Laire Lightner - prophesying a resurrection. (TW death)

[Katzchen24]

I don't even known where to start with this one. It seems so out there I'm not 100% convinced it isn't some kind of terrible joke.

Laire Lightner is a major MLM shill. She is the mother of 5 and has been around for a while. Her 21 yo son, Franky, was in a motorbike accident sometime around the 18th of September, put onto a ventilator. Sadly, the ventilator was later withdrawn and he died. This is not a trauma any family deserves to endure. 

However, Laire is also a big time prophetess (here is a link to her webpage, Throne Life). Instead of grieving, she was convinced Franky could be resurrected if she interceded with God enough and had her whole family praying to this end. There's a whole lot of stuff going on here. All the screenshots were taken from her publicly available FB feed. There's also an image of her children holding up placards praying for Franky to come home on the FB feed but I didn't include it. Just terrible, sad stuff. I think she has accepted now that Franky has indeed died, but a fellow prophet convinced her it wasn't because God didn't want to resurrect him and that she wasn't powerful enough in her intercession, but because Franky didn't want to come back and had chosen to stay in heaven. 

This all makes me so angry. Laire is an adult and can manage her grief and trauma in any way that works for her. But to drag her other children into her delusions is just selfish and traumatic for them. This kind of Jesus superfanning is similar to the revolting things Karissa Collins does with her kids, and I seem to recall this isn't the first time a fundie has prayed for resurrection of a dead child.

Spoiler

 

 

 

She's really got tickets on herself as a prophetess.

I've included some more links to her online stuff under the spoiler. It's a real sh!tshow. Her MLM is also very strongly linked to xtianity, and I'm surprised it hasn't turned up more with some of the other fundies followed on FJ (unless there's just so many MLM's......)

Spoiler

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=1205140343729292

https://t.me/s/ThePatriot17

https://theonglobal.com/Our-Story/?mitem=13692

Oh, and of course there's a fundraiser. There's a GiveSendGo campaign which has raised $21,539 of $100,000 when I checked.

[JermajestyDuggar]

1 hour ago, Katzchen24 said:

I don't even known where to start with this one. It seems so out there I'm not 100% convinced it isn't some kind of terrible joke.

Laire Lightner is a major MLM shill. She is the mother of 5 and has been around for a while. Her 21 yo son, Franky, was in a motorbike accident sometime around the 18th of September, put onto a ventilator. Sadly, the ventilator was later withdrawn and he died. This is not a trauma any family deserves to endure. 

However, Laire is also a big time prophetess (here is a link to her webpage, Throne Life). Instead of grieving, she was convinced Franky could be resurrected if she interceded with God enough and had her whole family praying to this end. There's a whole lot of stuff going on here. All the screenshots were taken from her publicly available FB feed. There's also an image of her children holding up placards praying for Franky to come home on the FB feed but I didn't include it. Just terrible, sad stuff. I think she has accepted now that Franky has indeed died, but a fellow prophet convinced her it wasn't because God didn't want to resurrect him and that she wasn't powerful enough in her intercession, but because Franky didn't want to come back and had chosen to stay in heaven. 

This all makes me so angry. Laire is an adult and can manage her grief and trauma in any way that works for her. But to drag her other children into her delusions is just selfish and traumatic for them. This kind of Jesus superfanning is similar to the revolting things Karissa Collins does with her kids, and I seem to recall this isn't the first time a fundie has prayed for resurrection of a dead child.

  Hide contents

 

 

 

She's really got tickets on herself as a prophetess.

I've included some more links to her online stuff under the spoiler. It's a real sh!tshow. Her MLM is also very strongly linked to xtianity, and I'm surprised it hasn't turned up more with some of the other fundies followed on FJ (unless there's just so many MLM's......)

  Hide contents

https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=1205140343729292

https://t.me/s/ThePatriot17

https://theonglobal.com/Our-Story/?mitem=13692

Oh, and of course there's a fundraiser. There's a GiveSendGo campaign which has raised $21,539 of $100,000 when I checked.

Bethel was the church that prayed for the resurrection of a dead toddler. 

[Giraffe]

12 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

Bethel was the church that prayed for the resurrection of a dead toddler. 

I was thinking of this when I was reading the post. At what point does “faith” become “needs legitimate mental health treatment”? It’s so sad because I assume this delusional hope of resurrection (long past a few minutes flatlined) ends up adding a really awful layer of grief to what is already a traumatic experience. 

Edited September 27, 2023 by Giraffe

[noseybutt]

SAME. Without clicking links, I immediately thought oh the Bethel people are at it again…

Once upon a time Bethel was Assembly of God. But then they became straight charismatic with very little underlying doctrine.

[AmazonGrace]

She is the church. Okay then

[Howl]

15 hours ago, Katzchen24 said:

Oh, and of course there's a fundraiser. There's a GiveSendGo campaign which has raised $21,539 of $100,000 when I checked.

Well, it's not $100,000 but it's something!  

"I have a world-wide body of believers who ARE truly the remnant."

I suspect that any Christians who describe themselves as The Remnant think they are the most super duper xtra special Christian-y Christians. Can I get an "amen"? 

[noseybutt]

I went back and read her prophecies and it's quite dark and disturbing. Nothing too original there, mostly just a rehash of Q Anon theories such as Putin/Russia (the bear) being used by God in a good way and California being called to judgment and John F Kennedy and JFK Jr to return in some sort of messiah-ish role and Trump of course being the chosen one.

What is dark is her continual pronouncements of mass death and destruction.

Also, she does love her a good public social media fight. Seems like she has metaphorically thrown hands with quite a few other "prophets" and any other Christians who push back on NAR theology.

Will shut up now. Would rather discuss her after the trauma of a her son's death is a bit less raw. 

[Antipatriarch]

This phenomenon can happen with miraculous healing too. Some years ago I was made aware through friends of a well-known local Christian performer who was given a terminal diagnosis, virtually no chance of survival. It's certainly normal for Christians to pray that God would do a miracle and heal him... but the family and close friends of this man took it way to extremes, trying to cast out any shred of doubt by sheer force of will, insisting that everyone who came to talk to him spoke only of the certainty that God was going to heal him, etc. When he died, the family had to go through the shock and disbelief and grieving as if it had been a sudden accident that took him away by surprise. They were denied the ability to say goodbye and come to terms with what was about to happen. This kind of performative, insistent faith (especially when forced on others) is not healthy.

[Howl]

On 9/27/2023 at 9:05 AM, noseybutt said:

I went back and read her prophecies...mostly just a rehash of Q Anon theories such as Putin/Russia (the bear) being used by God in a good way...and Trump of course being the chosen one... Seems like she has metaphorically thrown hands with quite a few other "prophets" and any other Christians who push back on NAR theology.

So she's New Apostolic Reformation? That is some scary stuff.  Jenny Cohn (jennycohn@toad.social) and Jim Stewartson (@jimstewartson)  are calling out the dangers of NAR and 7 Mountains Dominionism on toad social and twitter.    As you pointed out about Lightner, she and many NAR people are a toxic mash up of Qanon, Christian nationalism, antisemitism, adore Russia/Putin, Trump blah blah and are on board with  Mike Flynn's  crazy psy op beliefs.  Julie Green is another crazy but influential NAR prophetess. 

These  scary toxic people are more embedded and influential in current politics than many of us can imagine.  Doug Mastriano, who ran for governor of Pennsylvania in the last election, was a NAR candidate who promised to tear down the wall between church and state.  God didn't come through for him and he lost bigly but you can be certain these folks are not giving up. 

The description of Laire Lightner praying to resurrect her dead son also led me to look up the difference between narcissism and HPD (histrionic personality disorder) because so many of these people seem use the cloak of Christianity holiness to mask what is really driving them.  Anyway, for your enjoyment, from the Good Therapy website: Histrionic vs. Narcissistic Personality: What’s the Difference?  

On 9/26/2023 at 5:34 PM, Katzchen24 said:

Laire Lightner is a major MLM shill.

What is she flogging on MLM?

 

 

Edited September 29, 2023 by Howl

[BensAllergies]

On 9/27/2023 at 10:28 AM, Antipatriarch said:

This kind of performative, insistent faith (especially when forced on others) is not healthy.

Even when it’s private it’s not healthy. I remember when my Mormon dad’s father died a few years ago. He had complications after surgery and died from sepsis 2-3 months later. My dad told me that he had been so certain there would be a full recovery, because of faith and prayers and priesthood blessings. So it was a shock to him when he finally came to terms in those last few days and started saying goodbye. Grief is always hard but 100% trust that religion will bail you out of hardship is dangerous.

Edited September 29, 2023 by BensAllergies

[noseybutt]

2 hours ago, Howl said:

So she's New Apostolic Reformation? That is some scary stuff.  Jenny Cohn (jennycohn@toad.social) and Jim Stewartson (@jimstewartson)  are calling out the dangers of NAR and 7 Mountains Dominionism on toad social and twitter.    As you pointed out about Lightner, she and many NAR people are a toxic mash up of Qanon, Christian nationalism, antisemitism, adore Russia/Putin, Trump blah blah and are on board with  Mike Flynn's  crazy psy op beliefs.  Julie Green is another crazy but influential NAR prophetess. 

These  scary toxic people are more embedded and influential in current politics than many of us can imagine.  Doug Mastriano, who ran for governor of Pennsylvania in the last election, was a NAR candidate who promised to tear down the wall between church and state.  God didn't come through for him and he lost bigly but you can be certain these folks are not giving up. 

The description of Laire Lightner praying to resurrect her dead son also led me to look up the difference between narcissism and HPD (histrionic personality disorder) because so many of these people seem use the cloak of Christianity holiness to mask what is really driving them.  Anyway, for your enjoyment, from the Good Therapy website: Histrionic vs. Narcissistic Personality: What’s the Difference?  

What is she flogging on MLM?

 

 

Yes, she's NAR.

It's very dark. Somehow there is going to be mass death and destruction but America will be reborn as the city on the hill. It makes zero sense. A complete lack of awareness that the level of destruction they prophesy would result in an endlessly traumatized survivor population rather than a glorious triumph.

And yes, there are people who think like that at all levels of government. I'm not so sure that Clarence Thomas's wife doesn't buy into it. 

[Alisamer]

On 9/26/2023 at 9:12 PM, Giraffe said:

I was thinking of this when I was reading the post. At what point does “faith” become “needs legitimate mental health treatment”? It’s so sad because I assume this delusional hope of resurrection (long past a few minutes flatlined) ends up adding a really awful layer of grief to what is already a traumatic experience. 

It's a really fuzzy line, isn't it? Like, there are groups of people who think ANY faith in anything supernatural of any sort makes a person in need of mental health treatment, but they are on the extreme end. I think definitely what this "prophet" was doing is by far over the line into "time for a mental health hold."

Also... isn't the whole point of Christianity to get into heaven? Why would she be all "he's coming back, I know it, I'm going to make God send him back" if she thinks he's achieved the end goal of life and is in heaven? If heaven is really all amazing and perfect and even half as great as they proclaim, why in the world would anyone WANT to come back from that? Like, "Oh, I'm here in this perfect place with perfect happiness with all my wants and needs met and in perfect union with God and there's nothing better I can even begin to imagine... Nah, I'll go back home where everyone has to work and the world is imploding and I'll probably be in pain from my horrific injuries for a very long time. See ya later, God! Thanks for letting me visit!"

[Giraffe]

45 minutes ago, Alisamer said:

Also... isn't the whole point of Christianity to get into heaven? Why would she be all "he's coming back, I know it, I'm going to make God send him back" if she thinks he's achieved the end goal of life and is in heaven? If heaven is really all amazing and perfect and even half as great as they proclaim, why in the world would anyone WANT to come back from that? Like, "Oh, I'm here in this perfect place with perfect happiness with all my wants and needs met and in perfect union with God and there's nothing better I can even begin to imagine... Nah, I'll go back home where everyone has to work and the world is imploding and I'll probably be in pain from my horrific injuries for a very long time. See ya later, God! Thanks for letting me visit!"

A hyper-religious friend of mine has a friend going through medical hell. The woman is ultimately dying of brain cancer. I signed up to receive the CaringBridge updates on her and it’s astounding to me how relentless her family has been to keep her alive. If they were atheists I’d totally understand doing all of the heroic measures. But because of their belief in an afterlife I’m truly dumbfounded at all the interventions they’re doing to keep her alive. 

[Katzchen24]

13 hours ago, Howl said:

What is she flogging on MLM?

She's into something called Theon Global who sell a very limited number of supplement products.  There is a link to it in my first post and it's worth following just for the names of the packages and the overblown sales rhetoric. It seems like a real contradiction. 

[Howl]

On 9/29/2023 at 9:27 PM, Katzchen24 said:

She's into something called Theon Global who sell a very limited number of supplement products.  There is a link to it in my first post and it's worth following just for the names of the packages and the overblown sales rhetoric.

Found the link, thanks. 

Well, their products are very special!  Meaningless word salad description from their very slick website: 

PATENTED FULVIC ISOLATION TECHNOLOGY™

We use an innovative production process that leverages physical principles to extract the many fractions of humic substances, including humic and fulvic acid. Having diverged from the industry-standard residue-adding base-acid reactions, we are unbound by the constraints of chemical extraction. We select and isolate compounds at the molecular level and are therefore able to produce traditional and custom products that are concentrated, environmentally friendly, and purer than alternative fulvic mineral products.

Humic acid - it's what plants crave! 

Summary of WEBMD re humic acid:  *shrugs*  Not enough info, who the heck knows what it does. 

 

Edited October 1, 2023 by Howl

[Antipatriarch]

On 9/29/2023 at 12:16 PM, Giraffe said:

If they were atheists I’d totally understand doing all of the heroic measures. But because of their belief in an afterlife I’m truly dumbfounded at all the interventions they’re doing to keep her alive.

Even many atheists don't do this. In my experience they're much more likely to support physician-assisted death than believers are. I have a work colleague who just went through this; the grandmother of his (non-religious) family got a diagnosis for something only minimally treatable and that was going to cause her increasing pain and suffering before the end. She chose to depart on her own terms before it got bad. Her family loved her very much but were totally supportive of her decision. They planned final trips and activities, and spent extended time with her in a meaningful goodbye. Honestly the way he described it, it was beautiful. No question they grieve (he misses her very much), but there was no desperate attempt to prolong her life at any cost.

[Giraffe]

13 minutes ago, Antipatriarch said:

Even many atheists don't do this. In my experience they're much more likely to support physician-assisted death than believers are.

Oh yeah, absolutely! As an atheist myself I support it. My comment was from a belief-in-an-afterlife vs not standpoint.
 

I have a family member who I won’t be surprised if at some point she decides to work with an organization like Final Exit Network or another similar one in order to end her suffering. I’m not sure she’s aware of organizations like that (and we’re not close enough for me to bring it up) but one day it hit me that I would support her in it because - for her - death is the only way she will be “at rest” in her life, even though it she won’t know she’s at rest.