Fundies and the Flu

[starfish]

Does it seem like fundies are afflicated with the flu more than other folks?

Perhaps they just write about it more, since they blog the minutia of their lives. But I suspect none of them get the flu shot, because

EBIL VACCINZE and all. They don't work, they don't go to school. It's okay for them to waste weeks and weeks of their lives with the flu, recovering from

a "lingering flu". It just seems like it strikes them right after Christmas, and then

they take an extra month off of homeschooling, etc. It's the ultimate pass for their lives.

I want to tell Crystal Paine of MSM just GET THE FLU SHOT already. She and her family spend Christmas-May sick.

Rant over.

[Aisling]

I've never got a flu jab in my life, and I've never got the flu. People always seem to say they've got the flu when they have nothing of the sort. I bet they all just have really bad colds and can get away with feeling sorry for themselves, like you say,it's not like they are missing school or work.

[gloraelin]

People who don't get "the flu" seen at the doctor scare the shit out of me. I got pneumonia twice in a year once, when I was ten or so... and I probably would've wound up in the hospital if my parents hadn't, gasp, taken me to see a doc. We homeschooled at that point, and I had asthma, and I know exactly how scary it is to be that sick and not get better for a very long time. The possibility some of these kids have asthma or other immune issues is there, and you just know that at some point, one of them isn't going to make it.

[Wolfie]

I agree that a lot of people say they have the flu when it's really a bad cold or a stomach bug. I can only count three times in my 37 years where I know it was the flu. Two of the three times I did get over it without seeing a doctor- but I was very lucky, and I was exhausted for months afterwards, the third time I developed walking pneumonia, so I did end up at the doctors. (I was very lucky last time I had the flu, as it was H1N1 that hit early and a lot of my students ended up hospitalized.)

However, I am a huge proponent of flu shots, and people who just knock them and say that they are ineffective, or worse, that they make you sick really annoy me.

[Miggy]

I agree most people who say they have flu actually have a bad cold, both in the real world and in fundyland.

I do have my own explanation for why fundies are sick all the time; diet and lack of immunity. (I am basing this on observations from my fundy-in-laws and several home-school-fundy-lite friends.)

Regular kids are in contact with other people from the time they are quite young. Two and three year olds have colds pretty much perpetually as they build up their immune system. Fundy kids are kept isolated so don't have the chance to build up immunity as a toddler. None of them eat high quality diets as emphasis is based on feeding their large family as cheapily as possible, rather than feeding them well. The lack of exposure to illness while young means they are still vunerable as they get older. The lack of good nutrition means they don't have a lot to fall back on when they do get sick so they get sicker than those of us who eat well.

[Conuly]

Being overworked, tired, stressed, malnourished - any ONE of those things can wreak havoc on your ability to fight disease. Raising small children will make you stressed, overworked, or tired. Living in an isolated way will make you stressed. Being poor with lots of kids will certainly make you malnourished, more so if you are the biological mother because being pregnant uses up a lot of resources.

It's not that these things make people sick, but they don't help.

And with many people in the family, a disease can take a while to run its way through everybody. During that time, even those who have recovered or have not yet fallen sick will be extra put-upon because there are fewer workers and more people who need care.

Lack of medical treatment exacerbates this, and lack of vaccines doesn't help.

That doesn't mean they all have the flu in the literal sense. Like most people, they probably are using the term to simply mean "a bad cold or other general respiratory ailment".

Edit: also, yes, lack of immunity isn't helping either. And that doesn't just go for the kids. The flu mutates easily. That's why you have to get a new shot every year if you get them. Colds mutate easily. That's why we have NO shot against the cold. If you don't get regular exposure to a disease you are immune against, either through vaccines or through contracting it at another time, your immunity may weaken.

[Buzzard]

I agree that a lot of people say they have the flu when it's really a bad cold or a stomach bug. I can only count three times in my 37 years where I know it was the flu. Two of the three times I did get over it without seeing a doctor- but I was very lucky, and I was exhausted for months afterwards, the third time I developed walking pneumonia, so I did end up at the doctors. (I was very lucky last time I had the flu, as it was H1N1 that hit early and a lot of my students ended up hospitalized.)

However, I am a huge proponent of flu shots, and people who just knock them and say that they are ineffective, or worse, that they make you sick really annoy me.

THIS. I've gotten the flu shot for as long as I can remember. As far as I know, I've had it once in 25 years. I was in college and was diagnosed by a Dr. Other than that, it was a cold. I just wish tamiflu was OTC so I could not expose others to it should my flu shot fail me!

[starfish]

After I posted that, the diet issue came to mind. I think the Paine's diet isn't too great. It basically consists of "everyone gets 2 morsels of the

garbage I fixed, and then I'm freezing the rest b/c OMG FREEEEEEZER Mealz!" I don't think I've ever seen a green vegetable or fresh meat in

her menu plan. The thing is, they've got the money to eat properly. I think she starves them all to maintain control like a lot of fundies

moms do. That's another topic...

The self-imposed isolation resulting in no immunity is a great point. In the Payne's case, Jesse's around the commoners so I'm sure he brings

home all the viruses. I think that youngest child has asthma. You'd think they get those kids the flu shot, or that the entire family would

get the vaccine, but I'm pretty sure they don't from her earlier posts on BW.

[ADoyle90815]

THIS. I've gotten the flu shot for as long as I can remember. As far as I know, I've had it once in 25 years. I was in college and was diagnosed by a Dr. Other than that, it was a cold. I just wish tamiflu was OTC so I could not expose others to it should my flu shot fail me!

Same here, it's been 13 years since I actually had the flu, and I had it at least one other time that I can think of. Other times, it was just a bad cold or a stomach bug of some type. I just had my annual checkup at the doctor's office, and I noticed they already had a box of surgical masks on the counter for those who were there with flu-like symptoms.

[YPestis]

I agree that the word 'flu' gets thrown around a lot. However, let's not discount the possibility of higher prevalence amongst fundies. They tend to have larger families with younger children. Yes, they are more isolated if the kids homeschool but dad is not always home all day. Once one member have the virus, it's very easy for the rest of the family----especially with many young children----to get it as well. I would say that fundies are not more likely to contract the disease, but living in close proximity to so many people means the disease hits the family harder (with multiple members getting it).

Fundies not vaccinating is another issue. Yes, there are plenty of people that don't get the flu shot and never get the disease. However, many do get the flu without the vaccination. For people prone to getting sick, the vax is a good idea. Fundies, with so many young children, should be extra vigilant about getting it. The flu is just a big pain for healthy adults, but for the elderly and the very young, it can be fatal.

[DarkAnts]

For most people, the flu is not going to develop into complications like pneumonia. The only people that need to really worry about that are the very young, the old, and those with immune problems. Part of the reason they encourage everyone to get the immunization is to protect the people that are most at risk of dyeing of complications. If you get the immunization then you are less likely to pass it on to more vulnerable populations.

[Austin]

I agree that a lot of people say they have the flu when it's really a bad cold or a stomach bug. I can only count three times in my 37 years where I know it was the flu. Two of the three times I did get over it without seeing a doctor- but I was very lucky, and I was exhausted for months afterwards, the third time I developed walking pneumonia, so I did end up at the doctors. (I was very lucky last time I had the flu, as it was H1N1 that hit early and a lot of my students ended up hospitalized.)

However, I am a huge proponent of flu shots, and people who just knock them and say that they are ineffective, or worse, that they make you sick really annoy me.

ITA!

Up to 49,000 people succumb annually to influenza in the USA. It amazes me that people don't take flu more seriously.

http://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/disease/us ... deaths.htm

The flu strains have to be predicted and yes, sometimes the predictions are not spot on, obviously. But they are right way more than they are wrong. This year's flu is largely H3N2, according to what I heard on NPR the other day, which the vaccine matches up with well.

[tropaka]

Last year, when the outbreak wasn't so bad, our family got the flu - total body aching, feverish flu. If you have a fever and malaise, it's NOT a cold.

I ended up hospitalized for two days with it. Real flu's no joke.

[DarkAnts]

ITA!

Up to 49,000 people succumb annually to influenza in the USA. It amazes me that people don't take flu more seriously.

http://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/disease/us ... deaths.htm

The flu strains have to be predicted and yes, sometimes the predictions are not spot on, obviously. But they are right way more than they are wrong. This year's flu is largely H3N2, according to what I heard on NPR the other day, which the vaccine matches up with well.

My town has two types of flu going around. One type is 100% covered by the vaccination the other is 70%. The 70% is due to a mutation. But, 70% protection is better then 0% protection. It also means that there are less severe symptoms for those who get it.

[gloraelin]

My school sent out an email yesterday talking about the flu season, urging everyone who hasn't already gotten a flu shot to get one. Apparently this is going to be the worst flu season in a decade, and while it's possible to get the flu after getting the shot, the symptoms are much more manageable. I get the shot every year [compromised immune system, and my BF has a shunt from his brain to his stomach and is at high risk of said flu], and I've had the flu once in ... jeeze, like fifteen years? The only reason I got said flu was because everyone did, because that was the year the Educated Guess of flu strains failed.

I agree that the diets of these people probably aren't helping... when I was growing up the most "exotic" food I ever saw veggie-wise was canned beets, and I know of far too many others who had the same kind of meal setup. That plus... I know that I was pretty lucky and had a lot of outside contact, and I still got the flu a number of times, whereas these kids often don't have that extra boost... although playing in the dirt helps immune systems, and since many of these families do their own landscaping, gardening, or what have you... it's definitely something.

[Wolfie]

Same here, it's been 13 years since I actually had the flu, and I had it at least one other time that I can think of. Other times, it was just a bad cold or a stomach bug of some type. I just had my annual checkup at the doctor's office, and I noticed they already had a box of surgical masks on the counter for those who were there with flu-like symptoms.

Yes, the years I had the flu- one was before the flu shot was common, then one was a year I didn't get the shot like I should have, and the third was when h1n1 came through before the shots were offered in this area. (I've noticed that they moved up the shot timeline since that year too.) Years I've had the shot, I've never had more than a bad cold.

[samithemage]

At 30, I have had the real flu twice in my life, once as a kid (around 12ish) and once as an adult. As a kid, I remember I slept on the couch so my mom could keep better track of me. I remember one of the days I was sick, I fell asleep around 7pm. I remember my mom waking me up even though I was ridiculously tired and miserable and looking at the clock that said 6:30, I feverishly yelled at her for waking up so early when I was so sick. She told me it was 6:30 at night and that if I didn't at least drink some water she was going to take me to the emergency room. When I had it as an adult I was actively symptomatic sick for at least a week, and thorough exhausted and barely able to function for two weeks after that.

I've also, honestly only had the flu shot 3 times in my life, and every time I've gotten sick afterwards. Not flu sick, but achey and dizzy with a low grade fever and it lasts for at least two days. I don't know why it happens, but I do know that it does. I've never had a problem with any other vaccine. The last two years I've sucked it up and gotten the shot, since I don't want to have the actual flu or pass it to anyone else, but the side effects do suck (not anywhere nearly as much as the flu though)

[Anise]

Are you all obscenely healthy or something?

I get the flu at least once a year- and I don't mean a bad cold.

Could be that I never got out much as a kid, so still I catch everything that goes around, including some weird sickness that apparently only I get.

[miffy]

Last time I had a cold was in 2009 right after my first experience of a European winter. I get hayfever & the odd tummy upset but nothing more. I put it down to washing my hands all the time, lots of exercise, using a neti pot & a good diet.

[gloraelin]

Are you all obscenely healthy or something?

I get the flu at least once a year- and I don't mean a bad cold.

Could be that I never got out much as a kid, so still I catch everything that goes around, including some weird sickness that apparently only I get.

Pfft, no, I'm so incredibly not healthy. I'm actually heading into the second month of some upper respiratory crud that I can't shake... but it's not the flu. I just catch everything else.

[Evilbad]

Little kids are total spreader monkeys, so the big families with lots of small kids are probably more likely to get sick and stay sick for a longer time. With so many kids running around, you can't be sure they're washing their hands and doing the things you need to in order to clear up a sickness in a home.

We don't go to the doctor unless there's a fever that lingers, or something that can't be cleared up with OTC meds. Most times they just tell you to rest and hydrate, anyways.

Beyond that, this flu season is rough, even with the flu shot we have all been sick multiple times, as have all our friends, and it's been nasty. Christmas and new years, we we're just sick and sick and sick, it was ridiculous. I was sick for almost a month straight this season, it sucked. And I got the flu shot, for all the good it did me lol.

[moodygirl86]

I've never had proper flu, just colds, and like other people here, it annoys me when people use flu to mean a bad cold! When I was about nine or 10, my mum had actual flu - she didn't have the energy even to go to the toilet. I was really scared because this is the woman who forced us to go to school even if we felt like crap. Her rule of thumb was that if you can stand up and you're not vomiting, then you're not really ill. Although I can sort of understand the exaggeration as some people may feel it adds gravitas to how crap they're feeling. If you ring in sick with a cold, your boss won't always be sympathetic, even if you're really contagious for the first couple of days and you'll only make your colleagues ill too if you come in. That's my own personal rule of thumb - if I'm feeling shite with a cold, then so will everyone else who I pass it on to, so for me it's about consideration for others. I can see both sides, I guess...

[MonkeyMomma]

Little kids are total spreader monkeys, so the big families with lots of small kids are probably more likely to get sick and stay sick for a longer time. With so many kids running around, you can't be sure they're washing their hands and doing the things you need to in order to clear up a sickness in a home.

We don't go to the doctor unless there's a fever that lingers, or something that can't be cleared up with OTC meds. Most times they just tell you to rest and hydrate, anyways.

Beyond that, this flu season is rough, even with the flu shot we have all been sick multiple times, as have all our friends, and it's been nasty. Christmas and new years, we we're just sick and sick and sick, it was ridiculous. I was sick for almost a month straight this season, it sucked. And I got the flu shot, for all the good it did me lol.

Ugh, our day care is going through this this winter. All the kids keep getting sick, and spread it to each other, and in turn give it to the parents. I'm 90% sure my kiddo got the strain of flu that's not covered in the vaccine, and we've been home for a week. I can't imagine having a whole pack of 'em feeling like this.

[Wolfie]

Are you all obscenely healthy or something?

I get the flu at least once a year- and I don't mean a bad cold.

Could be that I never got out much as a kid, so still I catch everything that goes around, including some weird sickness that apparently only I get.

Do you get the flu shot? And has it been diagnosed by a doctor?

But no, not obscenly healthy, I have a few chronic problems actually, but I always get my flu shot because I can't be incapacitated for weeks if I were to get the flu- I have a job, I have animals to take care of, and I have a house and myself to take care of, as I'm single.

[maybeizfundie]

Y'all are just sadly misinformed.

Do you not know that bone broth and essential oils are *totally* better than those horrible toxic shots?

:lol:

We haven't had the flu ever in this household, regardless of shot status, though I try to get us all vaxed on time every year. When my sister was a kid, she had the flu and then got pneumonia as a complication and it was very scary. It seems to be particularly bad this year, so I am glad for our vaxes.

Like with anything else, fundies vary. Essential oils are the big health thing right now. I know a lot of people, from fundie to anti-fundie who are terrified of vaccinations and totally believe that half an onion left to sit in a room will suck that flu virus right out of the air and save you from getting sick.