Catholic position on human life in the course of litigation. Today, representatives of Catholic Health Initiatives assured us of their intention to observe the moral and ethical obligations of the Catholic Church.

The Catholic bishops of Colorado are not able to comment on ongoing legal disputes. However, we will undertake a full review of this litigation, and of the policies and practices of Catholic Health Initiatives to ensure fidelity and faithful witness to the teachings of the Catholic Church.

Most Rev. Samuel J. Aquila, S.T.L., Archbishop of the Archdiocese of Denver

Most Rev. Michael Sheridan, S.Th.D, Bishop of the Diocese of Colorado Springs

Most Rev. Fernando Isern, Bishop of the Diocese of Pueblo

[wild little fox]

The hypocrisy is so deep I need my hip waders!

I was reading one case where the woman was having a miscarriage, but there was a fetal heartbeat. She had to have a termination ASAP. The hospital put her in a CAB to take her 50 miles to the next closest hospital.

Dignity? My ass! That poor woman!!! OMG!

[Anxious Girl]

I keep on telling my dad that I see myself as a spiritual Christian deist, and don't need to go to Church/support organized religion to believe in God. He told me that I'll understand when I get older and go back to Church. How can people like him be so blind?

[B5SnowDog]

Oh, okay. How about the women with ectopic pregnancies who have to wait it out until there is no heartbeat, while in extreme pain?

I want to bite them all in the ass!

ETA clarity

IIRC, the Catholic church allows the removal of the affected Fallopian tube. They go through some pretty convoluted thought processes to make it ok to end the ectopic pregnancy while still following their rules.

[Librul]

This story makes me ill. The hypocricy is so deep and so wide. Now that it has hit the media because the case is making its way through the appeals system, the Bishops are involved. Prediction: A quiet settlement.

[clarinetpower]

My fundie Catholic friend has been posting right and left about the March for LIFE and how the media is ignoring it, yet... funny... no mention of this story AT ALL.

And she calls Liberals hypocrites?

[Katiebug]

This story has hit CNN: http://www.cnn.com/2013/01/26/us/colorado-fetus-lawsuit/index.html?hpt=hp_t2

The hospital and doctor countersued the woman's husband for $118K in legal fees and attempted to garnish his wages to collect (this as he was raising their 2 year old as a single dad after his terrible loss). They offered to drop the fees if he dropped the suit, he refused, and filed for bankruptcy because he can't afford the fees. THAT is even more disgusting - a Catholic institution and its employees destroyed a family through negligence and then they go after a widower who's raising their child as a single dad because he tried to get some compensation for a horrible loss? :x It just makes me sick to read about.

My mother is a nurse and always told me to never go to a Catholic hospital for OBGYN care or for ANY reason while pregnant. Fortunately we have several good secular/community hospitals and a university medical center that are closer than the Catholic hospitals (and have a better reputation, too).