Reason number 10065 why I hate the Duggars

[alysee]

Just read this off the family website of family rules

 

Have a tough accountability/prayer partner to daily share your heart with and to keep you in line (your parents, spouse). The power of sin is in secrecy.

 

This makes me cringe! Can't they have secrets? Especially the older ones...

[Elle]

When Michelle takes a few minutes to have one-on-one with any of the kids, one of the things she asks is if they have anything to tell her.

Those kids are not allowed to have any privacy. Privacy means some things secret to yourself, and that's bad. I think it's also part of why they sleep in dorms and share beds. I'm surprised their showers aren't like locker rooms, one for the boys, one for the girls, maybe with flimsy curtains.

[koolmom]

Unless otherwise seen, who knows what their showers look like? Well, probably didn't want to completely remodel the bathrooms, especially upstairs, TLC probably wouldn't want to incur an unnecessary expense.

[Mela99]

Wait, they still share beds? Don't they have enough beds for everybody?

[Mela99]

I have no idea if I mentioned this here before, but why don't they consider self-control and self-accountability and self-respect worthy assets?

What I get from all this is that they don't misbehave or do anything even remotely detrimental because someone will find out. Boys can't see girls in skimpy clothes because they can't control themselves. They need chaperones because they don't feel they can make good decisions.

Why don't they teach them to answer to themselves? It's like they're raising kids with no ability to control themselves or make good choices. I thought trust was a huge part of growing up.

[Maude]

I have no idea if I mentioned this here before, but why don't they consider self-control and self-accountability and self-respect worthy assets?

What I get from all this is that they don't misbehave or do anything even remotely detrimental because someone will find out. Boys can't see girls in skimpy clothes because they can't control themselves. They need chaperones because they don't feel they can make good decisions.

Why don't they teach them to answer to themselves? It's like they're raising kids with no ability to control themselves or make good choices. I thought trust was a huge part of growing up.

If men were taught to have self-control and self-accountability, and women were taught self-respect, the very foundation of their lifestyle would come crumbling down. It's all about men having and keeping control over women.

[gustava]

If men were taught to have self-control and self-accountability, and women were taught self-respect, the very foundation of their lifestyle would come crumbling down. It's all about men having and keeping control over women.

Because women are weak and slutty.

[JenniferJuniper]

Wait, they still share beds? Don't they have enough beds for everybody?

There may be enough for the boys. I think Jackson was the only boy without one - he was probably still living in a pack and play when they moved onto the compound - but he may have finally scored one when Smugs moved out.

The girls are another story. I'm not sure they were thinking they would have another set of daughters when they moved in and God forbid spend JB any "unnecessary" money on them. They'll get their own if and when the older girls get married.

Which raises an interesting question. Had the last set of kids been all boys, would he double the boys up? I tend to doubt it.

[TXDuck]

I have no idea if I mentioned this here before, but why don't they consider self-control and self-accountability and self-respect worthy assets?

Self-respect has no place in their dogma at all. And self-control is only for babies and toddlers.

[alba]

Re: The girls sharing beds. Do they share single beds or just the double beds? It's still shitty if the older girls are having to share with each other (or worse, a younger buddy!), but there's nothing wrong with two young sisters sharing a double bed. Or am I missing something here?

[Elle]

Re: The girls sharing beds. Do they share single beds or just the double beds? It's still shitty if the older girls are having to share with each other (or worse, a younger buddy!), but there's nothing wrong with two young sisters sharing a double bed. Or am I missing something here?

They share with the little ones. Easier to be mommy that way....

[alba]

They share with the little ones. Easier to be mommy that way....

You mean the older ones with the younger ones? That's just cruel and unfair to the older girls.

[celestial]

You mean the older ones with the younger ones? That's just cruel and unfair to the older girls.

Welcome to the life of the Duggar Daughters, aka J'Slaves.

[slickcat79]

I remember in their first book, Michelle talked about how they train the kids not to keep any secrets from their parents; if someone told them something was a secret, they were supposed to run and tell their parents right away. They kind of laughed it off and shared some anecdote about how the little kids spilled the beans about a surprise party for Michelle because they weren't allowed to keep secrets. I thought it was horrible when I read it, and it still sounds bad. Yes, there are some things that you would need to tell your parents, but I don't think the Duggar kids are actually doing drugs, committing crimes or participating in dangerous behavior. It's natural enough for kids and teens to have some secrets from their parents, and it's not going to hurt anyone to let them have a little privacy, even in their own minds :roll:

When they built the TTH, they put in typical low-cost tub/shower combos, and each dorm room has 2 bathrooms. In the girls' room, Jill and Jana had double beds, and Jessa/Jinger/Joy had single beds. Now they have those 5 plus Hannie, Jenny, Jordyn and possibly Josie in the girls' dorm, but no additional beds, so they are doubling up somehow. They haven't bothered to share exactly how, but I would guess that Hannie shares with Jana, Jenny shares with Jill, and Jordyn is in the pack n' play. I think the boys actually share beds too, but their room was set up in a way that was better for sharing anyway. They had several bunks and pyramid beds that would comfortably sleep more than one kid, as opposed to the girls' setup.

[uber frau]

I've read several 'testimonies' from various Gothardite children (well, legally adults but still living at home under their parents' godly umbrellas) that talk about their parents regularly reading their prayer journals. In most families, journals are a private means to process on paper. In Gothardite families, journals are a means to keep tabs on teenagers emotional and spiritual lives.

One of the more vomitous moments in David Waller's courtship story on the DavidlovesPriscilla page describes his father reading and discussing his prayer journal with him. It sounds very much like more everyday version of a 'Journey to the Heart' type of experience.

[Sweetpea1]

If men were taught to have self-control and self-accountability, and women were taught self-respect, the very foundation of their lifestyle would come crumbling down. It's all about men having and keeping control over women.

QFT. So true.

[RR88]

The Duggar kids' lack of privacy almost bothers me more than their heavy workload does. I can't imagine sharing my entire life - including a bedroom - with a bunch of siblings! No privacy means no time alone to read, listen to music, masturbate, write, think, or just enjoy a bit of calm.

[Sweetpea1]

I've read several 'testimonies' from various Gothardite children (well, legally adults but still living at home under their parents' godly umbrellas) that talk about their parents regularly reading their prayer journals. In most families, journals are a private means to process on paper. In Gothardite families, journals are a means to keep tabs on teenagers emotional and spiritual lives.

One of the more vomitous moments in David Waller's courtship story on the DavidlovesPriscilla page describes his father reading and discussing his prayer journal with him. It sounds very much like more everyday version of a 'Journey to the Heart' type of experience.

If it were me and my prayer journal, I would win the NaNoWriMo award for fiction. It would be a serious fictional.

[Eclipse]

Its a recipe for the kids to not tell their parents things when they finally move out and to have no relationship with them as adults.

I always wondered where the younger girls slept. I guess doubling up on the beds is better than sleeping on the floor as seen in one episode. The sharing of a bed with a toddler is a way for the parents to infantilize the older controls and control them.

[thoughtful]

Their childhoods (and I use the word loosely) are preparation for being a Gothard child-adult; well-behaved by Gothard standards, watched, judged and controlled.

Josh's working, eating, and posting habits are probably a good indication of how hard it is to remain that way when one has not been taught self-control and how to make good choices even when one has more freedom.

Despite being watched, judged and criticized (quite possibly by JB, Michelle and other Gothardites, as well as normal people like us!), he can't seem to help himself.

He is following some of the rules, but normal desires he never learned how to control, and never got out of his system during a normal childhood and adolescence, are slipping through the cracks.

Not that that's a new insight, I know. :D

[Avalondaughter]

I think parents expect that the whole fear of hell and punishment and disapproval from God will motivate kids into self control. Besides, kids are so convinced that other lifestyles will only lead to misery- divorce, single-parenthood, juvenile deliquency, communism, etc.

How much will Josh rebel when he considers that he might go to Hell for his sins? As long as the parents are secretly footing the bill for his business, he'll stay on track I would think.

[thoughtful]

I think parents expect that the whole fear of hell and punishment and disapproval from God will motivate kids into self control. Besides, kids are so convinced that other lifestyles will only lead to misery- divorce, single-parenthood, juvenile deliquency, communism, etc.

How much will Josh rebel when he considers that he might go to Hell for his sins? As long as the parents are secretly footing the bill for his business, he'll stay on track I would think.

You're right -- I think there are things keeping him from a true, full rebellion.

And I do think that he is trying to stay on track, as he has been taught, out of some mix of fear and thinking Gothard's way/his family/he is superior. I would imagine he is not staying out of church, using contraceptives, doubting his belief, wishing his wife could get a job, etc. -- things that would be big "sins" in their world.

But I wonder how much of his gorging, spending, lazing around, watching TV, posting mindlessly, etc. is due to not having any self-motivation to do what he believes is right, so lots of smaller bad habits ooze out around the edges (um, I mean that figuratively :lol: ).

It seems like a low-energy, won't-do-things-right-if-I'm-not-ordered-around-by-someone mess, more than a rebellion.

[SamuraiKatz]

You're right -- I think there are things keeping him from a true, full rebellion.

And I do think that he is trying to stay on track, as he has been taught, out of some mix of fear and thinking Gothard's way/his family/he is superior. I would imagine he is not staying out of church, using contraceptives, doubting his belief, wishing his wife could get a job, etc. -- things that would be big "sins" in their world.

But I wonder how much of his gorging, spending, lazing around, watching TV, posting mindlessly, etc. is due to not having any self-motivation to do what he believes is right, so lots of smaller bad habits ooze out around the edges (um, I mean that figuratively :lol: ).

It seems like a low-energy, won't-do-things-right-if-I'm-not-ordered-around-by-someone mess, more than a rebellion.

Josh is passive aggressive? There is zero toleration for overt rebellion...so.....the only way to express yourself is through what you don't do...

And....Ma and Pa Duggar are probably fearful that Josh and Anna will go the way of Anna's sister Rebekkah and ditch ATI

[Childless]

How exactly do they know that one of their children doesn't have a secret? What if one of the kids secretly loathes their lifestyle? If they never mentioned it to anyone else, then they have a secret that the parents will never find out. I think it's unrealistic for Michelle and Jim Bob to think that none of the children have a secret. It's unlikely that is true.

And I agree with whoever said Josh is the perfect example of what happens when you don't teach your children self-control. His eating habits are gluttonous. His online rants are in poor taste and he's obviously not thinking about any future business relationships he may have to make and maintain. He's the epitome of someone who was never taught to police themselves.

[ADoyle90815]

How exactly do they know that one of their children doesn't have a secret? What if one of the kids secretly loathes their lifestyle? If they never mentioned it to anyone else, then they have a secret that the parents will never find out. I think it's unrealistic for Michelle and Jim Bob to think that none of the children have a secret. It's unlikely that is true.

And I agree with whoever said Josh is the perfect example of what happens when you don't teach your children self-control. His eating habits are gluttonous. His online rants are in poor taste and he's obviously not thinking about any future business relationships he may have to make and maintain. He's the epitome of someone who was never taught to police themselves.

That's true, and I think one other reason he has such gluttonous eating habits is that he no longer has to share food with 19 other people.