Two Einwechter Grandchildren Drown - MERGE

[DomWackTroll]

Two of William Einwechter’s grandchildren apparently drowned in a car accident on Monday night.

eliseandenoch.org/

Einwechter, who sometimes wrote on the Vision Forum site/blog, is most famous for his defense of stoning disobedient teenage/adult children:

puritanboard.com/f54/william-einwechter-stoning-disobedient-children-33845/

ETA a little more info from Theonomy Resources:

theonomyresources.blogspot.com/2014/02/support-jonathan-einwechter-family.html

[doggie]

sad to say but maybe god showed him what his beliefs are like in reality? Sad this is the way fundies think. poor children drowning is a horrible way to die.

[ThisOlGirl]

Damn, I didn't mean to like such a terrible thing. Those poor babies.

[ILoveJellybeans]

I don't know much about this family, but what a terrible thing to happen :(

[doggie]

yes the poor kids but these people wanted to kill or have other peoples children killed. so very sad for the children for sure but it is hard to feel sorry for someone that wanted death to others children.

[Childless]

Sad to say, but those children are probably better off now.

[defraudingjezebel]

What a sad situation. That is a horrible way for those young children to die. I hate to say this, but I hope this incident softens this man's heart. I hope he sees that calling for a parent to sentence their own child to death is a horrible, downright evil thing to say.

[BravaAmica]

So, anyone want to ask him what the grandkids were being punished for? You know, since he advocated parents killing disobedient children.

ETA: I feel awful that the children died in such a horrifying, terrifying way. But I have no sympathy for this man. He states, publicly, many times, that parents should kill children that don't behave. So I want to know what he was punishing them for.

[doggie]

this is a classic "be careful what you wish for you may actually get it"

[samurai_sarah]

I can't snark on this. Even if the family's views are horrible, two children are dead. It's just sad.

[ljohnson2006]

This is not snarkworthy. It's sad. No matter how crazy the family is.

[debrand]

I can't snark on children's deaths either and I feel for the parents. What a sad tragedy to happen to such a young family.

That doesn't change the fact that the grandfather has chosen a very cruel, warped view of the world

Grandfather's words:

In this case, the son in view is not a child, for the sins brought forth in testimony to show his contumacious manner are gluttony and drunkenness (v. 20); hardly the sins of the average 6 or 10 year old. The case also indicates that the parents have tried to restrain their son, but all their efforts have failed (vv. 18, 20); specifying that he is physically beyond their control. Furthermore, the parents bring their son to the magistrates to judge the matter (v. 19); hence, the son would have opportunity to speak on his own behalf. All of this indicates that the "son" in question is no mere child but, rather, a young man at least in his middle teens or older. As Wright observes, "The law is not talking about naughty children but about seriously delinquent young adults."3

Second, the problems associated with this son are severe. This is not the case of a child who has failed to do his chores, spoken back to his parents, or even committed a serious act of disobedience, but of a son of dissolute character who is in full rebellion to the authority of his parents--he holds them and their word in contempt. The text says that the son is "stubborn" and "rebellious" (vv. 18, 20). Both of these descriptive terms are active participles thus indicating habitual action. The son does not display a stubborn streak now and then, or act rebelliously from time to time, but is continuously stubborn and rebellious.

The word "stubborn" refers to one who is obstinate in their resistance to authority. It is used in the Old Testament of a wild untamed heifer (Hos. 4:16), of an immoral woman who has cast off restraint and indulges in lust (Prov. 7:11), and of Israel as a stubborn people who would not submit to God's authority (Ps. 78:8; Isa. 1:23).

The word "rebellious" means, literally, to strike or lash, and is used of those who contend against authority and refuse to heed their words. The "rebellious" individual lashes out in contempt against those who have authority over them verbally, and perhaps even physically.

In light of this, it is important to note that the Law of the Covenant prescribes death for anyone who strikes his parents (Ex. 21:15) or curses his parents (Ex. 21:17). There is, therefore, reason to suppose that the son in this case law has broken the Law of the Covenant in one or both of these ways. The parents also describe the character of their son as being a "glutton" and a "drunkard." These sins are put forth as examples of a life lived without restraint.

In the case of such rebellion and riotous living, and after all attempts at discipline and control have failed, the parents are to bring their son before the magistrates for judgment. If the magistrates concur in the parents' estimate of the situation, they are to order the men of the city to stone the rebel with stones so that he dies (vv. 20-21). The purpose to be served in the execution of the rebellious son is to "put evil away from among you" and that all will "hear and fear" (v.21).

The Real Meaning

.

He is talking about stoning a boy of fifteen or so. :cry:

[Milly-Molly-Mandy]

Sad to say, but those children are probably better off now.

Oh I don't like this comment. I know what you are trying to say but these children could have escaped their oppressive upbringing & had happy, healthy lives. My Mum did.

[thoughtful]

Those poor children.

[Arete]

Oh God. May their memories be eternal.

[fun2beme]

My dad lost his younger sister and brother to drowning when they were very young. It's a horrible, horrible way to die. It was almost 65 years ago and he still can't say their names out loud.

No matter how ugly the grandfather's beliefs, I am moved to pity for all of them.

[Jana814]

How very sad. Can someone tell me more about the grandfather.

[ViolaSebastian]

What a terrible tragedy, bless their little souls. It's so heartbreaking that they rescued three of the children but couldn't rescue the other two. I truly hope that the parents get support and whatever counseling they need to see them through this time. I have to be honest, I've never thought about giving charity to any 'fundie' family, but this one has given me pause to rethink my stance on that.

[martian]

Found a news report on the incident. The Einwechters lost their three-year-old, only daughter and their six week old son. Link not broken because news site:

http://www.timesfreepress.com/news/2014/feb/26/taken-at-a-tender-agecrash-claims-0010infant-3/

I'm trying not to think about what a horror that night was. And I can't stop thinking about how I would get mine out of their car seats quickly, in freezing water, in the dark.

If you google eliseandenoch.org, this page is the second hit. Right below the charity fund and a couple of spots above the Facebook memorial. Possibly something to keep in mind.

[theologygeek]

I'm trying not to think about what a horror that night was. And I can't stop thinking about how I would get mine out of their car seats quickly, in freezing water, in the dark..

There are few things in life that I am so terrified of that I can't even talk about. A car under water is one of them. Even typing that out gives me the creeps. I wouldn't have even commented on this thread if I didn't see your post about how you would get your children out of the car. My sister keeps Lifehammer and Resqme in her car at all times. Even if you never use them, it's still worth it. You can't put a price on piece of mind.

[Fallgirl30]

My sister keeps Lifehammer and Resqme in her car at all times. Even if you never use them, it's still worth it. You can't put a price on piece of mind.

Thank you for mentioning these tools by name, I am ordering them today.

[maybeizfundie]

I'm kind of shocked by some of the posts, though I'm glad that the snark does not represent the majority. The parents who lost the children did not write that article about stoning children. Who knows if they even agreed with it?

And even if they had. They just lost their tiny children in one of the most horrible ways imaginable and "they got what they deserved" is a response pretty much on the same level as the grandfather's article. *Children died*. How is that something to feel glee over? :wtf:

[martian]

There are few things in life that I am so terrified of that I can't even talk about. A car under water is one of them. Even typing that out gives me the creeps. I wouldn't have even commented on this thread if I didn't see your post about how you would get your children out of the car. My sister keeps Lifehammer and Resqme in her car at all times. Even if you never use them, it's still worth it. You can't put a price on piece of mind.

Seriously, thank you for the product names. Checking those out today. I'm thinking our whole safety and first aid kit needs a going over.

I just feel sick for those children and this family. There aren't enough condolences in the world, but I still offer mine. May they find comfort for their terrible loss in the family and friends who surround them.

[dawbs]

that poor family.

(FWIW< the lifehammer 2 packs are $10 and prime eligible on amazon. I had told my MIL [who has some problems w/ the fasteners on the kiddo's car seat] I would get one, but this is a reminder to actually order it. There are unbranded ones as cheap as $6 for a 2 pack.)

[moodygirl86]

RIP kids.