Religious Liberty Double Standards Indicated In New Poll

[doggie]

Like duhh we need a poll for this?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/2 ... 37969.html

WASHINGTON (RNS) Half of Americans worry that religious freedom in the U.S. is at risk, and many say activist groups -- particularly gays and lesbians -- are trying to remove "traditional Christian values" from the public square.

The findings of a poll published Wednesday (Jan. 23), reveal a "double standard" among a significant portion of evangelicals on the question of religious liberty, said David Kinnaman, president of Barna Group, a California think tank that studies American religion and culture.

While these Christians are particularly concerned that religious freedoms are being eroded in this country, "they also want Judeo-Christians to dominate the culture," said Kinnamon.

[debrand]

I posted a reply and hit Save as Draft instead of Reply.

Here it is again but my first post was brillant and would have changed everyone's life for the better. too bad you will never be able to read it. :lol:

What is happening is that the dominant religion is loosing power and is being asked to treat other relgions and non religions on equal terms. Instead of being gracious, many evangelicals claim that they are attacked.

Two examples.

A straight couple holding hands and cuddling is not seen as offensive. A same sex couple doing the same thing is 'shoving their homosexuality down people's throats."

Evangelicals can put up signs declaring their faith, pass out pamphlets and knock on doors to win souls to Christ. If an atheist did the same thing, he or she would be accused of attacking Christianity.

[dramallama]

Like duhh we need a poll for this?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/2 ... 37969.html

WASHINGTON (RNS) Half of Americans worry that religious freedom in the U.S. is at risk, and many say activist groups -- particularly gays and lesbians -- are trying to remove "traditional Christian values" from the public square.

The findings of a poll published Wednesday (Jan. 23), reveal a "double standard" among a significant portion of evangelicals on the question of religious liberty, said David Kinnaman, president of Barna Group, a California think tank that studies American religion and culture.

While these Christians are particularly concerned that religious freedoms are being eroded in this country, "they also want Judeo-Christians to dominate the culture," said Kinnamon.

I am SHOCKED. Shocked, I tell you! :shock:

[doggie]

I am SHOCKED. Shocked, I tell you! :shock:

I bet you are.

[doggie]

What is happening is that the dominant religion is loosing power and is being asked to treat other relgions and non religions on equal terms. Instead of being gracious, many evangelicals claim that they are attacked.

.

Yep they are loosing power and freaking out. Happens all the time. of course they are right and very good caring Christians that are the holiest of all.

[NjoyingNsanity]

Not really surprising when things like this http://religionnerd.com/2011/02/10/godd ... tate-town/ the discrimination case can happen to pagan group and there little to no media coverage of it, but if some dominionist Christian gets their panties in a wad because they have to take down a display of the ten commandments from a school or government building Fox News is all over it.

Edited to fix broken link.

[Childless]

I'm pretty much sick of the Christian attitude of "OMG! I'm being persecuted because other faiths exist in my country and people actually practice them!!!11!!" Why can't people just leave other people alone? Who cares if someone is Pagan or Hindu or Buddhist or Atheist or worships the flying Spaghetti Monster. As long as they aren't trying to kidnap you and force you to sit through one of their services or preventing you from going to your own, you should keep your mouth shut and let them live their lives as they see fit. Most Christians I know would have a shit fit if someone of a different religion bothered them at dinner time trying to convert them, but they have no qualms about doing the same. Why should anyone give you respect when you don't give them respect in return?

[SamuraiKatz]

They polled a few over a thousand people..Is study even valid?

[SamuraiKatz]

I'm pretty much sick of the Christian attitude of "OMG! I'm being persecuted because other faiths exist in my country and people actually practice them!!!11!!" Why can't people just leave other people alone? Who cares if someone is Pagan or Hindu or Buddhist or Atheist or worships the flying Spaghetti Monster. As long as they aren't trying to kidnap you and force you to sit through one of their services or preventing you from going to your own, you should keep your mouth shut and let them live their lives as they see fit. Most Christians I know would have a shit fit if someone of a different religion bothered them at dinner time trying to convert them, but they have no qualms about doing the same. Why should anyone give you respect when you don't give them respect in return?

I know we have a like button...but I wanted to QFT this post anyway.

[kolga]

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/friendlyatheist/2013/01/25/arizona-republicans-propose-bill-that-would-not-allow-atheists-to-graduate-high-school/

So much for the First Amendment.

[YPestis]

Are we supposed to be surprised by this? I've noticed this for years now. How the people that are most concerned about "religious liberty" are also those that fight hardest to maintain required religious practices in the public sphere.

These people cry persecution because they want to require teacher led prayers and public money for private (CHRISTIAN) schools. You ask them what happens if the teacher is a Muslim and wants to lead a Islamic prayer or if public money goes to a Hindu school and these people would be APPALLED and shocked that this could ever happen.

The reason for this disconnect is simple. Some conservatives fail to notice that society is the same as Ozzie and Harriet. They want to make laws based on the assumption that everyone is still a Christian, that every major institution is still Christian-centered. They want to believe that only a small group of atheist/secular humanist/nonChristians have joined up against them to topple "their" religious liberty. Hence, they push for laws that affirms Judeo-Christian values in every which way because "everyone" should be able to practice their faith freely----and they assume that "everyone" is Christian except for a few weird individuals out there. It baffles the mind of some that there are large groups of people that are nonChristians and may not want to be subjected to mandatory Christian practices.

The other issue is that many conservative Christians feel strongly that their own religion is very benign, so any exposure to it by outsiders is at best beneficial, and at worst, neutral. Plus, some of the most strident believers are also the least tolerant of other religions. Yes, those that feel it's ok to evangelize to children of their own religion would be APPALLED if the same treatment was given to their own children. Heavens! Exposing secular kids to the Bible will make them better people, but handing out the Koran to children is worse than giving them heroin!

I've met people who grew up only exposed to Christians and they honestly find it baffling that I, a nonChristian, would object to a store that mandates Sundays off (aka Chick-Fil-a) or ban alcohol sales on Sundays. How bad is that? Well, I ask them how would they feel if they couldn't buy bread on Saturdays because of someone else's religious observances or had to take off Friday and work on Sundays? How bad is that? Yeah, it's interesting when the shoe is on the other foot......

[EyeQueue]

I'm pretty much sick of the Christian attitude of "OMG! I'm being persecuted because other faiths exist in my country and people actually practice them!!!11!!" Why can't people just leave other people alone? Who cares if someone is Pagan or Hindu or Buddhist or Atheist or worships the flying Spaghetti Monster. As long as they aren't trying to kidnap you and force you to sit through one of their services or preventing you from going to your own, you should keep your mouth shut and let them live their lives as they see fit. Most Christians I know would have a shit fit if someone of a different religion bothered them at dinner time trying to convert them, but they have no qualms about doing the same. Why should anyone give you respect when you don't give them respect in return?

Oh noes!!11, Childless. Your ebil, persecutin', anti-Christian post was also your 666th.

Coincidence? I think not. :dance:

[LeopardLady]

I know people can be hypocritical when it comes to their own beliefs all the time, but I still don't understand how people can claim to be arguing for something and not realize that what they really want is the exact opposite of what they claim to be fighting for.

[RosyDaisy]

Double standard indeed. Gays, lesbians, Atheists, and non-Christians are not taking away religious liberties, they just want the same rights as everybody else and to be left alone to live in peace. Gays, lesbians, and Atheists aren't banging on my door trying to convert me, but I can think of several other Christian groups that do on a regular basis.

[clone]

I've met people who grew up only exposed to Christians and they honestly find it baffling that I, a nonChristian, would object to a store that mandates Sundays off (aka Chick-Fil-a) or ban alcohol sales on Sundays.

You've hit the nail on the head with exposure. Even when they're exposed to non-Christians, they're insulated because they truly believe they are Right. Even when they espouse one thing and act out another (pre-marital sex, drinking, smoking pot, etc.), they still know they have the True Answers and can be welcomed back into the fold with a small prayer, of "please forgive me, Jesus" as many times as necessary.

Even the non-Christians or non-fundie Christians reinforce the attitude because extreme right-wing conservative values match up on so many key points. So there is little to counter those attitudes even in the more liberal Christian fundamentalist circles. They sow their wild oats, but don't give up those core, indoctrinated values. They go to college, get married and settle down into copies of their parents and perpetuate the cycle. It's easier not to question. 'Faith' is their security blanket. I can tell you from personal experience, that they really do feel baffled and sorry for people who don't "get it". And they definitely feel superior. The smugness is astounding. I think one of the hardest things to do is lose one's religion, even when a person is an open-minded, critical, rational thinker.

The double standard to them doesn't exist because they ARE the standard.

[salsa]

I know people can be hypocritical when it comes to their own beliefs all the time, but I still don't understand how people can claim to be arguing for something and not realize that what they really want is the exact opposite of what they claim to be fighting for.

When it's pointed out to them, you get a response something along the lines of it being for everyone's good. Make being gay illegal? It's for their own good because we're saving their souls. Disallowing the practice of any religion but Christianity? it's for their own good because, since only Christians can go to heaven, we're saving their souls. Making children learn the Bible and pray in public schools? It's for their own good because if everyone were Christian, the USA would be a utopia.

[Rosa]

these kinds of polls and news articles ignore the fact that even other kinds of Christians exist.

At this point in my life - this didn't used to be true, because it used to be so much harder to find a church you could go to if you were gay - but at this point in my life, most of the gay and lesbian people I know are Christian (also I'm old and a parent, so aside from our babysitter all the lesbians I know are married and have kids). You can be gay and Mennonite, gay and Lutheran, gay and Methodist, gay and Episcopalian, etc, with no conflict at all on the individual level. The churches that do not fly rainbow flags stand out around here (plus they post bigoted things on their church signs in election season, just to make sure we can find the sore thumb.) And then there are the people who converted to Metropolitan Community or go to an insurgent Catholic parish.

As a Jewish friend of mine has started saying "What about the religious freedom of the Reform Jews to marry anyone we want? My rabbi would marry queer couples in a second."