Botkinettes blog, just in time for Valentine's Day!

[Marian the Librarian]

In which A-S and E once again post a predictably convoluted, brain-herniating essay, the jist of which is: you're still single! Just like us! Stop praying for "'Missionary Martyr Malibu Ken,' and if you find yourself Valentine-less this Valentine’s Day, that means the Lord is giving you more time to die to sin and live to righteousness!"

In other words, menfolk=good, wimminfolk=bad. :roll:

[merrily]

Is Michelle going to post about her girls and their 'waiting for prince charming' too?

[Anny Nym]

And so the transformation of "Botkin Sisters" into "Bitter Sisters" goes on... :(

On Valentine´s Day, I´d like to gift all SAHDs (ESPECIALLY the Botkinettes) with this lil´story (imagine it written with red sharpie and alot of pink glitter around...) here:

There was an old man sitting on his porch watching the rain fall. Pretty soon the water was coming over the porch and into the house.

The old man was still sitting there when a rescue boat came and the people on board said, "You can't stay here you have to come with us."

The old man replied, "No, God will save me." So the boat left. A little while later the water was up to the second floor, and another rescue boat came, and again told the old man he had to come with them.

The old man again replied, "God will save me." So the boat left him again.

An hour later the water was up to the roof and a third rescue boat approached the old man, and tried to get him to come with them.

Again the old man refused to leave stating that, "God will save him." So the boat left him again.

Soon after, the man drowns and goes to heaven, and when he sees God he asks him, "Why didn't you save me?"

God replied, "You dummy! I tried. I sent three boats after you!!"

PS: Hy! *waves* newbie here #^_^

[merrily]

And so the transformation of "Botkin Sisters" into "Bitter Sisters" goes on... :(

On Valentine´s Day, I´d like to gift all SAHDs (ESPECIALLY the Botkinettes) with this lil´story (imagine it written with red sharpie and alot of pink glitter around...) here:

There was an purity baller sitting on his porch watching datable men go by. Pretty soon there was a crowd going by her door .

The purity baller was still sitting there when young man with green hair came and said, "Would you like to go on a date with me?."

The purity baller replied, "You'll have to ask my headship first." So man left. A few years later, another man came, dressed in a fine suit, and asked the purity baller again.

The purity baller again replied, "God will send a godlier man to me." So the man left her again.

Years later the third man, the son of a preacher approached the purity baller, and tried to get her to come with him on a date.

Again the purity baller refused to leave stating that, "God will send the godliest man to me." So the man left her again.

Soon after, the woman dies a spinster and goes to heaven, and when she sees God he asks him, "I'm a special snowflake, but why did no man pound on my door?"

God replied, "You dummy! I tried. I sent three men to you!!"

PS: Hy! *waves* newbie here #^_^

I'll edit your story a wee bit to fit with the waiting for prince charming.

[Anny Nym]

Indeed!

[nokidsmom]

Good grief, these two going on and on about being single, not finding prince charming yet and turning into it some kind of proof of godlinesis is just pathetic. Subconsciously, those two must honestly be in an absolute panic over nearing 30 and no prospects.

ETA: either Daddy is turning down suitors or those two are managing to scare them off

[Maggie Mae]

You know, while I've never written down what I wanted in a man or wrote a letter to my future spouse, I do recall having conversations as a teen about what my husband would be like. Generally just silly nonsense that contradicted itself, much like that list they posted from "Janey." And I think that is some good advice to younger teens - don't except things from other people that you don't expect from yourself. But the rest of the column is crap. From the first sentence:

Valentine’s Day may be a happy time for couples, but it’s often a painful reminder for single Christian women of what they’re still praying for, hoping for, and – sigh – waiting for.

Because only single Christian women are praying, hoping, waiting for Prince Charming? Plenty of women, Christian, Muslim, Atheist, Don't know don't care, Hindu, Jewish, (you get my point) are waiting and/or hoping or actively seeking a partner/mate/husband/boyfriend/family. It's not a problem exclusive to Christianity. Being single on Valentine's Day is a problem that transcends religion and affects plenty of humans (at least in the US. I have no idea if anyone else celebrates a holiday that was created to sell candy and trinkets.)

Many of us don’t have a valentine this year because we’ve been holding out for someone special. We have high standards, and we’ve stuck to them, and now we’re having to eat the fruits of this resolve (instead of Godiva chocolates).

You have to find someone special. A substitute milkman is not going to knock on your door, see you , and ask your father for permission to court. You have to go out there and get what you want. Find a hobby, do some volunteer work, meet people with similar interests. No one is telling you to sign up for Christian Mingle.com, although that might not hurt. And you know, it's not like you can only get Godiva if someone gets them for you. Go to the store and buy some stupid chocolates if you want chocolate. Go Friday, they will be half off.

The bad news is, none of us are naturally likeable, desirable, or eligible. Because of sin, we all start out as ugly stepsisters, and we don’t automatically become Cinderella upon reaching marriageable age. The good news is, “He himself bore our sins in his body on the tree, that we might die to sin and live to righteousness.†(1 Pet. 2:24) And the rest of the good news is, if you find yourself Valentine-less this Valentine’s Day, that means the Lord is giving you more time to die to sin and live to righteousness, more time to make yourself ready, more time to become a better gift.

Actually, some people are much more likable than others. Some babies are more likable than other babies, although hardly anyone is willing to admit it. It's because we all have different personalities and our personalities shape who we are, and some people are drawn more to certain personalities than others. That is okay.

However, I don't think it's because of sin. I also hope these ladies don't think of themselves as unlikable, or undesirable, or ineligible. Because that is one of the biggest turnoff to other people, IMO. No one wants a Debbie Downer for a wife, especially in this weird invisible gated community that they are entrenched in.

[Avalondaughter]

Good grief, these two going on and on about being single, not finding prince charming yet and turning into it some kind of proof of godlinesis is just pathetic. Subconsciously, those two must honestly be in an absolute panic over nearing 30 and no prospects.

ETA: either Daddy is turning down suitors or those two are managing to scare them off

I think this post is proof of their panic. The fake prayer is just their own inner selves talking. They worry they have set the standards too high and are asking, "Are we being spoiled princesses? Maybe we should work on what's wrong with us." I think the panic is causing self-blame. They may be worried it's getting to find Mr. Perfect and they had better learn to settle.

Edited for clarity

[VampireProtectYou]

:o I think they must really hate being still single. I do wonder why at least one of the sisters is not married into the Phillips clan.

[YPestis]

I really can't stand the girls' whining. Yes, I've known the pain of being single for Valentine's Day. However, I made an effort to put myself out there. I had "realistic" standards. I was willing to kiss some frogs go find my prince. Why can't the Botkins' girls realize they, too, can be proactive in their search for a guy? All their sighing and pining won't produce anything. They are beautiful, talented young women. Surely, there are nice guys available out there. I vaguely remember they expect young men to submit papers or answer rolls of questions before courting. Well, ain't that romantic? How can one hope to really know a person by answering a string of questions and talking to only daddy? You know, I guess this is Darwin at work. Those girls lack the understanding to attract a mate. I guess they have removed themselves from the gene pool permanently.

[Olive Plant]

The bad news is, none of us are naturally likeable, desirable, or eligible. Because of sin, we all start out as ugly stepsisters, and we don’t automatically become Cinderella upon reaching marriageable age. The good news is, “He himself bore our sins in his body on the tree, that we might die to sin and live to righteousness.†(1 Pet. 2:24) And the rest of the good news is, if you find yourself Valentine-less this Valentine’s Day, that means the Lord is giving you more time to die to sin and live to righteousness, more time to make yourself ready, more time to become a better gift.

That's right. Only those who have claimed Christ's blood, bathed in it daily, and self-flagellated to an appropriate extent are going to become Cinderellas in time to be a prince's "gift."

Everyone else, ugly stepsister!

Let me just say, I will be nobody's "gift." I will be myself, discerning, powerful, and passionately loving. I will share my life with another, an equal, that I consider worthy. This is more rewarding and wonderful than parading down an aisle to meet my daddy-approved "prince" and being presented to him as glorified chattel, as I know from experience.

For Valentine's day this year, I'm going on a romantic adventure (for lack of a better term; I don't even know what we're doing) with a self-described hopeless romantic who is far more attractive, far more attentive, and far more family-oriented than that supposed Christian prince I married and then divorced. I respect this non-Christian man because he is worth respecting, not because he has a penis and has memorized several Bible passages and the tenants of Biblical Manhood. He respects me as well, because I am worth respecting.

And that, Botkinettes, is how love is supposed to be.

[snarkyjan]

Good grief, these two going on and on about being single, not finding prince charming yet and turning into it some kind of proof of godlinesis is just pathetic. Subconsciously, those two must honestly be in an absolute panic over nearing 30 and no prospects.

ETA: either Daddy is turning down suitors or those two are managing to scare them off

I'm thinking that Daddy has chased off many a suitor, without even tellnig either girl that he was approached. Since Geoff is nobody's idea of a roaring social or financial success it's probably vital to his mental health to have someone, somewhere under his thumb. If the thumb-ees are his own children, and his helicopter parenting stunts their emotional health, well too bad. That's the price they pay for being under Daddy's "umbrella of protection" (vomit).

[SamuraiKatz]

I vaguely remember they expect young men to submit papers or answer rolls of questions before courting. Well, ain't that romantic? How can one hope to really know a person by answering a string of questions and talking to only daddy?

Skip daddy, go directly to EHarmony. ;) More fun that way...

[Soldier of the One]

I just don't understand how these 'older' SAHD's are not yet matched to a suitable suitor. It undermines the whole premise of Biblical Patriarchy and courtship. And therefore, in undermines their whole theology and ministry. Do they not see that?

[Lillybee]

I would love to start a fundie on line matchmaker service. It may be a way to earn some serious money.

[Anny Nym]

They seem to "overlook"alot of things.

For example, There WAS NEVER AND IS NO age or culture where the matchmaking for marryable young women contains only that one option "sit around in your house, do no socializing whatsoever with the other sex or have send word around you are willing to marry and pray for some guy dropping by your house and doing a FAQ with your dad before he even could say Hi to you". This is just unnatural!

There´s either the often-not-so-nice way of parental-arranged marriages, often including a professional matchmaker, or there are many social or religious events meant to mingle the teenagers so they could find a spouse.

btw. I inherit a book from my granny which was written in 1885 and aimed at young girls ("Trotzkopf"/"stubborn girl") - a godawful product of its era, Lady Lydia would love some parts though, BUT there are also some chapters including a warning about the consequences of not bring out a young lady aka letting her go to balls etc. to meet potential suitors: They will all end up old nagging hags, being a burden on their enviroment! :whistle:

So much for the SAHDs-glorified victorian times, eh....?

[debrand]

They seem to "overlook"alot of things.

For example, There WAS NEVER AND IS NO age or culture where the matchmaking for marryable young women contains only that one option "sit around in your house, do no socializing whatsoever with the other sex or have send word around you are willing to marry and pray for some guy dropping by your house and doing a FAQ with your dad before he even could say Hi to you". This is just unnatural!

There´s either the often-not-so-nice way of parental-arranged marriages, often including a professional matchmaker, or there are many social or religious events meant to mingle the teenagers so they could find a spouse.

btw. I inherit a book from my granny which was written in 1885 and aimed at young girls ("Trotzkopf"/"stubborn girl") - a godawful product of its era, Lady Lydia would love some parts though, BUT there are also some chapters including a warning about the consequences of not bring out a young lady aka letting her go to balls etc. to meet potential suitors: They will all end up old nagging hags, being a burden on their enviroment! :whistle:

So much for the SAHDs-glorified victorian times, eh....?

The Botkins seem to adore Jane Austen. Of course, they ignore her snarky commentary on marriage but they love the outer trappings of that time period. You'd think that they would realize that most of the young people are paired up at social meetings. There is even some flirting among the nonmarried people.

[Rosie]

I particularly like these two contradictory characteristics (and will refrain from commenting on the wording/grammatical structure of the second):

*Isn’t interested in money

*Can support me in the style I would like to be accustomed to

[ThatSnark]

BUT there are also some chapters including a warning about the consequences of not bring out a young lady aka letting her go to balls etc. to meet potential suitors: They will all end up old nagging hags, being a burden on their enviroment! :whistle:

^^^^THIS RIGHT HERE. Look, I come from a long line of LCMS and Calvinist fundies and lites, and even in their highly-repressed parental roles, my forbears allowed their daughters to visit with young men from church in the parlor under the watchful eye of a parent or sibling. If there was mutual interest, engagements and marriages happened, and thanks to that, I exist. These Victorian and Edwardian relatives of mine were exceptionally careful with their daughters' (and sons') reputations, but they didn't hold them back to the point of not being able to participate in what was then considered normal late-teen life. Sheesh.

These people have romanticized Victorian childhood and patriarchy, but they left out the social ritual of the debutante ball, or in my family's case, a coming-out tea dance which all the young ladies had somewhere near their 18th birthday. It was a not-so-subtle way of letting the community know that Miss Ante-Snark was fair game. Why can't these characters do something similar?

(also, hello-- coming out of lurkdom because the VF'ers have been blowing my mind for years now, and I am almost beyond understanding what point they are trying to make)

[HereticHick]

How long before someone in the QF/Vision Forum crowd realizes that their courtship model simply isn't working, and sets up some sort of online service, available only to headships, for the daddies to discretely advertise their progeny to each other?

"Father seeks godly man for demure King's Daughter, age 30. She excels at memorizing bible verses, making smoothies, photographing friends on railroad tracks, and layering 4 layers of tops and a scarf. Her interests include cappucinos, thrift store shopping & loving the Lord. Attached is a photo of her lovely countenance. We will FedEx a sample of her chickenetti to interested suitors. "

[wtylcf]

The Botkin sisters are super attractive, they are intelligent (even if they have hateful opinions and a bizzare Disney movie fetish), they dress well, they are always industriously working on some project, and they couch everything in the language of feminine submission. On paper, they sound like ideal women from a fundie viewpoint. But in reality, they have probably intimidated any prospects by their ice-princess act, or their Dad has driven away anyone willing to chance it with some ridiculous requirement like theological debates, holding them up to an impossible standard. Most likely the thought of being Geoff's son-in-law is tremendously unappealing even for most normal fundie lads. It's so sad, when their entire schtick is to be Godly maidens in waiting for a husband, that it could very well never happen. You'd think Geoff would at least be cognizant that if neither daughter gets married, it's a PR disaster for them and for him.

(Or they could cut their losses, get out from under Geoff's thumb and go live with awesome cousin Katie till they were de-programmed. Her blog is so great).

[ktofny]

Jacob met Rachel when she was bringing her sheep to the well, and Moses met his wife when she and her sisters were being bullied by some shepherds. Just two examples of girls getting out into the community, doing some (very difficult) work, and not shunning conversation with menfolk. I don't understand why these young ladies should just sit around at home and wait for someone to show up.

[nokidsmom]

The Botkin sisters are super attractive, they are intelligent (even if they have hateful opinions and a bizzare Disney movie fetish), they dress well, they are always industriously working on some project, and they couch everything in the language of feminine submission. On paper, they sound like ideal women from a fundie viewpoint. But in reality, they have probably intimidated any prospects by their ice-princess act, or their Dad has driven away anyone willing to chance it with some ridiculous requirement like theological debates, holding them up to an impossible standard. Most likely the thought of being Geoff's son-in-law is tremendously unappealing even for most normal fundie lads. It's so sad, when their entire schtick is to be Godly maidens in waiting for a husband, that it could very well never happen. You'd think Geoff would at least be cognizant that if neither daughter gets married, it's a PR disaster for them and for him.

(Or they could cut their losses, get out from under Geoff's thumb and go live with awesome cousin Katie till they were de-programmed. Her blog is so great).

To the bolded: yes, they do appear to be the ideal fundie women in many ways and so one would expect quite a few fundie guys vying for their hands. However, that's not happening nor has there any indicator of it ever happening, and so here they are, still single, still waiting. And it's not just one of them, it's both of them, which suggests to me something went wrong here. My theory is that they probably had suitors when they were younger but dealing with Daddy drove the guys off, hence word has probably gotten around to not to bother trying because of impossible standards. Succeeding isn't worth it either, with gaining Geoff as a father-in-law. And the ice-princess act from both of the sisters doesn't help. Between their dad and their fundie princess act, they are shooting themselves in both feet as far as marriage prospects.

[debrand]

The Botkin sisters are super attractive, they are intelligent (even if they have hateful opinions and a bizzare Disney movie fetish), they dress well, they are always industriously working on some project, and they couch everything in the language of feminine submission. On paper, they sound like ideal women from a fundie viewpoint. But in reality, they have probably intimidated any prospects by their ice-princess act, or their Dad has driven away anyone willing to chance it with some ridiculous requirement like theological debates, holding them up to an impossible standard. Most likely the thought of being Geoff's son-in-law is tremendously unappealing even for most normal fundie lads. It's so sad, when their entire schtick is to be Godly maidens in waiting for a husband, that it could very well never happen. You'd think Geoff would at least be cognizant that if neither daughter gets married, it's a PR disaster for them and for him.

(Or they could cut their losses, get out from under Geoff's thumb and go live with awesome cousin Katie till they were de-programmed. Her blog is so great).

They are very pretty but they also wear a lot more makeup than many of the fundie girls do. Unlike some of the younger girls, they don't have the fresh faced, innocence of younger fundie women. That is unfair and outside of the fundie world, their intelligence and attractiveness would count for more than extreme youth. In their world, a woman's main function is to adore her husband and push out babies. Both Botkin sisters seem too intelligent to blindly adore any man but their dad-and if they left home, they might loose some of the adoration of their dad.

[Soldier of the One]

I sometimes wonder whether they actually want to pursue marriage themselves. Their life is pretty comfortable right now within their own context: they get to engage with intellectual pursuits, speak publicly, write, travel, have fun with hobbies and develop social contacts. They might have a bit of spending money/financial independence from their revenue. Faced by the actual prospect of submitting to a man, bearing children, keeping house... I am not sure whether they are chomping at the bit. They'd basically swap their 'professional' lives (which frankly, are quite glamorous, I think - no real drudgery there) for that of a common fundie housewife.