Fanatical Christians

[freethinker]

I think that a lot of them are looking for a way to be absolved of their past life & all their guilt before being saved. Like the drug user or alcoholic. They have someone saying that all their sins of the past can be forgiven. Wiped clean if they accept the free gift. I feel this is why so many of the born againers are so overzealous. The others have been brought up in the fanatical fundie mindset of being brainwashed by parents so they know no other way of life. What do you think?

[Sola]

They say that about ex-smokers. There is nobody worse on a smoker than an ex-smoker.

[holierthanyou]

I wonder if, to some extent, people's brain can be genetically wired for a stronger tendency toward religious zeal or fanaticism (in any form)?

I absolutely think environment is a huge contributing factor, but I'm curious what role (if any) "dna" might play in it. ("dna" in quotation marks because I am scientifically-challenged and not entirely sure 'dna' is the right term for what I was trying to relay).

[Sola]

Yes it can. There is some research out there over that. I'll try and find a link, but I do remember reading it in one of the journals at work.

[changemanagement]

I was thinking trading one addiction (drugs, drinking, etc.) for another (religion).

[latraviata]

They say that about ex-smokers. There is nobody worse on a smoker than an ex-smoker.

I stopped smoking about 3 years ago. I am perfectly ok with people smoking in my house/presence.

[Sola]

It can, especially in those with an addictive personality.

But I think what Holier is referring to is the brain chemistry. In some people, fanaticism is shown in the pleasure center of the brain. What you see in brain scans is that when people who have a high degree of religiosity, when they are shown religious images associated with their religion, the pleasure centers of the brain, in particular the accumbens nucleus, lights up like a Christmas tree. In effect the person is 'getting off' on religion (in a non-sexual way). In other people there is no measurable difference, but in those who profess a high degree of devotion to their religion, it is shown in a high degree of increased brain activity in those areas.

[thoughtful]

Yes it can. There is some research out there over that. I'll try and find a link, but I do remember reading it in one of the journals at work.

Does Pascal Boyer's writing address this?

http://www.amazon.com/Religion-Explaine ... 0465006965

[valsa]

I have noticed that a LOT of the fundies I know of had a wild past. Drinking, partying, sometimes drugs, and many of the wives have children from previous (ungodly) relationships. I think they were so miserable being used for sex and their bodies in their youth that they shotgunned to the other extreme. I've also seen that many of the wives/mothers with wild backgrounds are very intent with "protecting" their daughters from that sort of thing. It's as if they can't imagine that you can grow up in mainstream society today and not be a partier/drinker/promiscious person.

[Sola]

Yes to some extent. The research I am referring to though came out in the last couple of years I think.

I think I've found it; From Brain Imaging Religious Experience to Explaining Religion: A Critique by Azari Nina, Slors Marc

http://radboud.academia.edu/MSlors/Pape ... A_Critique

Andrew Newberg, a neuroscientist in the US has wrote a few books about it too.

[holierthanyou]

Thanks for the link, Sola.

[Sola]

You're welcome. I remember reading about it work, it does make a lot of sense.

I do think there are some people who are incapable of what might be classed by some as a 'religious experience'. As an atheist who was brought up in a very Christian family, I can say that I never experienced anything like that. I had doubts from a very early age but it was only in my teens when I realised there was a word - atheist - for people like me. None of it ever made any sense and I have lost count of the times when I have been told, 'if only you would open your mind and just believe'. Sorry, but I can't! There is no conscious choice there it is just the way I am.

Perhaps these fundamentalists have something that I don't. Perhaps that increase in brain activity during religious thinking/experience is something that is genetic. I wouldn't at all be surprised if this type of brain feedback is seen in other non-religious fanatics.

I do also wonder how many people who in the fundamentalist circles, fake it because everyone else around them is a fundie so even though they don't 'feel it' (or believe it, or experience that increase in activity in the brain), they fake it because they have to fit in.

[samurai_sarah]

I have noticed that a LOT of the fundies I know of had a wild past. Drinking, partying, sometimes drugs, and many of the wives have children from previous (ungodly) relationships. I think they were so miserable being used for sex and their bodies in their youth that they shotgunned to the other extreme. I've also seen that many of the wives/mothers with wild backgrounds are very intent with "protecting" their daughters from that sort of thing. It's as if they can't imagine that you can grow up in mainstream society today and not be a partier/drinker/promiscious person.

^This. At least that's what sent a beloved relative over the edge. But add to that that she came from a very unstable background, and had no self-esteem. In classic fashion, they got to her when she was down, and offered her a way out.

[freethinker]

I agree with the addictive personality & fanatics. I've seen this as well.

[Phyllis Stein]

My father used to call it the Reformed Whore Complex.

[dairyfreelife]

I have noticed that a LOT of the fundies I know of had a wild past. Drinking, partying, sometimes drugs, and many of the wives have children from previous (ungodly) relationships. I think they were so miserable being used for sex and their bodies in their youth that they shotgunned to the other extreme. I've also seen that many of the wives/mothers with wild backgrounds are very intent with "protecting" their daughters from that sort of thing. It's as if they can't imagine that you can grow up in mainstream society today and not be a partier/drinker/promiscious person.

Some of the bloggers and people we read do have this and I could see it. I became a fundie when I was trying to find myself in high school after I got "saved" and I was desparate to feel a part of it (because I did not feel changed after being saved them. I felt nothing). I got in deep and just fell in. I fell out the same way a few years later when I discovered more and grew up more. I don't know if I was really fanatical, just definitely fundie. I did not party or drink or any of that before.

[Cran]

I do not have the impression that many fundies have a particular wild past. My impression is that many make more things up that they actually did or restyle some minor, innocent teenager behaviour in order to be able to tell a real "salvation story".

[FlorenceHamilton]

You're welcome. I remember reading about it work, it does make a lot of sense.

I do think there are some people who are incapable of what might be classed by some as a 'religious experience'. As an atheist who was brought up in a very Christian family, I can say that I never experienced anything like that. I had doubts from a very early age but it was only in my teens when I realised there was a word - atheist - for people like me. None of it ever made any sense and I have lost count of the times when I have been told, 'if only you would open your mind and just believe'. Sorry, but I can't! There is no conscious choice there it is just the way I am.

Perhaps these fundamentalists have something that I don't. Perhaps that increase in brain activity during religious thinking/experience is something that is genetic. I wouldn't at all be surprised if this type of brain feedback is seen in other non-religious fanatics.

I do also wonder how many people who in the fundamentalist circles, fake it because everyone else around them is a fundie so even though they don't 'feel it' (or believe it, or experience that increase in activity in the brain), they fake it because they have to fit in.

I feel the same way.

[CanadianHippie]

I stopped smoking about 3 years ago. I am perfectly ok with people smoking in my house/presence.

Not everyone who converts becomes fanatical. But there are plenty of ex-smokers out there who make it their mission to tell anyone and everyone who will listen about how nasty and horrible smokers are; just as there are plenty of religious converts who make it their mission to tell everyone how nasty and evil non-[religion] people are.

[Mama Mia]

The crowd of people I grew up with was pretty rough .. and many of my friends ended up with some serious drug issues and related criminal behavior.

Growing up some people were religious, some weren't .... but as adults many of these people became pretty fanatical Christians as part of their changing their lives/ cleaning up.

I don't think any of them are fundie to the degree discussed here...I just don't ever see people like that, but more than a few seem pretty intensely evangelical.

[BravaAmica]

I think that a lot of them are looking for a way to be absolved of their past life & all their guilt before being saved. Like the drug user or alcoholic. They have someone saying that all their sins of the past can be forgiven. Wiped clean if they accept the free gift. I feel this is why so many of the born againers are so overzealous. The others have been brought up in the fanatical fundie mindset of being brainwashed by parents so they know no other way of life. What do you think?

Fanatical xtians remind me of addicts in active addiction: frenetic, desperate behaviors that protect their supply (church, bible studies, ect); thinking everyone else around them is either wrong or out to get them because their whacked out behavior isn't unconditionally supported; lots of ritual and superstition and habits around their addiction.