Fundie Inconsistency...

[kunoichi66]

shocking, I know! But bear with me.....

Isn't there an...idea, perhaps...in Christianity if not in the Bible that Christians are supposed to be in the world, but not of it? I think it branches off from Corinthians where Paul is talking about not braiding your hair with gold and all that. I definitely remember it having something to do with Christians dressing in a manner which communicated that they were not part of the mainstream, though they lived among those people and had dealings with them.

The point of the above paragraph is this: These fundies (particularly the Maxwells) isolate themselves and their families from the world 'outside'. How do they reconcile this with the idea that Christians should be out among the people?

[Pclee]

shocking, I know! But bear with me.....

Isn't there an...idea, perhaps...in Christianity if not in the Bible that Christians are supposed to be in the world, but not of it? I think it branches off from Corinthians where Paul is talking about not braiding your hair with gold and all that. I definitely remember it having something to do with Christians dressing in a manner which communicated that they were not part of the mainstream, though they lived among those people and had dealings with them.

The point of the above paragraph is this: These fundies (particularly the Maxwells) isolate themselves and their families from the world 'outside'. How do they reconcile this with the idea that Christians should be out among the people?

This is exactly the reason why even though my family is "fundie" to some extent, my parents did not encourage us to be SAHDs. Besides the fact that it is financially unwise, they believed that we needed to be "in" the world to establish our convictions and learn the exact meaning of that Bible verse you quoted.

I would agree with you too, that the dressing style of many fundies (talking more modest-modern here rather than frumper-style) originates from this passage in the Bible and others like it.

[alysee]

It's why I went to Catholic school instead of being homeschooled. People do interpret it differently.

[Snickerdoodle]

While it's not a quote from a specific scripture passage, it's an over-arching theme of Christianity based on several Bible verses. The general meaning is that while a Christian lives in society and culture, those things should not be the primary influence on his life choices and his thinking. His worldview should be Biblically based.

Fundies take this to the extreme (as they do so many things!), some so far as saying a Christian should be isolated from the culture at large (Amish), or not watch TV or movies, or read certain books, or listen to certain music. I've never had a single fundie be able to explain how they're supposed to share the gospel if they have very little relational contact with unbelievers. Ultimately, fundies' religious practices are all about THEM, and how those practices supposedly make them more holy and acceptable to God. Which misses the whole point of the gospel.

[fluttershies]

Actually it is from specific quotes - John 17 (where Jesus prays that His followers would be in the world but not of it) and Romans 12:2 (about not conforming to the pattern of the world).

I agree with the rest of your comment though, Snickerdoodle.

[Snickerdoodle]

Actually it is from specific quotes - John 17 (where Jesus prays that His followers would be in the world but not of it) and Romans 12:2 (about not conforming to the pattern of the world).

I agree with the rest of your comment though, Snickerdoodle.

Yes, the John 17 passage does address the concept. My point was just that there's no commandment in the Bible that specifically says, "Be in the world but not of it." I just wanted to make sure readers understood that if they try to find that exact phrase in the Bible, it's not there. :)

[kunoichi66]

Yes, the John 17 passage does address the concept. My point was just that there's no commandment in the Bible that specifically says, "Be in the world but not of it." I just wanted to make sure readers understood that if they try to find that exact phrase in the Bible, it's not there. :)

Lol, yes, I did notice that it was an amalgamation on my travels through google.... (I don't have my own bible yet).

It's just all so strange! I don't know how on earth these families justify it! Particularly the Maxwells, since they don't talk to anybody.

[QAF_Rocks]

Fundies take this to the extreme (as they do so many things!), some so far as saying a Christian should be isolated from the culture at large (Amish), or not watch TV or movies, or read certain books, or listen to certain music. I've never had a single fundie be able to explain how they're supposed to share the gospel if they have very little relational contact with unbelievers. Ultimately, fundies' religious practices are all about THEM, and how those practices supposedly make them more holy and acceptable to God. Which misses the whole point of the gospel.

But fundies do spend an inordinate amount of time proselytizing. They just don't want to be "unequally yoked" by having friendships or close relationships with nonbelievers, lest they or their families become tainted and/or fall away from the church.

It's bad, sure, but if someone is having "relational contact with unbelievers" with the secret hope of converting them, I don't think that's much better. I almost respect the fundies more because at least they're honest about what their belief system entails.

[Kitty]

shocking, I know! But bear with me.....

Isn't there an...idea, perhaps...in Christianity if not in the Bible that Christians are supposed to be in the world, but not of it? I think it branches off from Corinthians where Paul is talking about not braiding your hair with gold and all that. I definitely remember it having something to do with Christians dressing in a manner which communicated that they were not part of the mainstream, though they lived among those people and had dealings with them.

The point of the above paragraph is this: These fundies (particularly the Maxwells) isolate themselves and their families from the world 'outside'. How do they reconcile this with the idea that Christians should be out among the people?

The Westboro Baptist people don't isolate themselves- all of the kids go to public school, and the adults were educated in the same public schools. They're quite unusual among fundies.

Fundies are not really Christians, but they like to pretend they are. So instead of actually following the Bible, they cherry-pick and warp the out-of-context verses to justify an isolated, heavily patriarchal lifestyle that isn't very Biblical at all. They're creating a new kind of "mainstream" in their own community. Which... is totally not what Jesus said. Or even Paul, for that matter. Neither one advocated the kind of isolation fundies practice. They knew there would be non-Christians, and knew perfectly well that Christians might be a minority (because they definitely were at the time the New Testament was written). And they knew that the Good News would never get out if fundies just isolated themselves.

Of course, a fundie's response would be something along the lines of "We don't isolate ourselves! We do follow the Bible! We pulled our kids out of public schools because we could do a better job/the violence/the drugs/the sex/the bullying/the schools don't teach the right skills/the kids don't need that much education! And women stay at home to take care of the kids because that's what the Bible says! The men go out and work like they're supposed to!" :roll:

[kunoichi66]

The Westboro Baptist people don't isolate themselves- all of the kids go to public school, and the adults were educated in the same public schools. They're quite unusual among fundies.

Fundies are not really Christians, but they like to pretend they are. So instead of actually following the Bible, they cherry-pick and warp the out-of-context verses to justify an isolated, heavily patriarchal lifestyle that isn't very Biblical at all. They're creating a new kind of "mainstream" in their own community. Which... is totally not what Jesus said. Or even Paul, for that matter. Neither one advocated the kind of isolation fundies practice. They knew there would be non-Christians, and knew perfectly well that Christians might be a minority (because they definitely were at the time the New Testament was written). And they knew that the Good News would never get out if fundies just isolated themselves.

Of course, a fundie's response would be something along the lines of "We don't isolate ourselves! We do follow the Bible! We pulled our kids out of public schools because we could do a better job/the violence/the drugs/the sex/the bullying/the schools don't teach the right skills/the kids don't need that much education! And women stay at home to take care of the kids because that's what the Bible says! The men go out and work like they're supposed to!" :roll:

It makes more sense, put that way.

[QAF_Rocks]

Fundies are not really Christians, but they like to pretend they are.

No True Scotsman? Just because they don't interpret the religion the way you would like, that doesn't make them any less Christian. Christianity is a matter of self-identification. People who interpret the Bible in a rigid, closed-minded way aren't that different from those who interpret it in a progressive, open-minded way. Conservative Christians can point to their scriptures and defend their point of view the same way that liberal Christians can.

[nomi]

That was kind of the mindset of the church I escaped from. In some ways you had to be of the world so that you would be accepted and best able to make a change from within. In my eyes it made it even more insidious than the typical fundie fare of completely setting yourselves apart because on the outside they appeared SO normal.