Christian End Times Family Walmart Shooting - merged

[Black Aliss]

Not breaking the link because Wonkette knows all about FJ

http://wonkette.com/580767/christian-en ... r-the-lord

Only nine people in a much larger RV than the Rodrigues family's ride but possibly even more whacko than David and Jill.

[HereticHick]

Yikes--if I had to choose between attending a Rodrigues concert, a Duggar concert, a Maxwell concert--or this bunch of racist doomsday preppers--thats a difficult choice!

[Delilah]

So, they were parked for days in a Walmart parking lot and were using the Walmart restrooms. Then one of the family members got aggressive with a Walmart employee and the police were called.

I'm sure the Walmart employees were pretty sick of these people practically living there. I bet the employee said something, and that's what set off the incident. That family is probably paranoid and was looking for a reason to be violent. Yikes.

I'm glad the article explained the Matthew 24 Now joke because I didn't really get it. Actually, I'm still a little confused by it, but I think it probably means Yahoo Apocalypse!

I'm glad the injured police officers will recover.

[HereticHick]

So, they were parked for days in a Walmart parking lot and were using the Walmart restrooms. Then one of the family members got aggressive with a Walmart employee and the police were called.

I'm sure the Walmart employees were pretty sick of these people practically living there. I bet the employee said something, and that's what set off the incident. That family is probably paranoid and was looking for a reason to be violent. Yikes.

I'm glad the article explained the Matthew 24 Now joke because I didn't really get it. Actually, I'm still a little confused by it, but I think it probably means Yahoo Apocalypse!

I'm glad the injured police officers will recover.

I bet they were buying nothing at Walmart. Total parasites.

[Anny Nym]

People, one question: What is this strange and downright bizarre obsession with all that families in the USA (may it be the Rodrigues, the one from the Reality Show Ihaveforgottentheirname, or this whackos) to think it is even a remotely good ideo to shove the whole family into a bus, tour the country and "bless" everyone with their singing children... who even wants to hear that in the first place? :cray-cray:

Why? Really, just WHY?

Is this some street preacher or Gothard-related thing? Where do they get that from?

And how did they manage to stay on a supermarket parking lot for several DAYS? Here, you get towed and fined after a couple of hours :lol:

[Delilah]

Anny Nym, the Americans don't get it either. It's not an American thing, it's a crazy thing.

[16strong]

If the Palin family had a band and an RV...

[ariel9]

And this is why I go to Target! (joking). But to answer the concert choice question, I would choose the Duggars at least they pretend to be tolerant in your presence.

[Black Aliss]

And how did they manage to stay on a supermarket parking lot for several DAYS? Here, you get towed and fined after a couple of hours :lol:

In the US, at least, most Walmart stores actually encourage RVers to park in the far corners of their parking lots overnight. However, they are limited to one night or, in case of emergency, two nights max.

[Four is Enough]

So it's not safe to go into a WalMart parking lot anywhere near the RVs. Those may NOT be cheap old folks stopping for the night; they might be whacked-out "Christians" who partook of a LITTLE TOO MUCH of whatever weed was growing alongside the road.... :wtf:

[Palimpsest]

Wow. I think this is awful, quite aside from the fact that innocent shoppers could have been caught in the crossfire. I suppose it is not clear yet whether the Gaver family started shooting or just resisted arrest with a fist fight and tried to grab an officer's gun.

This family may be as nutty as the average fruitcake and as Fundie as hell, but a young man in his early 20s is dead and a 21 year old was gut-shot. Not funny but sad.

I'm glad the officer will make a full recovery.

[Cleopatra7]

People, one question: What is this strange and downright bizarre obsession with all that families in the USA (may it be the Rodrigues, the one from the Reality Show Ihaveforgottentheirname, or this whackos) to think it is even a remotely good ideo to shove the whole family into a bus, tour the country and "bless" everyone with their singing children... who even wants to hear that in the first place? :cray-cray:

Why? Really, just WHY?

Is this some street preacher or Gothard-related thing? Where do they get that from?

And how did they manage to stay on a supermarket parking lot for several DAYS? Here, you get towed and fined after a couple of hours :lol:

I think several factors are at work. First, there is much more of a car culture in the US than Europe, and the romantic idea of a road trip around the country in a car, RV, or motorcycle has a lot of appeal. Second, it seems to be much easier in the US to start a church or religion than in Europe. In many European countries, there are still state churches and it seems like they are willing to definitively rule on what is and is not a "legitimate religion." Germany, for example, doesn't consider Scientology to be a religion. In the US, literally anyone can start up a religion or church. I think this goes back to the ideal of the Pilgrims fleeing oppression and the notion that you should be able to believe anything you want, no matter how absurd. The US is also much more religious than Europe and the in your face aspect that characterizes much of American religiosity must seem crass and off-putting to outsiders (it seems that way to me, and I'm an America). It seems to be that European Christianity has a more communtarian flavor, whereas American Christianity is more individualistic, which could explain why the concept of a welfare state is considered unremarkable to the former and and abomination to the latter.

[snickerz]

I've been researching these people for a few days now. They are CRAZY. They are nothing like the "Christian family bands" we usually come across here. More like homeless religious lunatic family cult. I so wish they had a blog but the crazy is just OMG on their facebook and other internet posts I have found.

Here's a sampling: (They use the last name Green as well as Gaver)

https://plus.google.com/100932268349797641456/posts Jeremiah March 17 2015:

Please help. I need prayer. I'm writing some parts of my life and the evil situation I'm in on different videos to try to ask for prayer. I don't know what you know of the world but hopefully you know people need prayer. The victims of the pedophile TSA agents need prayer. The male and female victims of enforced rape in prisons need prayer. The victims of the Vatican and its daughter churches need prayer. And the victims of satanic ritual abuse need prayer. The satanist have chased us since we fled from California. My family is split in 2. They broke us down till there's not much left of our souls. And my father may be dying from the many times they've poisoned him. Please pray that my father will be healed of all the poisons and that our whole family can escape the satanists. Please pray

Here's another in the comments on this video - Nathan 6 months ago (it's a wall-of-text but worth it if you enjoy the crazy!)

What the ever-loving hell??? I can understand the parents being crazy, but can they make their kids crazy? Apparently they can.

For added enjoyment, I'll add dad's facebook: https://www.facebook.com/forthedaymylordreturns?fref=ts

[Cleopatra7]

I've been researching these people for a few days now. They are CRAZY. They are nothing like the "Christian family bands" we usually come across here. More like homeless religious lunatic family cult. I so wish they had a blog but the crazy is just OMG on their facebook and other internet posts I have found.

Here's a sampling: (They use the last name Green as well as Gaver)

https://plus.google.com/100932268349797641456/posts Jeremiah March 17 2015:

Here's another in the comments on this video - Nathan 6 months ago (it's a wall-of-text but worth it if you enjoy the crazy!)

What the ever-loving hell??? I can understand the parents being crazy, but can they make their kids crazy? Apparently they can.

For added enjoyment, I'll add dad's facebook: https://www.facebook.com/forthedaymylordreturns?fref=ts

Sadly, none of this surprises me. This kind of crazy is the natural result when families homeschool, home church, and generally turn themselves into cults where all the members are related to each other.

[Anny Nym]

Thanks @Cleopatra7 - it actually makes more sense now.

I just always wonderered why there are so many of this "singing families".

Everyone to their own of course, but I dare to say this is a rather strange concept for me, mainly because I don´t think the RV living thing would be possible, or at least easy to pull off,over here for legal reasons.

But to be fair, we have (or had) a very famous rather religious singing family over here in Europe too! :D

They were called The Kelly Family and quite famous in the 1990s. I think they were Christian Hippies (or Hippie-christians) ? Anyway one of the boys is a monk now and a daughter is a Plus Size model .

Oh, and they lived on a house boat once and a waterfront castle, from which they were apparently evicted after filing for bankrupcy...

The dad was irish and the mother german as far as I remember, they lived in Germany and the Netherlands.

Here, have a blast from the past! :lol:

[Mama Mia]

Thanks @Cleopatra7 - it actually makes more sense now.

I just always wonderered why there are so many of this "singing families".

Everyone to their own of course, but I dare to say this is a rather strange concept for me, mainly because I don´t think the RV living thing would be possible, or at least easy to pull off,over here for legal reasons.

But to be fair, we have (or had) a very famous rather religious singing family over here in Europe too! :D

They were called The Kelly Family and quite famous in the 1990s. I think they were Christian Hippies (or Hippie-christians) ? Anyway one of the boys is a monk now and a daughter is a Plus Size model .

Oh, and they lived on a house boat once and a waterfront castle, from which they were apparently evicted after filing for bankrupcy...

The dad was irish and the mother german as far as I remember, they lived in Germany and the Netherlands.

Here, have a blast from the past! :lol:

Well, I think it may seem like there's a lot of RV living, Christian singing families. But in reality, we've talked about only a handful. And even if there's a hundred times as many ( doubtful) still you're talking about a few hundred, tops, out of 330 million people across several thousand miles. So I don't know that it's really a" thing" .

I think Cleopatras points were excellent regarding the religious differences. I took a course in college regarding the new religions founded in the U.S.- just during the mid 1800s in a small area in the east there were many that took hold. It was really fascinating. I have had a couple of relatives who were religious seekers and switched religions frequently.

I was interested in your comment about living in an RV being illegal. I'm curious, for the U.S. It tends to be one of the better ways to be homeless for families.plus of course people who just choose to live that way but have money - often young singles or elderly people who want to travel.

But for homeless families it's the higher end and generally beats shelters or the street. What do your homeless families do?

[Anny Nym]

@Mama Mia

Giving it a thought, you are indeed right with the "only a few hundred out of 330 millions", it´s just every second family we talk about here seems to force people to listen to their singing offspring. :lol:

But for homeless families it's the higher end and generally beats shelters or the street. What do your homeless families do?

The social state system of my country (as well as others) makes great efforts to not let families become homeless in the first place through various measuremants:

1.) If the family provider becomes unemployed or long-time/permanently ill/disabled, the social security payments (universal unempl. insurance, universal health care payments and at the end of the line "Mindestsicherung"/ Basic welfare coverage)

are usually enough to cover rent or small mortgage, except one has high rent/mortgage. Then there might be a need to move to more modest lodgings.

2.) State subsidized housings are a big thing over here (2 in 5 it think).

But they - to my quite limited knowledge of the US-System - work entirely different than the us- "Section 8" (?) housings. The main difference is that everyone can get subsidized housing (due reasons of social intermix and to prevent "ghettos"), so called "Genossenschaftswohnungen" or "Gemeindewohnungen", which have staggered rent/mortgage systems: "You earn more, you pay more(but still less than on the private market)/you earn less, you pay less!" So this prevents homelessness due sudden decline in income in the first place too.

Also, there are some welfare options available, like short term coverage and state loans, but this varies from fed.state to state.

{L_MESSAGE_HIDDEN}:

PLUS: tenant laws. You just can´t "kick out" someone that easy, especially not a family. This particular point is actually a bit of a blessing and curse at the same time - I could tell you some wild stories from my in-laws, who own apartment buildings in a city with high basic price, underdeveloped state housings due non-availability of arable spots and high fluctuation due it´s geographical location (Salzburg City).

The property management ...has a blast.

HOWEVER if none of this is a possibility (and of course this happens over here too!), there are usually emergency apartments for families, provided by the federal state or the biggest semi-state organization, Caritas. There they stay until their situation is sorted out.

(We of course also do have homeless shelters, but they are more for single persons.)

They always try to keep families together, BUT IF the parents/guardians are unwilling or not able (drug addicted for example) the children go to state foster homes or foster parents.

But you can´t just live in your car, even if it´s a RV! That can´t be your adress, you can´t just park on a highway lot and live there - this is flat out illegal. For good reasons! I am of course not saying they never ever exist at all, but they would have quite a hard time to stay under the radar and not get detected right away, especially with small kids.

Okay, super-long post, I´m sorry if I have derailed the thread :embarrassed:

[Mama Mia]

Anny Nym, thank you for the explanation. Not to further derail, but I am so jealous ! It's generally illegal to just park and live on road sides / parking lots here as well. But lots of people do. To give you an idea of the difference here -- families wandering about in RV's camping illegally are often difficult to even Count as " homeless" for services - because they are so much better off than most other homeless families. It can be done, but it takes extra paper maneuvering. And once a family does count as homeless the shelters are usually full, the emergency housing has years long waits and the Section 8 list is often closed. Section 8 works like you describe, sliding scale, but you have to be very low- income at the start. And it's hard to find landlords who will take it.

Sorry, back on topic -- wow, that family really is very very deranged. :shock:

It's really sad reading the boys posts about his family fleeing Satanic abuse-- in 1993! I don't know what they are running from -- i would get real money it's not Satanic abuse-- but how sad that this boy who wasn't even born yet talks like its a current event!

[ViolaSebastian]

I also think homeschooling (and, more specifically, the ability to home school without a great deal of oversight) plays into it. There's no way that these families would be able to adopt this nomadic lifestyle if they were legally required to send their children to school outside the home, like they are in Germany, for example. It makes it much easier to pull up stakes and cram your kids into an RV.

[Anny Nym]

@MamaMia, you are welcome!

I´ll put it under spoiler, before a admin sends me to the prayer closet for further derailing! :lol:

I lately have read some articles and seen a documentary on youtube about the Topic of poor and homeless teens in the american midwest or homeless students in New York... so unbelieveable sad, I have no words for honestly!

In Vienna, which has the nickname of "Europes biggest landlord" most subsidized housings are owned by the state. It began as a social-democratic prestige project ("Palaces for the working classes") in the 1920s.

They are currently building a new district, the "Lake City of Aspern" which is a mix of state subsidized housings, assisted living for elderly and disabled, alternative community housings and apartments by private investors side by side and some in the same buildings. Oh, and of course a lake ! :D

This is how a Caritas-organized day center for homeless people looks like (it´s a video, in german though, but you can see how it looks like.

Okay, I hope I didn´t bore you too much, but I´m A GEEK if it comes down to this things and love to talking about it! :lol:

And that Walmart Family indeed is deranged! Did anyone else think they look like the "after" photos on this "Don´t do meth" ads? :shifty-kitty:

[tropaka]

http://www.azcentral.com/story/news/loc ... /70393078/

more detail here - it seems they did pull the first officer's gun

[Gingi1976]

The Gaver Family received a home from Habitat for Humanity in 2004.

http://www.businesswire.com/news/home/2 ... RReBPnF9-4

The home was returned to Habitat in 2010.

http://www.idahostatesman.com/2015/03/2 ... .html?rh=1

[TXGirlInAMaterialWorld]

Oh my- that is a whole lotta nuttiness in one family. Very sad that it turned out violent.

[NotALoserLikeYou]

COTTONWOOD, AZ (KPHO/KTVK) - Video from the dashboard camera of a Cottonwood Police Department cruiser showed a close-knit Idaho family that appeared nearly invulnerable to stun guns, police batons and fists during a melee in a Walmart parking lot March 21 in which one person was killed and one officer wounded by a gunshot.

Cottonwood Police Chief Jody Fanning showed the video during a news conference Friday morning and said no matter what tactics officers used, nothing appeared to deter the family of eight. The dash-cam was the only one of three that was operational that night, Fanning said.

Four officers arrived at the Walmart after employees called about one of the Boise, ID, family members pushing an employee to the ground outside one of the store's bathrooms.

The family had gathered outside their older model Chevrolet Suburban when officers arrived. The confrontation started when one of the officers said they would split up the family to talk with them about what happened inside the store, Fanning said.

But the father, 55-year-old Peter Gaver, and one of his sons stepped in and told police they wouldn't allow them to separate the family, Fanning said. Another officer approached the mother, 52-year-old Ruth Gaver, and her 11-year-old daughter when one of the brothers ran in between them.

Police Sgt. Jeremy Daniels grabbed the man and the melee was on, Fanning said.

The family utilized tactics that had to be "taught," Fanning said. For instance, they knew that punching officers on the body was futile because of their protective vests. Instead, the fought

officers by grabbing at their eyes, ears and mouths and pulling hard.

They also had been taught to roll after they were shot with stun guns in order to break the wires and stop the shock, and to appear to give up by putting their hands in the air in order to get close to attack again. The family refused orders to "get on the ground" and eventually overpowered

Daniels. Two of the suspects, including Enoch Graver, battled the officer for his gun, which went off and wounded him in the leg.

Four more officers arrived and Enoch Graver, 21, was shot to death and his 18-year-old brother David Graver was shot in the abdomen.

Even with eight officers on the scene, nothing the officers tried appeared to stop the family, including the use of stun guns, pepper spray and police batons. In almost every instance, the suspects continued to fight the officers. Fanning said to four people to get one of the brothers in handcuffs and two officers to get the remaining male suspects in cuffs.

A Walmart loss prevention employee, whom Cottonwood police knew, was also key in preventing more harm being done to family members or the original four officers on the scene, Fanning

said. The employee fought to protect the officers throughout the brawl.

Fanning said he was not only proud of his officers and the Walmart employee fortheir roles, but of the civilians who came to the aid of Daniels.

The family included the father and sons Jeremiah, 29; Nathaniel, 27; David, Enoch; a 15-year-old boy; mother Ruth Gaver, 52; and an 11-year-old girl.

All were living out of the Chevrolet Suburban and were members of a traveling band called Matthew 24 Now, a reference to a Bible verse dealing with the end of times. The band's Facebook page is rife with Biblical references.

Seven other Cottonwood police officers suffered cuts and bruises.

File this video under "wtf did I just watch?"

liveleak.com/view?i=6e3_1428698048

And here's the police conference and video breakdown:

youtu.be/Ki-R0d7DIAE

Article:

[NotALoserLikeYou]

Sorry, here's the original article

gawker.com/video-one-dead-after-christian-street-performers-brawl-1697193268?utm_campaign=socialflow_gawker_facebook&utm_source=gawker_facebook&utm_medium=socialflow

On Friday, authorities in Arizona released a video showing a chaotic brawl between police and a family of Christian street performers, an incident that left one man dead in a Walmart parking lot last month.

According to police, the confrontation began when members of the Boise-based Gaver family attacked officers responding to an alleged assault in Walmart bathroom. The fight reportedly turned deadly when 21-year-old Enoch Gaver grabbed Sgt. Jeremy Daniels' gun and shot him, causing another officer to return fire. From NBC News:

The brawl broke out when eight officers from the Cottonwood Police Department responded to a call on Saturday, March 21 that a female Walmart employee had been physically assaulted when trying to enter a store restroom, according to a statement from police. When officers arrived, the suspects — identified by police as members of the Gaver family — were in the parking lot attacking a second store employee, and immediately began attacking officers who tried to break up the melee, Arizona Department of Public Safety spokesman Bart Graves said.

The newly released video appears to show officers and suspects punching and kicking one another, and officers using Tasers, batons and pepper spray on several members of the Gaver family. An officer identified as Sgt. Jeremy Daniels appears to be on the ground in a struggle with a suspect over the officer's weapon. An officer identified as Officer Rick Hicks appears to shoot one man in the stomach before fatally shooting a man on top of Daniels.

"The officers did a very good job of restraining themselves,'' Cottonwood Police Chief Jody Fanning told The Arizona Republic. "I have no reason why [the Gavers] decided to fight us."

According to The Republic, the Gavers were well-known around Boise as members of Matthew 24 Now, a Christian acoustic band that would play for tips outside a local supermarket. "We won't do any events where there's gonna be illegal drugs," states the band's Facebook page. "Or any form of promiscuity."

Here's the family facebook

Facebook.com/Matthew24Now