Courtship Speculation

[Kira]

I was going through the "Upcoming Baby Season" thread veiwtopic.php?f=8&t=7957&sid=014c5f5afabeaa9aff9f538da7c8698 and came across this comment by fundiefan on page 4:

"This makes me very sad. Babies are supposed to be good news. All I feel when I read this thread is dread and disgust. All those babies born to such tiny, ignorant, pathetic worlds. I read the thread quickly - is LL on the list? Isn't she due in, like, days or something? It seems she's been enjoying not being a mother to her other six kids for at least 8 or 9 months already.

Yes, it's definitely about time for Kristina to announce pregnancy #3. There are also many others I don't doubt are soon to come - Blair Tsantles, Monica Brown, Kelly Bradrick, Dorothy Sanders, Bethany Lane, Priscilla whatshername. It's all so predictable. What I'm really interested in seeing is the courtships and weddings for the year. Some of these offspring are getting on in years and are already 20 years old and more. It's high time their daddy's pick their mates and get them married off and popping out babies."

That question has been on my mind recently, especially with Joseph Maxwell's engagement. We're all wondering why Steve is allowing him to marry a girl like Elizabeth. The most common answer seems to be it's good for business. Honestly I wouldn't be suprised if he is looking for a husband for Sarah. A poster noted in another thread that Sarah is now wearing bows on her head seemingly to look young, maybe that part of the plan. Then you have the Botkins who also have business problems. What are those girls going to do when people stop showing up to hear them speak. There are many many more examples. So my question is will the next 1-2 years have a slew of courtships and marriages. Some of these families have multiple adult children. How long can these families go on like this. Their entire beleif system is built around the idea of marriage and (lots of)children and yet many are failing miserably.

Edited because I'm not good at this :oops:

[Hane]

On a purely practical level, I can't help wondering how these new young families are going to manage to support themselves in the insular world in which they live. Higher education--which would include training in the skilled trades that are so important and require licensing (electrical work, construction, plumbing, etc.)--is strictly verboten. Any income a wife could provide is considered incidental and secondary, and not allowed in many cases.

These young husbands are supposed to be the sole financial support for a wife and for all those kids they'll be expected to produce, with no form of contraception (not even NFP) permitted. Yet their possibilities in the working world are utterly circumscribed.

I work for a smallish public utility company. Hardly glamorous, but full of people who are able to make decent livings for themselves and their families. Plenty of young guys working in the field as technicians, and in the office handling customer accounts, business projects, marketing, and IT. Even something as innocuous and pedestrian as working for the local electric company is closed off to them.

And their undereducated wives will be spewing out undereducated children. I'm willing to bet that, for every semi-literate fundie mommy with a blog, there are hundreds who are incapable of such an "accomplishment."

Edited for riffle.

[gardenvarietycitizen]

They seem to have an idealized view of the trades in particular as something anyone can just up and do if they have a good heart and work hard. I think partly that's because so many of the parents don't actually come from anything remotely resembling blue collar work themselves, and so have an elitist view even while denying their own backgrounds (college and white-collar jobs, mostly) to their kids.

In the real world, in 2012, going into the trades might not require an official "university degree" but it certainly requires higher education beyond high school which IS selective and WILL force you to study and work among heathens, and possibly become tainted with what a lot of fundies probably consider "evil socialism."

[YPestis]

Fundies are searching back to some mythical golden era when people were able to learn on the job to support a large family. They're thinking of skilled manual jobs such as carpentry, plumbing etc. However, many now require licenses and formal training, certificates and other interactions with the general population. Plus, their income is not guaranteed to be sufficient to support a fast-growing brood.

The Maxwells have been able to skate by with their no-debt houses by living at home while saving. That takes a load off of their financial burden as there is no mortgage. However, even they must struggle at times with their small businesses as there is nothing particular about their acquired skill set (self-taught photography, a string of IT certificates, construction learned from DIY home projects etc) that makes them more qualified than the vast legion of people who acquires formal training courses, degrees etc. Plus, they are competing in a crowded field against larger, and better funded companies. Just how much need is there for overpriced online IT courses and chore labels?

[bananacat]

There was never a time when a man could learn a trade and support a large family. People were just really poor throughout most of history and nearly everyone faced periods of food/money insecurity.

[Creaky Mom]

Given today's photos of the Maxwell boy children drywalling, I suspect this is their "construction" business. They are using professional equipment and are putting the stuff up like they've done it a thousand times before. You don't need to be skilled or licensed to do drywall and the equipment for it is not expensive or cumbersome to carry around from job to job. I can see how the boy children have managed to make a tidy income for themselves doing that particular work. Too bad though they were denied getting an education so they don't have to bust their butts in 100 degree weather to make a living. That can get old when you are 60.

[Guest Anonymous]

Given today's photos of the Maxwell boy children drywalling, I suspect this is their "construction" business. They are using professional equipment and are putting the stuff up like they've done it a thousand times before. You don't need to be skilled or licensed to do drywall and the equipment for it is not expensive or cumbersome to carry around from job to job. I can see how the boy children have managed to make a tidy income for themselves doing that particular work. Too bad though they were denied getting an education so they don't have to bust their butts in 100 degree weather to make a living. That can get old when you are 60.

I wonder if any of these parents have thought about what will happen to their offspring when the kids reach their 60s. Steve Maxwell will collect Social Security benefits, because he had the necessary 10 years or 40 quarters of taxable income before he went full-bore, batshit crazy. But unless one or more of his kids works at some point in their lives for a conventional employer and pays 10 years or 40 quarters worth of Social Security taxes, they won't be similarly blessed. So not only are none of his sons truly qualified to earn livings as skilled tradesmen, but they're going to be screwed when they reach their 60s or 70s. As for the Maxwell daughters, they will be similarly SOL unless they have the good luck to marry someone who is destined to meet the Social Security specs at some point in his life.

[Justme]

I wonder if any of these parents have thought about what will happen to their offspring when the kids reach their 60s. Steve Maxwell will collect Social Security benefits, because he had the necessary 10 years or 40 quarters of taxable income before he went full-bore, batshit crazy. But unless one or more of his kids works at some point in their lives for a conventional employer and pays 10 years or 40 quarters worth of Social Security taxes, they won't be similarly blessed. So not only are none of his sons truly qualified to earn livings as skilled tradesmen, but they're going to be screwed when they reach their 60s or 70s. As for the Maxwell daughters, they will be similarly SOL unless they have the good luck to marry someone who is destined to meet the Social Security specs at some point in his life.

Uuhhmmm, when you are self employed, you still pay social security tax. You pay your normal "share" plus what an employer would pay.

[CynicMom]

Assuming you report that income to the IRS.

[ophelia]

I wonder if any of these parents have thought about what will happen to their offspring when the kids reach their 60s. Steve Maxwell will collect Social Security benefits, because he had the necessary 10 years or 40 quarters of taxable income before he went full-bore, batshit crazy. But unless one or more of his kids works at some point in their lives for a conventional employer and pays 10 years or 40 quarters worth of Social Security taxes, they won't be similarly blessed. So not only are none of his sons truly qualified to earn livings as skilled tradesmen, but they're going to be screwed when they reach their 60s or 70s. As for the Maxwell daughters, they will be similarly SOL unless they have the good luck to marry someone who is destined to meet the Social Security specs at some point in his life.

I never saw it from that point if view and it is really interesting. Maybe Dougie and Steve should make conference about this kind of stuff and not about godly food..

I especially wonder what people like Gil Bates do when they can't work anymore. He is probably hoping that by then Lawson is making enough money to support him (again).

[pixydust]

I never saw it from that point if view and it is really interesting. Maybe Dougie and Steve should make conference about this kind of stuff and not about godly food..

I especially wonder what people like Gil Bates do when they can't work anymore. He is probably hoping that by then Lawson is making enough money to support him (again).

I don't think fundies look that far into the future. If they do, it's along the lines of "I will never retire" (gorilla chest pounding will follow that thought) or "My kids will take care of us....I think it says that in the bible somewhere" (thought after that : Let's go make a baby!). There doesn't seem to be any planning for the future, anymore than next year, and a lot of "God will provide" bs.

[alysee]

I don't think there is anything wrong with an older family member coming to live with the family. But with these megasized families they are still going to have kids in the house and I don't think that's fair to the older family member. Let the older family member live a full life with other people.

I hate that my grandmother lives with my aunt and uncle on their farm just because my grandfather died. She could live at my parents house and have a much better end of her life because she isn't surrounded by chaos that is my aunts house. She could go out and do things(other than seeing family members and church!), if she lived with my parents. She could do her own errands, go to clubs and things other than stuck doing laundry and taking care of the little kids who aren't in school.

Ugghhhhh....this is one stance I will take, let the elderly(hehe) live a happy and fulfilled life. Why the heck does it have to stop just because my grandfather died?

[ophelia]

Are they really that stupid? When you work in the tree service like Gil Bates, you need good physical fitness and once he gets old and rusty and might be unable to hang in trees and cut them.