Bristol Palin blames Obama girls re same-sex marriage

[Deleted03]

Which is what I just said.

I know.

[OnceModestTwiceShy]

Yeah, I agree with Elle and others re: Levi. I'm usually the last person to doubt a woman's claims about date rape or assault, but in this case it really seems like she made those allegations of it maybe not being 100% what she wanted much later, because she was trying to find a way to be this conservative poster girl despite being a single teen mom, and probably figured that she would be much more credible as such if she was the girl who was pressured to have sex by this predatory guy and chose to keep and raise the child because she's just got such great Christian values, rather than your run-of-the-mill HS girl who had sex and got knocked up. Conservative women, and those who profit from them, are forever trying to find reasons to differentiate their actions from those heathen sluts, even if their actions are identical. That is why so many conservative talk show hosts went crazy about how Jamie Lynn Spears was a ho and how her pregnancy was a sign of the moral breakdown of America, and then turned around and defended Bristol until they were blue in the face even though the only real difference in their situations was the fact that one had a famous sister, and the other had a famous mother. O'Reilly, for example, referred to JLS's parents as "pinheads" for failing to keep their daughter from getting pregnant (and blamed it on liberals, of course) but spent several shows reading viewer mail and talking about how teen pregnancy is normal issue that many decent Americans had to deal with.

You know all the discussion about Jill Duggar's seeming freedom, and how weird it is that she seems to have drunk the most Kool-Aid but is apparently given more privileges than the other girls, and even seemingly gets slack to dress a bit differently (remember the knee-length skirts?) Some women in highly conservative environments figure out that they get more license to rebel if they do the opposite; i.e., spout the party line and do everything they are supposed to do, because then people will say "Oh, I'm not worried about Jill, she'll do the right thing" and will assume that Jill is off grocery shopping even if she is canoodling with the bag boy or something. Someone obviously rebellious will be watched like a hawk, while someone seemingly compliant can raise hell without anyone suspecting. Just like women like Phyllis Schlafly, who shriek about how women need to be "in their place" while having successful careers themselves. Just like the Botkin girls, who, if we are to believe our famous fundie visitor of the "ask me anything" thread from a few months back, get a lot more freedom in their actual lives than their dad recommends for adult daughters. My guess is that Bristol has figured out this secret - that as long as she preaches the conservative party line, there are many conservatives who will ignore the fact that she is anything but a poster child for their movement.

[doggie]

wasn't it in her autobiography? i think it was wine coolers. I didn't read the book so I am probably wrong.

what daddy failed to tell her not to drink too?

[luckystone]

Bristol has claimed that he got her drunk and had sex with her when she wanted to wait. She's not calling it out rape, but basically he took advantage of her that's what she claims. Hence the reminder to bristol that she had sex, and maybe it was an unfortunate decision informed by alcohol, unless she's filing for rape or outright says it was a rape, she had sex voluntarily.

Yes he's responsible too, not only responsible.

Did he "get her drunk" or did she get herself drunk?

I'm not sure I believe that story anyway. Why would she try and marry him if that was the case? Unless it's a biblical "marry your rapist" type thing. I think he also said they had sex more than once and he was allowed to sleepover. Personally I don't even know who's worse, they both seem really immature, irritating and not too bright. I think she is keeping him away from the son but there might be a reason rather than just being vindictive - and really I doubt he wants to spend time with him either. They also repeatedly slander each other in public so who knows what's going on.

[shesinsane]

Levi's sister has said that when Bristol stayed the Johnston house, she heard noises that would indicate Bristol was very happily having sex before her I-only-had-ebil-sex-because-ebil-alcohol camping trip where she claims to have lost her virginity.

Levi's response to that wasn't in the book (her book came out after his), but as far as birth control goes, Levi basically said he didn't think about and Bristol wanted to get pregnant. She was basically raising her siblings anyway.

Bristol now says

we know that in general kids do better growing up in a mother/father home.

yet her relationship with Levi was over when her son was a baby. She knew she wouldn't be able to provide him with a mother/father home, why didn't she do the best thing (by her logic) for her baby and make an adoption plan with a nice hetero couple? ;)

[meow139]

Unless the beer was spiked with muscle relaxer and I could watch them melt all over the table, I'd rather die than drink a beer with a Palin. Bristol can fuck off.

[Elle]

Yeah, I agree with Elle and others re: Levi. I'm usually the last person to doubt a woman's claims about date rape or assault, but in this case it really seems like she made those allegations of it maybe not being 100% what she wanted much later, because she was trying to find a way to be this conservative poster girl despite being a single teen mom, and probably figured that she would be much more credible as such if she was the girl who was pressured to have sex by this predatory guy and chose to keep and raise the child because she's just got such great Christian values, rather than your run-of-the-mill HS girl who had sex and got knocked up.

Yup. Bristol has claimed everything from they were "in love" and wanted a life together early on, to coming very close to alleging rape. Even though they had sex multiple times, so unless he raped her every time... But I don't think he did. Her own early statements back that up. And as a mom, if I thought someone raped my teen daughter, I'd be doing everything to put his ass behind bars, not talking proudly about them getting married. Since it's not PC to doubt when a girl/woman claims rape, I think she was relying on no one wanting to be the one to say what many others are thinking, that she's a liar. Too bad a lot of people don't want to do the "wrong" thing and doubt her, so Levi has this reputation as being a predatory asshole when the reality is he showed himself to be everything but that. He's never hit her, I don't think he ever tricked or forced her into sex, he tried to see his son, he did what he had to within the law to make the money he needed to pay child support and to support himself. He waited for her, and let her jerk him around. And jerk him around she did. And then expects us to believe he's a rapist.

Conservative women, and those who profit from them, are forever trying to find reasons to differentiate their actions from those heathen sluts, even if their actions are identical. That is why so many conservative talk show hosts went crazy about how Jamie Lynn Spears was a ho and how her pregnancy was a sign of the moral breakdown of America, and then turned around and defended Bristol until they were blue in the face even though the only real difference in their situations was the fact that one had a famous sister, and the other had a famous mother. O'Reilly, for example, referred to JLS's parents as "pinheads" for failing to keep their daughter from getting pregnant (and blamed it on liberals, of course) but spent several shows reading viewer mail and talking about how teen pregnancy is normal issue that many decent Americans had to deal with.

Oh my god, I can't stand those right-wing hypocritical pundits. All of them, all of these well-known right-wingers. All assholes. When Sarah was running for president and her teen daughter got knocked up even though she was spouting about how abstinence-only works as long as your family is perfect, she said that kids (even older teenaged kids) need to be left out of it. Yet Obama's pre-teen and barely-teen daughters are fair game for the bad, bad "sin" of wanting their friends and their friends parents to be treated equally?!

[lilwriter85]

When it comes to the Palins and the Spearses, the Palins will always be the idiots. Jamie Lynn Spears did the right thing by keeping quiet on the topic of teen pregnancy and staying out of the public eye. The Palins are so fucking grandiose that isn't even funny.

[alba]

Back in the day, I kind of respected her for being an abstinence advocate. I don't agree with abstinence as a cure-all (it's a personal choice), and I'm ardently pro-choice, but in general I have a lot of respect for teenage mothers, because not only are they taking on the difficult job of parenting at a young age, but they face slut-shaming and criticism for it, too. Anyway, I used to think Bristol Palin advocating abstinence was a case of someone who (in her mind) had screwed up, reaped the consequences, admitted she was "wrong", and was trying to help other people avoid the same fate. It's not like she got pregnant while advocating abstinence.

Now? I think she's just an ignorant hypocrite.

Obama listened to his daughters because they were talking sense. She should try it sometime.

Oh, and thanks, Samurai Sarah, for the information on the history of marriage. You didn't even talk about 'thousands of years' and still unearthed enough discrepancies that Bristol's point is moot. I think I read somewhere that some non-European cultures had same-sex marriages, too ...

[valsa]

Back in the day, I kind of respected her for being an abstinence advocate. I don't agree with abstinence as a cure-all (it's a personal choice), and I'm ardently pro-choice, but in general I have a lot of respect for teenage mothers, because not only are they taking on the difficult job of parenting at a young age, but they face slut-shaming and criticism for it, too. Anyway, I used to think Bristol Palin advocating abstinence was a case of someone who (in her mind) had screwed up, reaped the consequences, admitted she was "wrong", and was trying to help other people avoid the same fate. It's not like she got pregnant while advocating abstinence.

Now? I think she's just an ignorant hypocrite.

She's always been an ignorant hypocrite (except very briefly) Bristol was taught abstinence-only sex education and it failed (as it does far, far more often than comprehensive sex education) Trying to help other teenagers avoid her fate as a single teen mother would have involved advocating for comprehensive sex education, not the very same non-education that lead her to where she was.

The only thing time I respected her was when she was asked about abstinence-only sex ed and admitted it didn't work. And this was before she became an advocate for the abstinence-only model. If anything, she's worse than a hypocrite because now she gets paid for advocate for something she has admitted she knows doesn't work.

[alba]

She's always been an ignorant hypocrite (except very briefly) Bristol was taught abstinence-only sex education and it failed (as it does far, far more often than comprehensive sex education) Trying to help other teenagers avoid her fate as a single teen mother would have involved advocating for comprehensive sex education, not the very same non-education that lead her to where she was.

The only thing time I respected her was when she was asked about abstinence-only sex ed and admitted it didn't work. And this was before she became an advocate for the abstinence-only model. If anything, she's worse than a hypocrite because now she gets paid for advocate for something she has admitted she knows doesn't work.

Oh, I know *now* she's always been a hypocrite; I just meant I didn't realise it at the time, because I didn't pay much attention to her. I do agree that proper sex ed is leagues better than abstinence-only, but I can see a teenager brought up by someone like Sarah Palin genuinely believing that promoting abstinence (especially in a non-sex-ed context, which I *think* is what she does, rather than trying to replace real sex-ed) will help other teenagers avoid pregnancy. At the time, she seemed to me to be misguided but with her heart in the right place, which doesn't excuse everything but certainly makes her look more favourable than she is. I didn't know that she had admitted abstinence doesn't work, but if she did and she's now promoting it then she obviously wasn't a misguided girl who thought she was doing people a favour. She was (and is) a self-righteous hypocrite.

I read somewhere once that abstinence-only sex ed is sufficient because something like 54% of high-schoolers graduate as virgins. The writer of this article failed to acknowledge that a) few people marry right out of high school, so they could well still have pre-marital sex and b) 46% of high-schoolers *didn't* graduate as virgins and would have benefited from proper sex-ed. This is the sort of blinkered vision Bristol seems to have.

Edit: I didn't mean in my previous post that she was somehow better because I hadn't realised how hypocritical she was, more that if someone like me, who's pretty much the antithesis of her views and what she promotes, could find her actions somewhat worthy of respect before delving deeper, then it's more concerning because I worry that teenage girls, especially those from a more conservative background, might buy into her message.

[Deleted03]

She's always been an ignorant hypocrite (except very briefly) Bristol was taught abstinence-only sex education and it failed (as it does far, far more often than comprehensive sex education) Trying to help other teenagers avoid her fate as a single teen mother would have involved advocating for comprehensive sex education, not the very same non-education that lead her to where she was.

The only thing time I respected her was when she was asked about abstinence-only sex ed and admitted it didn't work. And this was before she became an advocate for the abstinence-only model. If anything, she's worse than a hypocrite because now she gets paid for advocate for something she has admitted she knows doesn't work.

anything to make money!

[koolmom]

Further goes to show how far hypocritical conservatives go when after my 25-year-old, married daughter, new mom, posted her reaction to Pres. Obama's conclusion about gays, that someone she doesn't know (brother of a grown-up version of Bristol) responded

to HER reaction via the following: "Her comment is Correct, spot on, Obama is a two-faced liar, he's for it, then he's against it, now he cowardly hides behind children, to get the unrepentant vote, the day they have a big shindig in whoolywood. Just like on the campaign trail in '08, he says he OS a Christian to the heart of the country, then flies to San Francisco, and tells them, oh, the Christians cling to their guns, and religion, wait, Obama said three hours ago you were a Christian, so you people like and approve of evil, and liars, that's who your friends are,,,see Bristol's comments are true, evidently your parents did not teach the Truth,"

The preceding is from a brother from a large Catholic family whose aforementioned sister was a friend of mine for several years starting right after she'd spawned a daughter by a Mexican illegal who literally was a beach-scavenging bum who camped out in friend's laundry room and pushed a shopping cart around nearby alleys, and of course abused drugs and alcohol. She's already had a son by a previous marriage, and at that time I figured she could use an older friend/mother to mentor her and help with her children. Eventually, I learned her family was a long-time, affluent, well-known in their community who didn't see to have a clue what to do with a single mom sister/daughter who needed several levels of remedial help, both for herself AND her children.

So instead of pooling their resources into doing something constructive for their daughter/sister, they allowed her to live in squalor and on welfare for the duration; her son's dad finally getting fed up with her ineptitude and removed the boy from her home.

While I didn't wish to share too much information about someone here, I couldn't help but note the glaring "log in his eye" attitude

when it came to the brother's own family, yet as we've seen here, conservatives seem to just want to act as if what they do doesn't receive notice by any outside observers. My daughter finally told him to eff off in no uncertain terms.

[alba]

Further goes to show how far hypocritical conservatives go when after my 25-year-old, married daughter, new mom, posted her reaction to Pres. Obama's conclusion about gays, that someone she doesn't know (brother of a grown-up version of Bristol) responded

to HER reaction via the following: "Her comment is Correct, spot on, Obama is a two-faced liar, he's for it, then he's against it, now he cowardly hides behind children, to get the unrepentant vote, the day they have a big shindig in whoolywood. Just like on the campaign trail in '08, he says he OS a Christian to the heart of the country, then flies to San Francisco, and tells them, oh, the Christians cling to their guns, and religion, wait, Obama said three hours ago you were a Christian, so you people like and approve of evil, and liars, that's who your friends are,,,see Bristol's comments are true, evidently your parents did not teach the Truth,"

Where's whoolywood? Sounds fun XD

[Elle]

Back in the day, I kind of respected her for being an abstinence advocate. I don't agree with abstinence as a cure-all (it's a personal choice), and I'm ardently pro-choice, but in general I have a lot of respect for teenage mothers, because not only are they taking on the difficult job of parenting at a young age, but they face slut-shaming and criticism for it, too. Anyway, I used to think Bristol Palin advocating abstinence was a case of someone who (in her mind) had screwed up, reaped the consequences, admitted she was "wrong", and was trying to help other people avoid the same fate. It's not like she got pregnant while advocating abstinence.

She was actually paid a lot of money, in the six figures, to make an appearance and give a speech about abstinence-only. She did it for the money, not because she screwed up. Also it's a lot easier to deal with criticism as a teen parent when your family has, and is willing to spend, the money needed to take care of your little decision

If she got no money in return for her "advocacy," then I'd have had some respect for her. Instead, she was paid to act. It was a job.

[emmiedahl]

I don't think Obama meant that he is asking his little daughters about policy. I think he was referring to a phenomenon that all of us with children have probably noticed. They get to an age where they understand right and wrong, especially where it is tied into fair and unfair, but they are unaware of certain social norms if they were raised in families that don't actively teach them.

To a child who has never been taught otherwise, a family with two moms is just as nice as a family with a mom and a dad. It's not fair that one family would be preferred over the other. Life is not always fair, but children understand that on some level it should be.

If having two moms or two dads was as unnatural as conservatives like to pretend it is, then we would have to indoctrinate children to get them to accept it. In my experience, the matter can be cleared up in one sentence: "Cousin P and T have two moms because Auntie M and Auntie D love each other in a married way, the way Daddy and I love each other." The people I know who are against gay marriage have to constantly talk about why it is wrong, how it is wrong, etc. Children understand love and they understand fairness, that is what I think Obama was getting at.

[alba]

She was actually paid a lot of money, in the six figures, to make an appearance and give a speech about abstinence-only. She did it for the money, not because she screwed up. Also it's a lot easier to deal with criticism as a teen parent when your family has, and is willing to spend, the money needed to take care of your little decision

If she got no money in return for her "advocacy," then I'd have had some respect for her. Instead, she was paid to act. It was a job.

That's my point. I know this *now*, but I didn't several years ago, and if she can appear to be someone who screwed up and recognised what she'd done wrong to a casual observer then it makes her hypocrisy all the more disconcerting, because people are more likely to buy into an abstinence message from her than from a thirty-something married woman.

[galaxygirl]

Wasn't it in her autobiography? i think it was wine coolers. I didn't read the book so I am probably wrong.

That's funny, because that's how the president of the celibacy club on Glee got pregnant as well.

[lilwriter85]

Bristol's book was published in 2011. Maybe she ripped off the idea from Glee lol. Bristol blaming Glee for influencing the Obamas or teenagers is fucking ridiculous. Glee isn't the first TV show to tackle gay and lesbian topics. But Bristol probably doesn't know that. Back in the 90's, a few TV shows did have small storylines related to teen homosexuality. I remember on Blossom, there was an episode about Joey's baseball teammate being gay. ABC soaps like All My Children and One Life to Live tackled the subject. There was also Ellen. In the early 00's, was when the increase in gay and lesbian characters started to slowly happen (e.g. Will and Grace, Six Feet Under, Queer as Folk).

The Obamas have likely had gay acquaintances or contacts for years. Sometimes knowing certain people can change or shape peoples' views. My father used to be very conservative years ago. He wasn't accepting of gays and lesbians. My mom has several gay and lesbian relatives and friends, who in the past 10 have become very open and they live with their partners. Over time, my dad communicated with them a bit at social events and he learned to accept gay people. My father supports gay marriage and more rights for gay people. My dad would have never learned to accept gay people just by watching TV shows that featured gay characters. Maybe some people have learned to accept gays because of fictional characters. I think it is a combination of different factors that lead to acceptance and supporting more rights for gays.

[QAF_Rocks]

If having two moms or two dads was as unnatural as conservatives like to pretend it is, then we would have to indoctrinate children to get them to accept it. In my experience, the matter can be cleared up in one sentence: "Cousin P and T have two moms because Auntie M and Auntie D love each other in a married way, the way Daddy and I love each other." The people I know who are against gay marriage have to constantly talk about why it is wrong, how it is wrong, etc. Children understand love and they understand fairness, that is what I think Obama was getting at.

I think that's why conservatives are so worried. They know that children have to be taught to be anti-gay, so that's why they're trying to make sure that homosexuality is still stigmatized, not only in their churches, but also in public schools and society at large. Because, really, when children are raised around gay and lesbian couples, it never even occurs to them to think of it as anything strange or abnormal. I was raised by two moms, and it never crossed my mind that people would think there was something wrong with my family, at least not until I encountered prejudice firsthand.

[SpeakNow]

My synagogue growing up had a lesbian Rabbi. They performed a marriage ceremony for her and her partner (even though it wasn't a "legal" marriage). As a child I assumed it was perfectly normal for 2 people of the same sex to get married. It was until my family moved from NYC to Tennessee that I realized some people thought that being gay was somehow "wrong."

[Mela99]

Anybody know what Bristle-y Britches Bristol* does these days anyway? Does she go to school or work, or have I just confused her with "real" teen moms who do that?

*I was thinking of Dr.Seuss. So alliteration seemed appropriate.

[lilwriter85]

Anybody know what Bristle-y Britches Bristol* does these days anyway? Does she go to school or work, or have I just confused her with "real" teen moms who do that?

*I was thinking of Dr.Seuss. So alliteration seemed appropriate.

The last I read she was back in Alaska. She lived in Los Angeles for awhile and she lived two brothers who are actors, Kyle and Christopher Massey. She also bought a house in Arizona which she rents out and when bought the house, there were rumors of her planning to attend Arizona State. Those rumors were shot down. So far she isn't attending school and she is probably making money off her ridiculous speaking career.

She has another reality show that is supposed to air on Lifetime. The A&E show got canned before anything was aired. I laugh at her involvement with Lifetime. For years, Lifetime has done several LGBT related movies and they have had programs in which gay celebrities have been interviewed.

[Evilbad]

Samurai Sarah, I hope you don't mind but I just took what you wrote and used it to respond to a "GAY MARRIAGE IS UNNATURAL AND JESUS HATES IT" posts on facebook. Fully credited to you, of course.

[samurai_sarah]

Samurai Sarah, I hope you don't mind but I just took what you wrote and used it to respond to a "GAY MARRIAGE IS UNNATURAL AND JESUS HATES IT" posts on facebook. Fully credited to you, of course.

Feel free. :)