Melanie Maxwell gave birth

[holothuroidea]

Treemom, I have very much respect for you and you have been kind to me on this forum. I would never aim to offend you. You might not be bothered by people speculating over people's c-sections with misinformation but I am, and that is why I said something. I never said C-sections are never needed and super rare, so please don't misunderstand. I was talking about CPD in the United States, as that is what the "baby must have been too big" poster alluded to.

I think speculating that Melanie is too small to give birth to a baby of that size is detrimental and is definitely not based on fact. Although I don't think it's as huge of a deal as it turned out to be, I think it was worth one post but not a 10 post derailment. Ugh, eloquence fail. :oops:

[2 much chickenetti]

You have something in common with Elle!!!! :lol: Sorry, I'm sure you are taking your meds responsibly and for the right reasons.

Christina is maintstream and not reserved to fundies, or even religious peeps, so kudos to them. She can escape and not have the burden of being named Charity Grace or something similar should she decide to make a run for it. Heck, when I was pregnant, that was a girl's name we considered because it is one of the few names that sound halfway decent with our funky Sicilian surname. TBH, even though I know Abigail and Bethany are both derived from the Bible, they're also mainstream enough to "fit in" if they also ditch the compound after Stevie kicks the bucket.

I guess a D girl will have to be Danielle. Just a guess, but I don't think they'd go with Deliliah.

I vote for Deborah/Dacareh-unless it's too Jewish-sounding for them or maybe Dinah-meaning "who judges" sounds perfect for a maxwell

[treemom]

Actually as I have heard, due to dietary issues, not commonly seen in the Western world, pelvic issues, are not uncommon in other areas of the world. In the west with better diet (ok more options, surplus, and vitamins), and less physically difficult lives, pelvic issues are less common. This was another one of those things that was not good about the "good ol' days" pre-1900, in the past pelvic issues were more common around the whole world, not just poorer countries like now.

That is true :). I was more getting at the constant big babies doesn't mean a c-section is a first world problem, because in the not first world, for many women just regular size babies need a c-section and providing it would save the baby's life and the mother's in a way.

[Topaz]

I vote for Deborah/Dacareh-unless it's too Jewish-sounding for them or maybe Dinah-meaning "who judges" sounds perfect for a maxwell

There's always Dorcas. Then they would have Abby, Bethy, Chrissy and Dorky :lol:

[treemom]

Treemom, I have very much respect for you and you have been kind to me on this forum. I would never aim to offend you. You might not be bothered by people speculating over people's c-sections with misinformation but I am, and that is why I said something. I never said C-sections are never needed and super rare, so please don't misunderstand. I was talking about CPD in the United States, as that is what the "baby must have been too big" poster alluded to.

I think speculating that Melanie is too small to give birth to a baby of that size is detrimental and is definitely not based on fact. Although I don't think it's as huge of a deal as it turned out to be, I think it was worth one post but not a 10 post derailment. Ugh, eloquence fail. :oops:

So this is what I am driving at: why is it detrimental? I guarantee you more than one person read your "big babies don't need c-section" and yet again felt like their c-section for size issues was a failure in their part. There has to be a middle ground on these birthing issues.

(personally I kinda think speculating on the reasons for the c-section is like snarking on clothes, I am not a fan, rarely do it but I wouldn't call it detrimental)

[Noon]

Quick clarification: Does Melanie have three or four girls? I've heard people mention four girls, but only two older sisters are listed?

[ceg045]

Quick clarification: Does Melanie have three or four girls? I've heard people mention four girls, but only two older sisters are listed?

Their first child, a girl named Susannah, died shortly after her birth.

[emmiedahl]

So, you think it's okay to go around speculating that various size babies won't fit through random women's pelvises based on internet pictures because of this? You're cool with perpetuating that? Because I don't see how that helps educate women on the various risks of childbirth and it definitely doesn't call attention to helping women in "much of the world" with adequate evidence based obstetric care.

Wait, are we somehow influencing Melanie's decisions in childbirth after the fact? The lady already had a c-section and people were speculating on why. This is not a moral failure, and you were the one who brought up the incorrect homebirth propaganda that almost all women can give birth without medical intervention. It is not the case, we can look at history and around the modern world and see that it is not the case.

[emmiedahl]

Treemom, I have very much respect for you and you have been kind to me on this forum. I would never aim to offend you. You might not be bothered by people speculating over people's c-sections with misinformation but I am, and that is why I said something. I never said C-sections are never needed and super rare, so please don't misunderstand. I was talking about CPD in the United States, as that is what the "baby must have been too big" poster alluded to.

I think speculating that Melanie is too small to give birth to a baby of that size is detrimental and is definitely not based on fact. Although I don't think it's as huge of a deal as it turned out to be, I think it was worth one post but not a 10 post derailment. Ugh, eloquence fail. :oops:

She pretty clearly was unable to give birth to the baby vaginally, or that would have happened. No harm in wondering why.

[deborahlynn1979]

I guess a D girl will have to be Danielle. Just a guess, but I don't think they'd go with Deliliah.

Naming the next one Deborah (like meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee) would be fantastic, but they would likely NEVER do that because Deborah was a leader in the Bible; the only female Judge mentioned by name. She also lead an army with a man who was not her husband, and we don't want any of the little girls getting ideas, you know?

[Katiebug]

No, I don't care if people speculate on the reason fr a c-section. But I do resent you claiming that it is never needed and super rare. In the us that might be true, I honestly don't know. But it isn't true in many places in the world.

I am so tired of the implied or actual birthing the right way proponents. You grudge against people saying big babies need csections is such a first world problem. And really who cares if people say that? Because what you mostly accomplish is looking like you doubt people who say they needed a csection because of baby size.

It's OK, she's one of the midwifery-is-perfect-obstetrics-is-evil types who'd berate me for having an induction. Never mind that I was 39 weeks, had pre-eclampsia, and my blood pressure was 170/100 and I was spilling protein as my placenta started to stop working - I just needed to trust birth and everything would have been fine! :roll: I grow increasingly frustrated with having to clarify to people that my induction was for a damned good reason, and not because 1) I was tired of being pregnant, or 2) so that my doctor could make a fucking tee time or whatever. For all of the derison about inductions and C-sections that one encounters in the homebirth/natural birth camp, they do indeed save lives. Even ACOG says that the C-section rate is higher than it should be and many OBGYNs are taking active steps to reduce that rate. The majority of obstetricians got into the field to help women and babies, not to harm them.

Melanie had a C-section, and none of us were there or knows the circumstances that prompted the surgery. I'd rather not play armchair quarterback for another woman's birth.

As for the type of incision made, I know two women whose sections involved a sprint to the OR, being put under general anesthesia, and the baby being out within minutes of the decision being made, and one had a vertical incision and the other a horizontal incision. In both cases it was a life-and-death situation for the baby, and in both cases the baby survived after resuscitation and some help in the NICU. I know other women whose "emergency" C-sections were called that simply because they weren't planned. It was a scenario of proceeding at an orderly pace to the OR; baby was not in immediate distress but needed to be born and couldn't wait for a vaginal birth, or a vaginal birth had been attempted without success. Those are pretty much always horizontal incisions. Vertical incisions are just not super-common like they used to be.

[holothuroidea]

Treemom, whether it is detrimental is debatable. I happen to believe it is, I understand that you don't. I don't know who is right, it's just what I believe.

It's OK, she's one of the midwifery-is-perfect-obstetrics-is-evil types who'd berate me for having an induction.

This is absolutely untrue. I am more of a midwifery-is-good-for-many-situations-but-not-all-it's-a-personal-choice-and-women-need-proper-education-about-their-reproductive-health-in-order-to-make-informed-decisions-many-obstetricians-are-good-but-don't-let-patriarchal-bully-obstetricians-push-you-around type. I will not berate you for any reason, that's not my style. I'm glad you made a fully informed decision about your reproductive health, and I'm happy that you were educated enough to make the best decision for you.

Also, "trusting birth" is a stupid and dangerous thing to do. Please don't make me relive the arguments on Mothering.com where I was accosted for supporting ebil MEDwifery!!! :shock: :roll:

[terranova]

Why do they put that awful thing around her head? Is it a medical nessescity? Because it looks like something you put around apples to stop them bruising during transport.

[fundiefan]

Why do they put that awful thing around her head? Is it a medical nessescity? Because it looks like something you put around apples to stop them bruising during transport.

That's so everyone knows her role in life has already been decided since she was born with a vagina and ovaries. She's a girl, not a boy, and she will be a helpmeet when she grows up and don't anyone dare buy her pants or soccer balls or baseball hats.

[treemom]

Treemom, whether it is detrimental is debatable. I happen to believe it is, I understand that you don't. I don't know who is right, it's just what I believe.

This is absolutely untrue. I am more of a midwifery-is-good-for-many-situations-but-not-all-it's-a-personal-choice-and-women-need-proper-education-about-their-reproductive-health-in-order-to-make-informed-decisions-many-obstetricians-are-good-but-don't-let-patriarchal-bully-obstetricians-push-you-around type. I will not berate you for any reason, that's not my style. I'm glad you made a fully informed decision about your reproductive health, and I'm happy that you were educated enough to make the best decision for you.

Also, "trusting birth" is a stupid and dangerous thing to do. Please don't make me relive the arguments on Mothering.com where I was accosted for supporting ebil MEDwifery!!! :shock: :roll:

How is it detrimental? You say you think it is, then explain how it is. What are the impacts?

[emmiedahl]

I don't understand how discussing after the fact that perhaps the c-section is due to CPD is detrimental.

As someone who had 4 enormous babies and one small one, the larger ones were more difficult to deliver and caused more damage, sometimes serious damage that required surgical repair.

[Ms Lucy Fur]

I thought the goal is to deliver a baby and mama safe and sound, however that needs to happen.

[gardenvarietycitizen]

Why do they put that awful thing around her head? Is it a medical nessescity? Because it looks like something you put around apples to stop them bruising during transport.

Ha. Nice to see I'm not the only one who thought it looked like that! Baby is cute though.　Sweet as a pear!

[freejoytoo]

Were the Maxwells the fundies who prayed over their daughter's ovaries - not about their daughter but her OVARIES? Because to them that's all she is.

[terranova]

Ha. Nice to see I'm not the only one who thought it looked like that! Baby is cute though.　Sweet as a pear!

I agree, cute kid :) I hope she is the *cough* apple of their eye.

[treemom]

Were the Maxwells the fundies who prayed over their daughter's ovaries - not about their daughter but her OVARIES? Because to them that's all she is.

Him that was Geoffrey Botkin who prayed over Anna Sophia's ovaries. As I recall her delivering was harrowing as well and Victoria was quite ill.

[TrishaMiki]

Two new photos of baby Christina. She is so so cute!

[AmyP]

Him that was Geoffrey Botkin who prayed over Anna Sophia's ovaries. As I recall her delivering was harrowing as well and Victoria was quite ill.

Hmmm. That didn't come to much, I guess.

[ChunkyBarbie]

Hmmm. That didn't come to much, I guess.

:lol: :lol:

:clap: :clap:

[pixydust]

It's OK, she's one of the midwifery-is-perfect-obstetrics-is-evil types who'd berate me for having an induction. Never mind that I was 39 weeks, had pre-eclampsia, and my blood pressure was 170/100 and I was spilling protein as my placenta started to stop working - I just needed to trust birth and everything would have been fine! :roll: I grow increasingly frustrated with having to clarify to people that my induction was for a damned good reason, and not because 1) I was tired of being pregnant, or 2) so that my doctor could make a fucking tee time or whatever. For all of the derison about inductions and C-sections that one encounters in the homebirth/natural birth camp, they do indeed save lives. Even ACOG says that the C-section rate is higher than it should be and many OBGYNs are taking active steps to reduce that rate. The majority of obstetricians got into the field to help women and babies, not to harm them.

Melanie had a C-section, and none of us were there or knows the circumstances that prompted the surgery. I'd rather not play armchair quarterback for another woman's birth.

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: Beautifully said! I still find myself having to defend my c-sections (12, 7, and 4 years after the fact!) and the fact that I am not chronically depressed/angry/or not bonded to my kids because of it. Babies being born healthy with healthy mommies is the goal.

You know what? I'm glad for my c-sections. I'm not dead, my kids aren't dead, none of us suffered any ill affects from them, and I have a fully functioning vagina (as opposed to my sister-in-law, who had a very bad "I pushed my kids out, so I'm better than you" attitude, and has no pelvic floor muscles, and hasn't since she was 18 and had her first). Yes, I'm a little pissy, and I will take my time in the prayer closet if people that I respect think I deserve it, but I'm about 12 years over the "c-sections are evil! Drs just want to slice you open!" bullshit.