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Cleopatra7

Stand By Your Man? Christian wife of John Lennon's killer is

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Cleopatra7

Gloria Hiroko Chapman is the wife of Mark David Chapman, the man who killed John Lennon. She is a devout Christian, and remains married to Chapman, despite having spent almost forty years behind bars and despite the fact that he was physically violent to her before the murder:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2872924/WORLD-EXCLUSIVE-life-married-John-Lennon-s-killer-Disturbing-interview-wife-s-stood-Mark-Chapman-34-years-reveals-sex-bars-wants-Yoko-forgive.html

(yes, it's the Daily Fail, but she talked directly to them, so I assume I'm getting her direct opinions on things)

Among other things, Mrs. Chapman claims that Mark David is truly sorry for having killed Lennon, despite him not saying anything of the sort, and that she prays that Yoko Ono will find Jesus. I know it's not unusual for spouses to stick with a partner in prison, but this seems more extreme, since Mark David is never going to be paroled and because he is such a high profile prisoner. Honestly, I think the reason Mrs. Chapman is "more in love" with Mark David than before is because she doesn't have to deal with him or his violent tendencies everyday, and she can project qualities on him that he may not possess. She says many of her friends deserted her because of her continued devotion to Mark David. It seems almost like a long-distance abusive relationship, if such  a thing is possible.

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Happy
PennySycamore

I think Barbara Walters was going to interview her for Barbara's ID Discovery Show.  I think the show aired last night and should be repeated but I don't know just when.  I watched a clip of Barbara interviewing Mark David Chapman and was thoroughly creeped out.

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Mischievous
LadyCrow1313

MDC is a piece of shit & will always be a piece of shit, abuser or not (of which I wasn't aware of before reading this, but it doesn't surprise me). He robbed the world of an amazing musician (not to mention robbing John's family & friends of a loved one) in a horrifyingly violent way & deserves all that karma will dish out. I hope he meets a large prisoner named Bubba & gets a pipe job.

:: getting off soapbox ::

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HearMeRoar
11 hours ago, Cleopatra7 said:

It seems almost like a long-distance abusive relationship, if such  a thing is possible.

It is because she is making it possible.

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Four is Enough
14 minutes ago, HearMeRoar said:

It is because she is making it possible.

:agree:

Spoiler
Spoiler

 

 

Sorry about the spoiler thing; I wanted to say I agree ELEVENTY! but hit the wrong button. Twice. SMH

Edited by Four is Enough

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nastyhobbitses

How cold-blooded murderers and abusers can have people who are so devoted to them and love them unconditionally while innocent children starve or get beaten to death by unloving parents and caregivers is utterly beyond me.

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Cleopatra7
13 minutes ago, nastyhobbitses said:

How cold-blooded murderers and abusers can have people who are so devoted to them and love them unconditionally while innocent children starve or get beaten to death by unloving parents and caregivers is utterly beyond me.

In the case of Gloria Chapman, I think she believes that as a Christian she has to forgive and love her husband, regardless of what he did. The reason why Chapman initially became obsessed with Lennon as a teen was because he became born again and was offended by the whole "bigger than Jesus" controversy. It's clear his religious obsession, combined with psychotic delusions, lead to Lennon's death. Chapman was so violent and delusional, I believe he would have killed someone, perhaps Gloria, even if he hadn't killed Lennon. Gloria is the best possible wife for such a person, because she's willing to be a complete doormat for the sake of her beliefs. 

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2xx1xy1JD

Wow, that neatly captures everything that I find massively offensive in evangelical theology.

In that worldview, the killer is fine and is going to heaven because he knows Jesus.

John - the actual victim - might have gone to heaven, but only because he read the bible as a kid and might have turned to Jesus in his dying moments.

They have the chutzah to ask that Yoko forgive the killer.  It doesn't sound like a genuine expression of remorse from him.  Instead, it comes across as "well, I'm going to heaven as a Christian, but you won't get there unless you forgive me and accept Jesus."

I hope Yoko doesn't read that, because it is just so fucking wrong.

 

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roddma

How can anyone stay with an abuser/killer? It seems like a case of Stockholm syndrome.

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Spent
nokidsmom
5 hours ago, roddma said:

How can anyone stay with an abuser/killer? It seems like a case of Stockholm syndrome.

I agree with the cleopatra's suggestion that with MDC in prison, Gloria does not have to deal with him on a daily basis and can project better qualities on him.  Easier to love from afar.   Add in the "you must forgive" mindset from her evangelical Christianity and you have this woman who has stayed with him.

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DaisyD

Plus she gets to be the oh so holy wife who stuck by her husband, no matter what. That's like the holy grail for these people. Why would she ever give that up?

 

I wasn't even born yet when John Lennon died (I suppose I was "pre-born" :pb_rollseyes:), but I was raised on his music. I'm really pretty offended by the whole "It's okay. I've got Jesus now." that these two are trying to put out there. I hope Yoko forgives him, and then spends whatever time necessary to keep that man in jail forever. (The forgiveness is for her sake not his. Holding a grudge is like taking poison and waiting for someone else to die.)

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Coldwinterskies

When I hear about women in love with prisoners who are serving long sentences, I am reminded of a blog I ran across a while ago that some of you might also find interesting if you like reading blogs:  letterstodesiree.wordpress.com

She doesn't broadcast the name of her husband, but after reading the blog for a while it became clear that her husband is Jeremy Strohmeyer, who is in prison because he molested and murdered a 7 year old girl: 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeremy_Strohmeyer

She's a good writer who expresses herself very well, so it is a very interesting glimpse into the psychology of these women. I've also run into a few women who are dating prisoners just because I have done penpal stuff with non-violent prisoners myself.
I get the impression that these women don't actually WANT what the rest of us would consider a "normal" relationship. I think they actually prefer the idea of a guy who is being held under 24 hour supervision so they know that he doesn't have anything or anyone else in his life except for her.  I'm sure that these prisoners do lavish a lot of attention and flowery words on their wives, because what else would they do with their time? Some women probably crave that kind of attention and "devotion". 

I think a lot of them probably would find that if Hubby actually was released from prison, the relationship probably wouldn't last.  I know of a few women who have broken up with one prison lover only to seek out another jailbird. 

I definitely agree that projecting a lot of great qualities on the guy because you don't have to face the reality of what he is like day in and day out is probably a huge factor. 

Edited by Coldwinterskies

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roddma



That too. I was around 10 when it happened, but I dont recall too much.Im not sure if I knew who he was then. To shoot a person because they made an offhand remark you found offensive is insane and heartless

Add in the "you must forgive" mindset from her evangelical Christianity and you have this woman who has stayed with him.

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Howl

Gloria Hiroko Chapman -- I would love to dump a bowl of cold spaghetti on that woman's face while she's asleep; she is that annoying.  

I climbed Diorite Peak in the La Plata Mtns in SW Colorado the summer after John Lennon's murder. There was a sign at the top renaming it John Lennon Peak. That didn't change anything; it's still Diorite Peak, but I still like listening to the Imagine album and always will. 

John Lennon's death was a sad event, but in a way it harkens back to a time when a shooter just shot one person, and didn't decide to kill as many people as possible to share the pain. 

re:  letterstodesiree.wordpress.com

I can't read much of that -- too powerful, too insane, too romantic, too "he's in exile", too Victorian, too insightful to no good end, too something.  It is as though you're missing someone you dearly love because they're gone for two weeks, but that is the perpetual state of affairs in this marriage.  She talks about being broken, but does she ever contemplate the brokenness of his victim's family?   

It seems that perhaps she "met" her husband in prison or did she know him prior to incarceration?   

Edited by Howl
Just read letters to desiree

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Coldwinterskies

As I recall, Desiree fell in love with Jeremy over prison pen pal letters, so she's never actually known him as a free man.

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Howl

That makes sense.  Reading the wiki article, he was an older teenager when he was sent to prison. 

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Jingerbread
12 hours ago, Howl said:

re:  letterstodesiree.wordpress.com

I can't read much of that -- too powerful, too insane, too romantic, too "he's in exile", too Victorian, too insightful to no good end, too something.  It is as though you're missing someone you dearly love because they're gone for two weeks, but that is the perpetual state of affairs in this marriage.  She talks about being broken, but does she ever contemplate the brokenness of his victim's family?   

It seems that perhaps she "met" her husband in prison or did she know him prior to incarceration?   

I read some of that, then as soon as I read the victim's name, I remembered exactly who she was because I was so shocked then it happened that someone could see it and have no remorse over saying nothing.  The killer's friend, in my opinion, is the worse criminal because he could have stopped it, didn't, doesn't feel bad, and doesn't see value in her life and has openly said so.  He's a killer just as much as the convicted killer.

The woman in love with him must be a bunch of cards short of a full deck.  I don't think she really thinks he did wrong or should be in jail!

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Howl
20 hours ago, Jingerbread said:

 The killer's friend, in my opinion, is the worse criminal because he could have stopped it, didn't, doesn't feel bad, and doesn't see value in her life and has openly said so.  He's a killer just as much as the convicted killer.

He (David Cash) should be in prison, and it's a crime that he isn't. 

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DaffyDill

I just don't understand these people who marry some guy/woman in gaol, without ever knowing what they were like as a free man/woman), and without seeming to care what their crime was.

In Letters to Desiree, she writes very well, and I did find myself feeling for her somewhat, but that would fade pretty quickly when I reminded myself she KNEW he would never get out of gaol when she chose to marry him. Being from Australia, I hadn't heard of the case, so when she described him as being with the wrong people, in the wrong place, at the wrong time, I wondered if maybe he was some part of a group that robbed or killed someone, but didn't actually do much himself, if that makes sense?

But then I looked him up and found a Wikipedia page. And so then I read this: The Fractured Life of Jeremy Strohmeyer , a feature from the LA Times in 1998. And I had no sympathy left for her at all.

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