13 Children and Wanting More

[SpeakNow]

http://www.veoh.com/watch/v15456865yXgS ... BPart+1%5D

It's a documentary about large families in Britain. I really want to rescue Noreen from her husband. Mohammed seems to be pushing her to have children against her will because it is "Allah's will." She just seems so unhappy. The other mothers seem to have serious baby addictions.

[Maude]

I can't imagine growing up with twelve siblings. I'm an [extreme] introvert, so I probably would have quite literally gone insane. It just boggles the mind why anyone would want more children than they're able to devote enough time and care to on an individual level.

[geniebelle6901]

My great-aunt had 13 kids (no miscarriages or stillbirths), and all are still alive today. I don't know how she managed it. But this was before the dawn of birth control, and she and my uncle definitely weren't fundie. When birth control pills became widely available, she encouraged all of her daughters (married and unmarried) to get on them. I'm sure her sons were told to use condoms. I just remember the BCP part because there was a stigma attached to women using BCPs at that time.

[Soldevi]

My mother has 11 siblings. Most of them form smaller and closer groups, not everyone is close to other siblings in that family. IIRC, my grandma said there were usually 6 siblings at home at once. Older siblings moved to city to live with other relatives when they started to study or went to work. (Staying at home in a small farm would have been catastrophe, in Finland this whole stay at home culture has never really been part of the history. In agricultural times almost all siblings went to work outside home when they could as early as 8-10 years old. Small farm couldn't afford to support everyone.)

What my mother and her siblings have taught me is that blood isn't always thicker than water. Personalities clash and in bigger groups where older ones already live a life of their own, you can't always bond just because you are relatives. My younger uncles are younger than some of my oldest cousins from my mother's side. 20+ years means a lot.

[racheepoo]

I"m the youngest of 11. My oldest brother was born when my mom was 15, and I was born when she was 39. We have all spread far and wide around the country...at most, we live a couple hours from each other. We've never been a big happy family, ever :shrug My friends are my family (with the exception of 1 sis and 1 bro) and always will be.

[mirele]

I can't imagine growing up with twelve siblings. I'm an [extreme] introvert, so I probably would have quite literally gone insane. It just boggles the mind why anyone would want more children than they're able to devote enough time and care to on an individual level.

I know someone who had 12 siblings (she was the oldest). Her father was an MD and her mother a psychologist. She eventually moved 1,000 miles away from her family and sees them once a year. (Not Catholic but Mormon.)

[Trynn]

It's true. When there's a big gap in sibling ages, it's harder to bond. My brother and I are 7 years apart (because my mother was one of those eeebil womens who decided not to have another child until she could afford to take care of it) and... I'm still waiting for him to grow up. We are not close at all, and that makes me sad.

[JumpingtheSnark]

LOL

That guy with the "PhD" spends his time writing letters to the editor of local newspapers on his views. THAT tells me plenty right there.

And the filth that family lives in is disturbing.

[RR88]

Look at the way Noreen has aged since giving birth to her first child. It's amazing the way her husband claims that her pain and discomfort is "all in the mind"...and by "amazing", I mean horrendous.

[Mela99]

Another one to add to my list to watch... FJ is becoming my netflix queue

[breadprincess]

I don't think that a large gap in sibling ages makes it harder to bond, necessarily. My oldest sister is 18 years older than me and my other sister is 11 years older, and we are all incredibly close. My Dad was the oldest of 7 (still a large family, but a smaller one- my grandma's doctor was Catholic and they needed all the free farm labor they could get) and they are all very close as adults.

[chaotic life]

Not all large families are that crazy.

I actually got irritated with the Health Worker telling Noreen that she stopped with two children because that was all she had enough love for. That's not how love works.

Those were definitely some examples of baby addicted families. Noreen's husband is as baby addicted as the other women. Cycle beads.... :lol: Those things are worthless for trying to avoid pregnancy as much as trying to get pregnant. Most families I've ever known that size either had deep religious convictions, or were adoptive families.

[Mountain Girl]

Holy crap! Mohammed says, "I had sex with a condom once and hated it." He compares having "natural" sex to having "natural" teeth vs. dentures. What the flying hell? Meanwhile his wife avoids eye contact with the camera and looks generally depressed and tired.

[Mountain Girl]

Not all large families are that crazy.

I actually got irritated with the Health Worker telling Noreen that she stopped with two children because that was all she had enough love for. That's not how love works.

Very true. There's no magic number, but at some point it would become impossible to give every child the individual attention they deserve.

[DarkAnts]

Holy crap! Mohammed says, "I had sex with a condom once and hated it." He compares having "natural" sex to having "natural" teeth vs. dentures. What the flying hell? Meanwhile his wife avoids eye contact with the camera and looks generally depressed and tired.

He is the only person on that documentary that I truly disliked. He came off as an ass. The other parents wanted large families but dont shove their beliefs on others.

[SisiL78]

Those families live in filth and disorganization. Okay, have a bunch of kids but learn to live with a bit more organization and less clutter otherwise your kids are living like animals.

[Mountain Girl]

I find it creepy that one of the moms saves her pregnancy tests and has a cast of her pregnant belly.

[Mountain Girl]

Finished watching it and I agree that Mohammed is the only person I actually disliked. Very strongly, vehemently disliked. He can't wait for his wife to recover from childbirth and help him take care of the other kids because it's hard. Stupid fuckwad! Of course it's hard, so give her a fricking break and take of the kids for a few days.

If he had a kidney stone or a hernia that pain wouldn't be "all in the mind".

I don't understand why men like him (all the fundy men we discuss here) believe that the female body was made for childbirth by God, but that the process doesn't deserve some sort of reverence. He thinks she should just spring back from forming a human body in her womb and pushing it out her fricking vagina, and resume the heavy lifting and sexy time like nothing has happened.

[SpeakNow]

I find it creepy that one of the moms saves her pregnancy tests and has a cast of her pregnant belly.

I also thought it was weird that she had her young (perhaps 9 year old) daughter checking the pregnancy tests.

[DarkAnts]

Finished watching it and I agree that Mohammed is the only person I actually disliked. Very strongly, vehemently disliked. He can't wait for his wife to recover from childbirth and help him take care of the other kids because it's hard. Stupid fuckwad! Of course it's hard, so give her a fricking break and take of the kids for a few days.

If he had a kidney stone or a hernia that pain wouldn't be "all in the mind".

I don't understand why men like him (all the fundy men we discuss here) believe that the female body was made for childbirth by God, but that the process doesn't deserve some sort of reverence. He thinks she should just spring back from forming a human body in her womb and pushing it out her fricking vagina, and resume the heavy lifting and sexy time like nothing has happened.

I loved the way the nurse pushed and pushed to get him to stop having any more children. He is not employed so he cant support his children. Its clear that his wife wants to stop. I wish his wife would listen to the nurses and leave him. Her and her children deserve more.

The parents of the other children seem to be engaged in their parents. They are not having children to create an army of god. They are having children because they love them. I hope that they can support their families. I just hope that they are not closet quiverfuls.

[nomi]

I think Mohammed has a mighty big chip on his shoulder.

[No Fun My Babe]

Oh, fuck this guy. Did he really compare childbirth to playing football? If he were the one having kids, they would've stopped at one, guaranteed.

I have absolutely no problem with welfare, social services, and the like. I'm actually utilizing them myself. I'm glad the kids are being fed and stuff, I just think it's really irresponsible to keep intentionally having them when you can't take care of them. He needs to suck it up and take his 7 British degrees and take whatever job he can get and not wait for one he thinks he's "worthy" of, or stop having kids.

I feel bad for Noreen, but I hope one day she can save herself and the kids, and get away from this prime example of assholery. It's clear that she's absolutely miserable.

[Mela99]

Good lord, that house that Mohammed and his family live in,...Where are they even going to PUT the baby?? And why do they have that oldest one in his own room if they're THAT squeezed into space??? Okay, sure, he's the oldest, but four and five to a room otherwise? He should have at least another brother or two in there!

I'd like to slap him a good one. He has no idea. "It's all in the mind, dear, buck up!" The midwife/nurse there is fighting to get it through his thick skull. "Of course, it's because we have so much on our plates. But we can wait till it's financially too much. God will give her the strength"

Ohh this is painful. Just... I can't.

[BelieveinScience]

I feel bad for Noreen her parents arranged the marriage she's in with Mohammed. She truly had no say. So sad!!

[luckystone]

I don't think that a large gap in sibling ages makes it harder to bond, necessarily. My oldest sister is 18 years older than me and my other sister is 11 years older, and we are all incredibly close. My Dad was the oldest of 7 (still a large family, but a smaller one- my grandma's doctor was Catholic and they needed all the free farm labor they could get) and they are all very close as adults.

Same here, big age gap in my family and we're extremely close, more so than a lot of our closer-aged friends. Yes, it is difficult in some ways when one is grown-up and one isn't. The dynamic of the relationship is very different to a sibling relationship closer in age, and it can be this way for a long time (eventually, in your 30s or 40s, it becomes less relevant). But I don't think that's necessarily worse, it can work a lot of the time. I think closeness depends more on personality, how the parents raise the kids and external factors pushing them closer or bringing them apart rather than age, and there are different variables in each family.

Based on the thread, I don't think I could watch this documentary without feeling very ill about this Mohammed character.