Lutheran (LCMS) Anti-Gay Pastor in Michigan Outed

[DomWackTroll]

He admitted that the screenshots were of him and resigned.

queerty.com/exclusive-grindr-screenshots-reveal-antigay-pastor-is-a-top-who-likes-to-cuddle-20150518

[gilamomster]

I'm shocked ... absolutely shocked. :roll:

[Burris]

This happens with such regularity it's almost sad - sad because these men are gay; they were born gay. They have a sexual attraction to other men.

And there's nothing wrong with that.

There's something sad about a homosexual hiding in the closet.

There's something infuriating about a homosexual hiding in the closet while posing as an anti-gay religious leader.

If it doesn't exist already, there should be a group formed for closeted gay men - especially ones in positions such as this - where they can openly talk about their attractions and where they learn there's absolutely nothing wrong with loving someone of the same gender.

What these consenting adults do makes them happy and hurts no one.

But expressing ani-gay rhetoric? That kills. (Yes, I'm linking Wikipedia; the out-linked articles that work as source material for the Wiki material tend to be informative.)

PS: He's married and has five kids.

From now on, I think I'll just assume anyone who has a virulent hatred for gays is probably wearing a hole into the backboard of his own closet.

[nokidsmom]

The sad part is that these men are living a lie on so many levels, lying to themselves, their loved ones, their community, those lies sometimes taking a form that can inflict real harm on others just like them. They hate themselves and this is how it comes out.

I wonder how his family and church community are taking this.

[December]

Not surprised. But mostly it's sad, because nobody should feel compelled to live a lie. The fact he apparently was so vocal about how others needed to suppress their homosexual desires obviously is very ironic in retrospect. The gentleman doth protest too much, methinks, in this case and many others.

I wonder what effect (if any) this will have on the faith of his family members and church community. Perhaps give some people reason to reconsider their views on homosexuality, or perhaps reinforce already held notions about it? I'd imagine how he goes forward after this reveal (besides just resigning) will have an impact, too.

[MamaJunebug]

I feel for the kids and the wife, who probably doesn't have a whole lot of earning power if she goes on her own. Especially to provide for Five kids.

The pastor at the LCMS church I infrequently attend has a huge gripe against gay marriage. Pretty sure he's only got one marriage, himself. Graveyard snicker.

I'll be in church this weekend to see if it's discussed.

Lastly, interesting, the parallels the Michigan pastor tried to draw between alcoholism and being gay. If a person in the closet doesn't want to "ruin" their life by acting on their sexuality, then yes, they need to avoid places and things that would increase the appetite, just as an Alcoholic needs to avoid bars, and a hoarder needs to avoid rummage sales.

But in USA in 2015, if a closeted person wants to find a life partner, the metaphor falls apart.

Mostly tragic that this kid went ahead and lied his life away to marry and have children, and then continued to lie while living a double life. This happened to acquaintances but it was all pre-Stonewall. Each sitch is different ... all are undeniably sad.

[DomWackTroll]

Don't panic! Don't respond! Get all your information from us!

-Don’t panic. This changes nothing. Matt is still forgiven and he is still loved, and we will do what we can to stand by him and the family as they face this spiteful attack of shame. God is bigger than this and will see us through.

-Don’t respond. Those who are trying to shake up the congregation are doing so, at least in part, to generate traffic to their website. If you click on a website to see, or respond to what is being said--even in a positive way--you are only rewarding those who are trying to shame the Makelas.

sjlmidland.org/announcements/pastor-makela-resigns-call

See? It's not the Rev. Makela's fault for deceiving a woman into marriage and bringing children into his twisted, self-loathing world. No, it's the fault of pro-gay rights people like us who have the nerve to call out his hypocrisy.

We launch "attacks of shame." :angry-banghead:

[FloraKitty35]

This is not shocking. :popcorn2:

[MamaJunebug]

Don't panic! Don't respond! Get all your information from us!

-Don’t panic. This changes nothing. Matt is still forgiven and he is still loved, and we will do what we can to stand by him and the family as they face this spiteful attack of shame. God is bigger than this and will see us through.

-Don’t respond. Those who are trying to shake up the congregation are doing so, at least in part, to generate traffic to their website. If you click on a website to see, or respond to what is being said--even in a positive way--you are only rewarding those who are trying to shame the Makelas.

sjlmidland.org/announcements/pastor-makela-resigns-call

See? It's not the Rev. Makela's fault for deceiving a woman into marriage and bringing children into his twisted, self-loathing world. No, it's the fault of pro-gay rights people like us who have the nerve to call out his hypocrisy.

We launch "attacks of shame." :angry-banghead:

Ah, DWT. My moral compass.

I'm still so steeped in the good parts of the LCMS that all I saw on their website was "forgiven...redeemed....we will help the family..."

Oh dear, yes--"spiteful attack of shame." I'm NOT a big one on shame (it was my extended family's control of choice) but yes, this guy needs to feel shame!

Full-face selfies in his chonies on gay pickup sites, telling 2/5ths of the truth that he has 2 kids.

He wanted to get caught. But before that, he wanted to have it all whilst **shaming** gays and bi's.

It's disturbing to see an LCMS congregation circling the wagons a la VF or Mars Hill or other cult-of-personality "churches."

It's shameful not to address the hypocrisy.

Thanks for posting, DomWackTroll.

[DomWackTroll]

Ah, DWT. My moral compass.

I'm still so steeped in the good parts of the LCMS that all I saw on their website was "forgiven...redeemed....we will help the family..."

Oh dear, yes--"spiteful attack of shame." I'm NOT a big one on shame (it was my extended family's control of choice) but yes, this guy needs to feel shame!

Full-face selfies in his chonies on gay pickup sites, telling 2/5ths of the truth that he has 2 kids.

He wanted to get caught. But before that, he wanted to have it all whilst **shaming** gays and bi's.

It's disturbing to see an LCMS congregation circling the wagons a la VF or Mars Hill or other cult-of-personality "churches."

It's shameful not to address the hypocrisy.

Thanks for posting, DomWackTroll.

Yeah, I thought that was interesting, too, MJ. Like, if he only has two kids born of a sham marriage, it's somehow better than having 5 kids born of a sham marriage? The mind of a closet case...

[Burris]

Yeah, I thought that was interesting, too, MJ. Like, if he only has two kids born of a sham marriage, it's somehow better than having 5 kids born of a sham marriage? The mind of a closet case...

Five kids would definitely have pinged a lot of guys' "fake-straight-radar" and they may not have been interested in someone they discover is puking anti-gay bile from his pulpit Sunday morning while trolling for 'bottoms' Sunday night.

[DomWackTroll]

Five kids would definitely have pinged a lot of guys' "fake-straight-radar" and they may not have been interested in someone they discover is puking anti-gay bile from his pulpit Sunday morning while trolling for 'bottoms' Sunday night.

:lol: I think you may have analyzed the situation correctly, Burris!

[nokidsmom]

Oh dear, yes--"spiteful attack of shame." I'm NOT a big one on shame (it was my extended family's control of choice) but yes, this guy needs to feel shame!

Agreed and I am not big on shame either. This guy does need to feel shame. Not for his orientation. But for how he's treated his family and his hypocrisy.

If he didn't fully realize until after he was married that he was gay but didn't go trolling online in his skivvies, but rather decided to be honest and come out that would be one thing.

If he refrained from anti-gay rhetoric himself, even if his church did, that would be one thing IMHO.

It's the personal hypocrisy and the shitty way he treated his family that gets me. :evil:

[Burris]

This guy does need to feel shame. Not for his orientation. But for how he's treated his family and his hypocrisy.

Shame is helpful if it serves the purpose of demonstrating to this guy who it was wrong to do this to...well, everyone, really: His family, the men he slept with and then derided, his parishioners, society...he touched everyone with this, and he did his share of damage. He'll be a long time cleaning this up.

He should be grateful he might still be able to undo a significant part of the damage over time.

[MamaJunebug]

I'm sadly curious to know how much he's able to undo, and especially to the least of those involved, the minor children.

I'm close to a family whose kids were in their early and midteens when daddy came out. The family still are torn apart. The most vulnerable of the children remains estranged from half her extended family more than a decade later.

(In that case it was not a public figure nor clergy member and daddy wanted to get caught. Mommy found the evidence.)

I'm guessing this guy's kids are all pretty small but that's not going to protect them for long. It's too easy for me to imagine what this guy's wife is dealing with right now. Pit-of-stomach, roiling dread -- and that's just for starters. Time for me to walk away from this one for awhile. Carry on, my friends.

[nokidsmom]

Shame is helpful if it serves the purpose of demonstrating to this guy who it was wrong to do this to...well, everyone, really: His family, the men he slept with and then derided, his parishioners, society...he touched everyone with this, and he did his share of damage. He'll be a long time cleaning this up.

He should be grateful he might still be able to undo a significant part of the damage over time.

To the bolded, exactly this.

Perhaps this will be the beginning of a more honest and perhaps happier life, though at a considerable cost to himself and others. It's going to take a lot of time to get there, if ever, and he will probably have to live with the knowledge that others may not fully heal from this or forgive him.

[Burris]

To the bolded, exactly this.

Perhaps this will be the beginning of a more honest and perhaps happier life, though at a considerable cost to himself and others. It's going to take a lot of time to get there, if ever, and he will probably have to live with the knowledge that others may not fully heal from this or forgive him.

There's that; it's a possible price he pays for this error. There's no way around it because the thing is done.

In his case, however, people were hurt but not necessarily irreparably damaged. They're all available for what will one day hopefully be his sincere apology for fucking up this badly. (This, at least, is a case where the offending party can apologize.)

Hopefully, most people will be able to recover from it - including him. In fact, if he has the backbone for it, he should eventually tell everyone what happened, why, and how in hope of preventing another of his type from living a lie.

I don't see him as a victim, precisely, but I do see him as the deluded target of a poisoned religious culture - the object of divided loyalty that literally led to his creating a double life. He has only one life now, and he should use it in part to correct the anti-gay rhetoric he spent so long sharing.

[anniebgood]

I hope his wife gets tested for STD's. Just saying.

He could, if he wished to remain in clergy wander over to the ELCA but they'd have a hard time with the wife and 5 kids. I think he's going to have to find another profession for a while.

[Burris]

I hope his wife gets tested for STD's. Just saying.

He could, if he wished to remain in clergy wander over to the ELCA but they'd have a hard time with the wife and 5 kids. I think he's going to have to find another profession for a while.

Oh, I think after some serious soul searching and family counselling - especially when and if he makes what peace he can with his own family - he could be fit for the pastorate; maybe for the first time in his life.

Here is one who did sin - the real thing, and not the crap some people bawl about when they complain about the demons of video game RPGs or some other fuckery - and here is one who could be forgiven; by his family, by the men he slept with, by his peers, by his parishioners, by his community...by his God. (Given the nature of God as I've slowly come to understand it, mercy - a kind of love - is perhaps the most outstanding trait of our creator; one we are supposed to learn and emulate rather than suppress.)

If he is actually a good man who has done some mighty stupid things, he could come back as a more empathetic pastor and one capable specifically of dealing with people who face the same tragic religious dilemma he faced.

He could send them on a happy course...and find such a course for himself, and for his family that will get to meet the real man maybe for the first time.

That is what I hope happens. It would take time. It would also be tremendously helpful to pro-equality causes if that were the way this works.

[DomWackTroll]

Makela told a teen boy he was going to hell because he was gay. The teen's mom feared he would commit suicide because of Makela's comments.

wnem.com/story/29118198/mother-of-gay-son-speaks-out-about-midland-pastor-who-resigned-following-sin

[MamaJunebug]

Makela told a teen boy he was going to hell because he was gay. The teen's mom feared he would commit suicide because of Makela's comments.

wnem.com/story/29118198/mother-of-gay-son-speaks-out-about-midland-pastor-who-resigned-following-sin

That one will NEVER be fit for the pastorate.

I might take one for the team and listen to the uber-conservative "Issues,Etc." radio program over the next few days to see if they talk about this situation. Or not. But maybe. And if so, and they do discuss, I'll report back.

[Sundaymorning]

Makela told a teen boy he was going to hell because he was gay. The teen's mom feared he would commit suicide because of Makela's comments.

wnem.com/story/29118198/mother-of-gay-son-speaks-out-about-midland-pastor-who-resigned-following-sin

This is one of the reasons I support outing homophobes. I feel very sorry for the others who involuntarily got involved in this huge mess, especially his wife and children. But self-loathing homophobes like this man do so much harm to other people. Their actions really do kill, and make the life of so many people living hell, if outing them is the only way to stop them, I fully support it.

I hope he will get some professional help to work through his issues, this could be a chance for him and his family to face the truth, and try to build a better and sustainable future.

[nokidsmom]

This is one of the reasons I support outing homophobes. I feel very sorry for the others who involuntarily got involved in this huge mess, especially his wife and children. But self-loathing homophobes like this man do so much harm to other people. Their actions really do kill, and make the life of so many people living hell, if outing them is the only way to stop them, I fully support it.

I hope he will get some professional help to work through his issues, this could be a chance for him and his family to face the truth, and try to build a better and sustainable future.

Read the article. In addition to how this pastor treated the teenager, he also expressed views that a parent should not support him. This mom had the strength to confront him and tell him how damaging his message was, what it could do to people. This young man was lucky to have the support system he did but as the mom told the pastor, not everyone is going to have that. So this guy was specifically told what his anti gay message was doing to people, people in his own congregation.

Agree with MJB he is not fit for the pastorate.

[IHeartHoney]

I grew up in the LCMS, I can say with confidence he will likely be defrocked (stripped of his ordination as a pastor in the LCMS). This happened to my home church when the pastor turned out to be having an affair with a congregation member even though he was married with three kids. He showed up one Sunday in tears explaining that he had been found out and defrocked. Everyone was shocked, he was a nice guy and pastor but the LCMS wouldn't have it. Next time I saw him he was serving french fries at Chikfila. :? Awkward!

[MamaJunebug]

I grew up in the LCMS, I can say with confidence he will likely be defrocked (stripped of his ordination as a pastor in the LCMS). This happened to my home church when the pastor turned out to be having an affair with a congregation member even though he was married with three kids. He showed up one Sunday in tears explaining that he had been found out and defrocked. Everyone was shocked, he was a nice guy and pastor but the LCMS wouldn't have it. Next time I saw him he was serving french fries at Chikfila. :? Awkward!

Hi! Grew up LCMS, too, and I'm afraid I can't be as sure as you are about the defrocking. The guy who's now president/CEO of a large Lutheran social services agency was caught with his congregation's organist (the jokes would write themselves if it weren't so annoying to me) and while he resigned from congregational ministry, well... He now has a 6-figure income, probably a company car, the works. Oh, and he retains his title as "the Reverend."

It's a moderately known fact that the LCMS almost never was, when its leader was outed on sexual relationships with several women in the group. He was ferried across the Mississippi River to start anew in Illinois. By reports he was a good and pure pastor there.

But things change over the decades. I recall Big Mama Junebug saying that the pastor who baptized me confessed to an extramarital affair a few years later. I'm pretty sure he found another congregation after he left ours.

Those were "typical" man-woman, PIV affairs, of course. Maybe the powers that be will indeed do the right thing with this guy.