Have We Discussed This Article On Modesty?

[debrand]

hybridstudent.blogspot.com/2012/04/modesty-guys-opinion-part-1.html

A search on our forum did not show that we had discussed this article but I find it difficult to believe one of you had not already discovered it. It is snarkastic, after all.

[debrand]

What if someone feels most comfortable going naked? Should they because it’s comfortable? I think almost everyone would agree absolutely not. Why? Because it’s not respectful to others.

Sometimes I think that it would be better if everyone was allowed to go nude. Ther is nothing moral about wearing clothing. We do so for comfort, fashion and to obey our country's laws. Maybe if we saw more people nude there would be less sexualization of the human body and a better understanding of the fact that there are many different body types.

Comfort is not a good reason to be immodest because elevating our comfort over the liberty of others is wrong, and modest clothes are comfortable anyway. And if they aren’t comfortable, maybe you just need to get used to it. Wearing just what pleases us is selfish, and therefore a no-go

Yet, it isn't selfish for a man to demand that a woman wear clothing to protect him from temptation. Why is the pressure only on the woman to be modest or to guard the man. She should wear something she finds uncomfortable so this guy isn't offended.

Part two is better

The weakness of the male has been known and well documented for thousands of years. Girls know they can attract guys by what they wear (or what they don’t wear). Yes, it’s true. It’s not a myth. However, the kind of attention girls attract by dressing immodestly is not the kind of attention they want to attract

My husband asked me to marry him while I lay naked in the bed with him so either I am really, really good(Probably) or he was able to view me as more then a sexual object.(also likely) It amazes me that fundies do not understand that their views on modesty insults men as well as women. Do they really believe that men can't see women as multidimensional human beings?

Sure, the responsibility is 100% on the guy not to stumble. He has the power to control himself. It’s no one’s fault but his own when he stumbles. But! It’s very frustrating when girls, especially his sisters in Christ, are aiding the side of Satan. You wouldn’t talk about cigarettes in front of a person who was trying to stop smoking, right?

Wow.

[holothuroidea]

Alright. I had quoted and responded to some stuff. But I just stopped and deleted everything when I saw him talking about those pre-adolescent girls.

WHAT THE F***

[debrand]

Alright. I had quoted and responded to some stuff. But I just stopped and deleted everything when I saw him talking about those pre-adolescent girls.

WHAT THE F***

http://www.hybridstudent.blogspot.com/2 ... art-2.html

Part two is even more interesting

Immodesty invites guys to treat girls poorly. It can make it hard for guys to even see girls as people.

When girls dress immodestly, I feel like they’re trying to take advantage of me because of my weakness. I feel like they’re trying to manipulate me. I don’t like that. Who does? Who likes people trying to take advantage and manipulate them?

So girls, do yourself and your brothers in Christ a favor and put some decent clothes on. If you want people, let alone guys, to respect you at all, you’ve got to dress modestly!

[holothuroidea]

Immodesty invites guys to treat girls poorly. It can make it hard for guys to even see girls as people.

And acting like you have a right to tell people how to dress invites me to treat you poorly. It can make it hard for me to even see you as a person. :roll:

When girls dress immodestly, I feel like they’re trying to take advantage of me because of my weakness. I feel like they’re trying to manipulate me. I don’t like that. Who does? Who likes people trying to take advantage and manipulate them?

When men force modesty on women, I feel like they're trying to take my individuality and humanity away by force. I feel like they are trying to manipulate me. I don't like that. ...Who does?...

Ahem, et cetera...

Also this guy is giving me a creeper stomach ache. Does anyone else get those? Urrgghh..

[dairyfreelife]

Girls (and guys) shouldn’t spend any time thinking about how to attract the opposite gender.

But they do, all the time. They are obsessed with how another dresses. Godly girls will never attract Godly boys if they wear pants and shirts that have a little cleavage.

when men are shown pictures of scantily clad women, the region of the brain associated with tool use lights up (is activated). Tool use! For example, areas of the brain that normally activate in anticipation of using tools, like hammers, wrenches, screwdrivers, etc. The researchers also found that a part of the brain that usually turned on during social interaction actually de-activated when they saw the pictures. Do girls realize they’re making themselves into objects—tools--when they dress immodestly? When you cease to dress modestly you can actually cease to be a person in the eyes of men.

If this true, then what do these fundie men think when they first see their new wife naked? Is she suddenly an object and not a person? I don't buy that all men will see a woman with cleavage and cease to see her as a person. If they do, they have a problem, not the woman.

Lust is a weakness for guys, and I don't like girls trying to prey on my weakness. When girls dress immodestly, I feel like they’re trying to take advantage of me because of my weakness. I feel like they’re trying to manipulate me.

WTF? This is almost horrifying and a detect a sense of paranoia. She's trying to manipulate and prey on me! It's actually scary.

You’re battling your fleshly weakness on one hand, and you’re battling not to resent the people who are trying to manipulate you and cause you to stumble on the other.

This guy has issues.

However, when a man sins as a result of a woman's immodesty, the woman has also sinned.

This is scary. It's like when creeps rape when and then say it was her fault because she tempted him somehow. Such bullshit.

[TinyDancer87]

I am fed up with all the obsession with clothes from these fundies! OH MY GOSH STOP OBSESSING WITH CLOTHES! I have a fun fact for you, my fundy friend. God knew that Adam and Eve sinned by them covering themselves and being ashamed! In fact, it pissed God off so much that they were wearing fig-leaves that he kicked them out of Eden. So why, oh why, do you insist on continuing in this obsession of covering? Let's just live the way God intended us to, strip naked, and be free! Because I'm starting to think that modesty is the sin, and being naked is HOLY :)

[brittanyalexis77]

Alright. I had quoted and responded to some stuff. But I just stopped and deleted everything when I saw him talking about those pre-adolescent girls.

WHAT THE F***

I had the exact same reaction. Couldn't he have at least used someone of a more reasonable age to attempt to make his point? Or would that have been "a sin" since he would have to admit that he found a woman attractive.

[Defrauding Errday]

This guy cares way too much about how women dress, especially since he's planning on writing a part 3.

[debrand]

This guy cares way too much about how women dress, especially since he's planning on writing a part 3.

A lot of fundie men get outraged that they have a very normal attraction for another person. Most of the comments on his blog are from fundie women. It amazes me that the young women don't see the anger and disrespect that he expresses.

[ADoyle90815]

This guy has issues.

This is scary. It's like when creeps rape when and then say it was her fault because she tempted him somehow. Such bullshit.

I agree, he seems like the type who would rape a woman and say it was her fault because she was dressed immodestly.

[jesssnerch]

I tried to read that but it made my eyes go crazy. White font on black background BLOWS!

[geniebelle6901]

This guy reeks of pedophile, child molester, and rapist! Very scary if he lives your neighborhood and you're a young woman or a parent of teenage girls.

[samurai_sarah]

I am fed up with all the obsession with clothes from these fundies! OH MY GOSH STOP OBSESSING WITH CLOTHES! I have a fun fact for you, my fundy friend. God knew that Adam and Eve sinned by them covering themselves and being ashamed! In fact, it pissed God off so much that they were wearing fig-leaves that he kicked them out of Eden. So why, oh why, do you insist on continuing in this obsession of covering? Let's just live the way God intended us to, strip naked, and be free! Because I'm starting to think that modesty is the sin, and being naked is HOLY :)

I agree with you. Clothes are a biblical sign of sin, so let's cast them all off and be innocent children of god! Actually, nude bodies get pretty boring, pretty fast. Where I'm from nudism and nudist colonies are fairly popular. Our local lake was a popular spot for people to just strip completely in summer, so you got to see all ages, all shapes, male and female. Far from defrauding it was just...meh, another naked person. Clothes cover you up, and thereby fuel the sinful imagination. That's where the real danger lies!!! :)

[Olivia]

He's clearly not as much of a man as my husband, who has respected my character and intellect from day #1 while also admiring my legs in a mini-skirt.

[debrand]

I agree with you. Clothes are a biblical sign of sin, so let's cast them all off and be innocent children of god! Actually, nude bodies get pretty boring, pretty fast. Where I'm from nudism and nudist colonies are fairly popular. Our local lake was a popular spot for people to just strip completely in summer, so you got to see all ages, all shapes, male and female. Far from defrauding it was just...meh, another naked person. Clothes cover you up, and thereby fuel the sinful imagination. That's where the real danger lies!!! :)

The Ferengi agree with you. :D

Sorry, my nerdiness sometimes shows.

[samithemage]

A Christian guy I know (guy A) described it well when he said, “Life is a battle over lust for men and boys. I only ask that you don't give aide to the other side.â€

All I can (mostly) think when I read this quote is, I'm sure he didn't mean it to sound like he's lusting after men and boys, but perhaps this could have been phrased more clearly. It could sound quite "scandalous" if read incorrectly by his xtian friends.

[samurai_sarah]

The Ferengi agree with you. :D

Sorry, my nerdiness sometimes shows.

I wish there were a "like" button! ;) Oh, Deep Space Nine... *sigh*

[bananacat]

You know what? Plenty of guys treat women in burqas badly. Covering up doesn't make men respect you.

[holothuroidea]

Well the whole idea behind modesty is completely baseless and stupid. It is not possible to control how other people think/behave by your own actions (in this case, the way you dress).

It's really only a justification for the rules men imposed upon their wives and daughters (read: chattel) because of their own insecurities and jealousy.

The new breed of fundamentalist woman who takes these things upon herself without force from a husband must do it in complete ignorance of why the rules were created in the first place. I think they must have a desire to relinquish responsibility for personal appearance and are relieved to have it all decided for them. That, I suppose, is understandable given the climate towards women's bodies and appearance in our culture.

My two cents.

ETA: From the perspective of the creep who wrote this blog.. I can imagine if you live in a world where you are made to feel like your greatest weakness is lust for women that it is easy to be angry with them or find them "indecent" for being visible at all. And then to be slightly less angry at the women who at least try their very hardest to be invisible.

That's just the sort of f***ed up (pun intended) thing that happens when you turn normal human sexuality into an evil that must be tamed in order for you to be a "good" person. :(

This guy's sexuality is obviously completely messed up. I feel sorry for him (and also any future wives/children he might have).

[valsa]

I agree, he seems like the type who would rape a woman and say it was her fault because she was dressed immodestly.

So much this. This guy should have a red flag tattooed on his forehead.

A Christian guy I know (guy A) described it well when he said, “Life is a battle over lust for men and boys. I only ask that you don't give aide to the other side.â€

And why is the supposed weakness of the male race my problem again?

[ilovetchotchkes]

I agree with you. Clothes are a biblical sign of sin, so let's cast them all off and be innocent children of god! Actually, nude bodies get pretty boring, pretty fast. Where I'm from nudism and nudist colonies are fairly popular. Our local lake was a popular spot for people to just strip completely in summer, so you got to see all ages, all shapes, male and female. Far from defrauding it was just...meh, another naked person. Clothes cover you up, and thereby fuel the sinful imagination. That's where the real danger lies!!! :)

My 2 year old then is the most G-dly of them all. I could NOT keep a diaper on him today.

I have nothing wrong with nudity in principle, but my ow body issues would keep me from stripping down. Not that there's anything to lust after, period, I'm fat, have the scars of childbearing all over my stomach (lovely stretchmarks).

I'm sorry, if you don't want your son to treat women as sex objects, teach him that women are to be respected regardless of how they look. No schlumpy frumpers needed!!!!

[VintageJen1984]

In the end I'd rather this guy and his ilk see me as an object and not a real person. That way I know to stay away from him rather than mistaking him for someone who wants to know me, in more than just the biblical way.

[snarkbillie]

I have nothing wrong with nudity in principle, but my ow body issues would keep me from stripping down. Not that there's anything to lust after, period, I'm fat, have the scars of childbearing all over my stomach (lovely stretchmarks).

I don't know any moms who don't have stretchmarks. I know how it feels to be self conscious but it's worth it to keep in mind that stretchmarks and the like are just part of having kids. Every mom has some things that changed when she had her kids.

[luckystone]

Wow, so messed up. I think my favourites were "makes it hard to see women as people" (how exactly???) and how the woman has also sinned if her immodesty causes a man to do something.