Christian Reconstructionists Are Scary

[debrand]

Because of Doug Phillips downfall, I decided to find other Christian Reconstructionists to replace him. We focused on Doug's over the top, costume wearing, melodramatic personality but the beliefs behind the movement are actually very scary.

 

Some names that we haven't discussed a lot on this site: Gary North, Gary Demar and Herb Titus

 

alternet.org/story/40318/public_stoning%3A_not_just_for_the_taliban_anymore

 

 

Quote

"I don't want to capture their (mainstream Americans') system. I want to replace it," fumed North to a cheering audience. North has called for the stoning of gays and nonbelievers (rocks are cheap and plentiful, he has observed). Both friends and foes label him "Scary Gary."

 

According to alternet, Christian Reconstructionists are behind a movement to recruit cadets at the Air Force Academy. Titus is the lawyer for Alabama's Judge Moore-the judge who refused to remove a display of the ten commandments from the courtroom.

 

 

Quote

Hosting the "Creation to Revelation... Connecting the Dots" event was a Powder Springs, Ga., publishing house, American Vision, whose pontiff is Gary DeMar. The outfit touts the antebellum South as a righteous society and favors the reintroduction of some forms of slavery (it's sanctioned in the Bible, Reconstructionists say) -- which may explain the blindingly monochrome audience at the gathering.

 

 

More frightening, the group apparently doesn't believe that the constitution protects the rights of Christians who disagree with their narrow viewpoint, Jews, Catholics, Muslims, Atheists......just about anyone not like them

 

 

Quote

James Dobson's Focus on the Family is now selling DeMar's book, America's Christian Heritage. Dobson himself has a warm relationship with many in the movement, and he has admitted voting for Reconstructionist presidential candidate Howard Phillips in 1996.

 

By the way, North believes that poor people who can't pay their debts should become slaves

 

 

Quote

At the other end of the curve, the poor man who steals is eventually caught and sold into bondage under a successful person. His victim receives payment; he receives training; his buyer receives a stream of labor services. If the servant is successful and buys his way out of bondage, he re-enters society as a disciplined man, and presumably a self-disciplined man. He begins to accumulate wealth

 

atheism.about.com/b/2006/04/21/christianity-christian-reconstructionism-slavery-book-notes-toward-a-new-political-humanism.htm

 

Here Gary North makes a case that god will bless nations that keep his laws. He uses an Old Testament verse to 'prove' his assertion. reformed-theology.org/ice/newslet/bet/bet99.02.htm

 

religioustolerance.org/reconstr2.htm Christian Reconstructionists want to use the freedoms we enjoy in the United States to gradually take those same freedoms away from the population.

 

 

Quote

All religious organizations, congregations etc. other than strictly fundamentalist Christianity would be suppressed. Nonconforming evangelical, main line and liberal Christian religious institutions would no longer be allowed to hold services, organize, proselytize, etc. Society would revert to the laws and punishments of the Hebrew Scriptures. Any person who advocated or practiced other religious beliefs outside of their home would be tried for idolatry and executed if found guilty. Blasphemy, adultery and homosexual behavior would be criminalized; those found guilty would also be executed.

 

Christian Reconstructionists advocate genocide.

 

theonomyresources.blogspot.com/2013/07/the-trayvon-martin-controversy-and.html

 

 

Quote

Curious: of the multitude of those accusing Zimmerman of murder without evidence, how many, if they testified in court, would be considered malicious witnesses? One thing is for sure: if they were in fact shown to be malicious witnesses, the state would justly have them executed

 

Here is a bizarre article on why slavery and taxation are similar by Gary DeMar.

americanvision.org/6267/what-if-a-majority-of-americans-support-slavery/#sthash.elMmGYXR.dpbs

 

 

Quote

Let’s go back 160 years and conduct a similar poll among non-slaves. “Do you believe that we should keep existing laws regarding slavery?†I’m sure the Occupy Movement, Democrats, some Republicans, and union members would object to the claim that there’s moral equivalence in slavery and taxation. A slave owner benefits from the labor of the slave. People who believe it is right to tax the rich at a higher rate benefit from the labor and property of others that is not their own. - See more

 

 

Taxation on the wealthy is wrong but apparently, slavery for debt is A-okay. Unlike some Christian Reconstructionists, DeMar believes that slavery as practiced in America was wrong because it included kidnapping but slavery based on theft or debt appears to be fine.

 

 

Quote

Many of this nation’s earliest settlers paid for their passage as indentured servants. Indentured servitude is neither unbiblical nor unconstitutional. A thief who was unable to make restitution could be sold into servitude for his theft (Exodus 22:3b). Even after the abolition of slavery, indentured servitude was retained by the Constitution as a legitimate form of punishment: “Neither slavery nor involuntary servitude, except as a punishment for crime whereof the party shall have been duly convicted, shall exist within the United States, or any place subject to their jurisdiction†(Amendment XIII, Section 1). We should, therefore, distinguish between slave (man stealing) and bondservant (indentured servant).

-

 

americanvision.org/1249/does-bible-support-slavery-part/#sthash.4wYpC8lO.dpbs

 

In the comments, someone argues that war captives may be kept as slaves

 

Quote

Many slaves were stolen, making the purchases wicked,. Yet, some were taken as war captives (the Africans were heavily fighting among themselves), making the purchases lawful (Leviticus 25:44-46).

-

 

Herb Titus backed the Constitution Restoration Act of 2005. I am confused what the act does but it sounds like it exempts religious individuals from following the same laws that everyone else does

 

volokh.com/2013/12/02/1a-religious-freedom-restoration-act/ This is not a Christian Reconstuctionist site but it provided the simpliest explanation of the Constitution Restoration Act

 

Do any of you have more information on Christian Reconstructionists? I'd like to do some online reading about the group

[RachelB]

Yeah, Gary North is pretty much my least favorite fundie ever. What a horror show.

[sparkles]

As the Botkins are fond of saying, "Read Rushdooney."

I'd also recommend "Kingdom Coming: The Rise of Christian Nationalism" by Michelle Goldberg, which I'm still working through (it freaks me out so much, I have to stop reading for a while). It needs some updated but it's still a chilling read.

While many fundies seem to be content to take the route of political maneuvering and winning through sheer numbers, too many of these Reconstructionist wingnuts would be more than willing to resort to violent means of takeover. I'm not sure which group I fear most.

[NotALoserLikeYou]

Thanks for the links. Very interesting but it's also do bizarre. You aren't following Christ (ie a Christian) if you are advocating killing all of these people? You're supposed to kill non believers?? Then who the fuck are you supposed to proselytize to??

[debrand]

Thanks for the links. Very interesting but it's also do bizarre. You aren't following Christ (ie a Christian) if you are advocating killing all of these people? You're supposed to kill non believers?? Then who the fuck are you supposed to proselytize to??

Although they have the word Christian in their name, Christian Reconstructionists don't seem to follow any of their founder's teachings. They take the worst of the Old Testament and imagine that it is a good model to follow in a modern society.

[fatcat]

This is what scares me - truly scares me. That someone as comparatively 'mainstream' as James Dobson would support this. So many people in the US follow conservative evangelical leaders. Exactly how far does the reach of these Reconstructionists in politics go? If I were to subscribe to any conspiracy theory (if, mind you) it would be the planned takeover of the US government by Christian fundamentalists.

There is something deeply wrong with these people. More than anything, they love authority and punishment.

(I'm not sure everything I wrote up there made sense, but I hope you get the idea...)

[debrand]

This is what scares me - truly scares me. That someone as comparatively 'mainstream' as James Dobson would support this. So many people in the US follow conservative evangelical leaders. Exactly how far does the reach of these Reconstructionists in politics go? If I were to subscribe to any conspiracy theory (if, mind you) it would be the planned takeover of the US government by Christian fundamentalists.

There is something deeply wrong with these people. More than anything, they love authority and punishment.

(I'm not sure everything I wrote up there made sense, but I hope you get the idea...)

What you wrote does make sense and describes what I fear. I try not to be a paranoid conspiracy theorist either but these people concern me. On the positive side, I think that people are slowly beginning to see the crazy in the Christian fundamentalist movement. The internet is an excellent source for getting the information about these groups out to the public.

[RachelB]

This is what scares me - truly scares me. That someone as comparatively 'mainstream' as James Dobson would support this. So many people in the US follow conservative evangelical leaders. Exactly how far does the reach of these Reconstructionists in politics go? If I were to subscribe to any conspiracy theory (if, mind you) it would be the planned takeover of the US government by Christian fundamentalists.

There is something deeply wrong with these people. More than anything, they love authority and punishment.

(I'm not sure everything I wrote up there made sense, but I hope you get the idea...)

I keep typing this and then erasing it: :shhh:

My one hope is that, as much as the reconstructionists hate us, they can barely stand their fellow fundamentalists. What I see as a tiny doctrinal difference, they tend to see as cause for separation. I think they'll go circular firing squad on each other.

[RosyDaisy]

Every time I see Judge Roy Moore's name it makes my blood boil. The man is batshit crazy (not even joking). I met him briefly. First it was the Ten Commandments, now it's Obama's citizenship. Fuck you judge Moore.

[RachelB]

Every time I see Judge Roy Moore's name it makes my blood boil. The man is batshit crazy (not even joking). I met him briefly. First it was the Ten Commandments, now it's Obama's citizenship. Fuck you judge Moore.

There is a reconstructionist dude, Tim Tingelstad, who ran for a judicial post in Minnesota against Alan Page. His schtick was that his allegiance was to the bible first, then to the Constitution insofar as it didn't contradict the bible. As far as I am concerned, that is a disqualification for public office.

I lived in Minnesota for years and thought Justice Page was the bee's knees, so I was enraged that this dude got any votes at all. And he keeps running for judicial posts. :pull-hair:

[nelliebelle1197]

As the Botkins are fond of saying, "Read Rushdooney."

I'd also recommend "Kingdom Coming: The Rise of Christian Nationalism" by Michelle Goldberg, which I'm still working through (it freaks me out so much, I have to stop reading for a while). It needs some updated but it's still a chilling read.

While many fundies seem to be content to take the route of political maneuvering and winning through sheer numbers, too many of these Reconstructionist wingnuts would be more than willing to resort to violent means of takeover. I'm not sure which group I fear most.

The Seppis say that too.