Romney's son Tagg has twins via surrogacy.

[debrand]

So it is ok for the Romney's to ignore LDS teachings when it comes to surrogacy but Catholics, who ignore the church's teachings on birth control, must be punished and not have their birth control covered? Why am I not suprised. ::SMH::

Politicians often defend or create rules that they have no intention of following.

[FlorenceHamilton]

Politicians often defend or create rules that they have no intention of following.

If you read the book we have discussed here on FJ about the studies done by Bob Altemeyer in his book, "The Authoritatians", he discusses this very thing. The leaders of authoritarian movements are the ones who also feel that they have no reason to follow the very laws that they are making and vowing to enforce. The followers will actually die defending both these rules and the leader despite often knowing that the leader holds himself above the law.

[bananacat]

I'm pretty sure that the main objection to IVF and surrogacy is the precious little fertilized eggs that end up getting "killed" as a by-product. As far as I know, Mormons and Catholics wouldn't have much problem with the kid conceived that way; they would just whine about all the little "babies" that are sitting in a freezer or disposed of.

[debrand]

If you read the book we have discussed here on FJ about the studies done by Bob Altemeyer in his book, "The Authoritatians", he discusses this very thing. The leaders of authoritarian movements are the ones who also feel that they have no reason to follow the very laws that they are making and vowing to enforce. The followers will actually die defending both these rules and the leader despite often knowing that the leader holds himself above the law.

I've noticed that about a lot of modern Republicans.

[FlorenceHamilton]

I've noticed that about a lot of modern Republicans.

Which is exactly why I can no longer vote for members of that Party. I am an Independent and this fact saddens and frightens me.

[MonkeyMomma]

Even worse...

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/20 ... fter-a-gun

Lawd. People need to think before they do this to their offspring.

[Beammeup]

I'm pretty sure that the main objection to IVF and surrogacy is the precious little fertilized eggs that end up getting "killed" as a by-product. As far as I know, Mormons and Catholics wouldn't have much problem with the kid conceived that way; they would just whine about all the little "babies" that are sitting in a freezer or disposed of.

Actually IVF itself isn't banned in Mormonism. The use of donor gametes is highly frowned. The LDS church also does not forbid birth control, just an FYI. My guess is that the problems with using donor sperm/surrogacy might be sealing question related.

Seems Mitt's kids love IVF for some reason. This article says 3 of them did it. The article says whichever one used the surrogate told their bishop first. http://www.politico.com/news/stories/05 ... z1twlwqAyQ

Relevant LDS church policies are found here (all together for your linking pleasure) http://www.lds.org/handbook/handbook-2- ... ng=eng#214

[emmiedahl]

Wait, 3 of them have used surrogates?

I guess at that level of wealth one cannot be asked to bear their own children even?

srsly, how can a person from this family ever understand the lives of normal Americans? They are so divorced from reality. They practically have a restraining order against it! :lol:

[VVV]

I'm pretty sure that the main objection to IVF and surrogacy is the precious little fertilized eggs that end up getting "killed" as a by-product. As far as I know, Mormons and Catholics wouldn't have much problem with the kid conceived that way; they would just whine about all the little "babies" that are sitting in a freezer or disposed of.

Except for that teacher that got fired from a Catholic school for taking time off to do IVF...she had gone to the trouble of finding a clinic that did not dispose of unused embryos, and yet it was not enough. :?

[silvia]

If you read the book we have discussed here on FJ about the studies done by Bob Altemeyer in his book, "The Authoritarians", he discusses this very thing. The leaders of authoritarian movements are the ones who also feel that they have no reason to follow the very laws that they are making and vowing to enforce. The followers will actually die defending both these rules and the leader despite often knowing that the leader holds himself above the law.

So true! On a side note, "The Authoritarians" is an excellent book that explains a lot about fundamentalist movements in general, and I highly recommend it to all free jingerites. The free full text can be accessed here: http://home.cc.umanitoba.ca/~altemey/

[JenniferJuniper]

Seems Mitt's kids love IVF for some reason. This article says 3 of them did it. The article says whichever one used the surrogate told their bishop first. http://www.politico.com/news/stories/05 ... z1twlwqAyQ

"According to a biography written by a distant Romney relative, Ronald B Scott, a former Time Inc writer, at least three of Mitt Romney’s sons have used in vitro fertilization."

Why ruin your figure and deal with the pain and mess of childbirth when you can simply pay someone else to do it for you?

I think this should be a major media story. It proves how far from the real world the Romney family really is.

[tabitha2]

OT but You know most Hollywood actresses do it or just adopt because they don't what to deal with weight loss and gain.

[JenniferJuniper]

OT but You know most Hollywood actresses do it or just adopt because they don't what to deal with weight loss and gain.

Oh, you mean "the Hollywood Elite" we keep hearing about from the Republicans?

The Romneys are about as elitist as you can get.

[silvia]

Wait, 3 of them have used surrogates?

I guess at that level of wealth one cannot be asked to bear their own children even?

srsly, how can a person from this family ever understand the lives of normal Americans? They are so divorced from reality. They practically have a restraining order against it! :lol:

No, 3 of them have used IVF, not surrogates (artificial fertilization usually does not involve surrogacy). And to be fair, the vast majority of IVF and surrogacy treatments occur because the couples involved (including many celebrities) have biological issues conceiving or carrying on their own, not because the women are vain about their figures or can't be bothered to bear their own children. I think these are unfair assumptions to make here, and I'm far from being a fan of the Romneys.

[QAF_Rocks]

No, 3 of them have used IVF, not surrogates (artificial fertilization usually does not involve surrogacy). And to be fair, the vast majority of IVF and surrogacy treatments occur because the couples involved (including many celebrities) have biological issues conceiving or carrying on their own, not because the women are vain about their figures or can't be bothered to bear their own children. I think these are unfair assumptions to make here, and I'm far from being a fan of the Romneys.

True. There's no reason for any couple, gay or straight, to use IVF unless there are fertility issues. Regular artificial insemination would be sufficient for a fertile woman who doesn't want to conceive through sexual intercourse.

[graciebeth]

I used to know a little boy named Tag but it was short for Taggart which was his mom's maiden name and her family has a multi-generational tradition of giving your first child your maiden name as their first name. (Her name is Harper for this reason)

[gustava]

Why are there such serious infertililty issues with at least 3 of the 5 boys? That seems a bit high.

[slickcat79]

No, 3 of them have used IVF, not surrogates (artificial fertilization usually does not involve surrogacy). And to be fair, the vast majority of IVF and surrogacy treatments occur because the couples involved (including many celebrities) have biological issues conceiving or carrying on their own, not because the women are vain about their figures or can't be bothered to bear their own children. I think these are unfair assumptions to make here, and I'm far from being a fan of the Romneys.

I don't know about the other two sons, or if it's even true that they used IVF, but Tagg's wife Jen conceived and gave birth to at least 3 children naturally. It did say that the twins are biologically Tagg's and Jen's, not the surrogate's, so at the very least they don't seem to have problems conceiving. Maybe the last birth had complications, so they chose to use a surrogate for future pregnancies? True that there's no way to know for sure.

[silvia]

I don't know about the other two sons, or if it's even true that they used IVF, but Tagg's wife Jen conceived and gave birth to at least 3 children naturally. It did say that the twins are biologically Tagg's and Jen's, not the surrogate's, so at the very least they don't seem to have problems conceiving. Maybe the last birth had complications, so they chose to use a surrogate for future pregnancies? True that there's no way to know for sure.

Secondary infertility is extremely common. Successful pregnancies in the past are no guarantee of future successful pregnancies, especially when the woman is on the older end of the fertile age range--I believe Jen is 39. It's also possible Jen may have developed a problem with her uterus since the successful pregnancies, making a surrogate necessary if she wants to have more children.

And the fact that the twins are biologically Tagg's and Jen's does NOT necessarily mean that they haven't had recent problems conceiving naturally. With gestational surrogacy, the egg and sperm of the biological parents are joined outside the body in a laboratory setting, then the created embryo is put into the surrogate's uterus.

[slickcat79]

Secondary infertility is extremely common. Successful pregnancies in the past are no guarantee of future successful pregnancies, especially when the woman is on the older end of the fertile age range--I believe Jen is 39. It's also possible Jen may have developed a problem with her uterus since the successful pregnancies, making a surrogate necessary if she wants to have more children.

And the fact that the twins are biologically Tagg's and Jen's does NOT necessarily mean that they haven't had recent problems conceiving naturally. With gestational surrogacy, the egg and sperm of the biological parents are joined outside the body in a laboratory setting, then the created embryo is put into the surrogate's uterus.

Yeah, I get that, I was just trying to distinguish between people who use a surrogate as a gestational carrier, and surrogates who have a biological connection to the fetuses they carry. Also to point out that they have not always had fertility problems. My aunt did kind of the opposite...she and her new husband wanted to have a child, but she was in her 40s and they were concerned about the effect that aging eggs might have on fetal development. My aunt carried their daughter, but they used donor eggs to conceive. Obviously that wasn't a concern for the Romneys since they used Jen's eggs. Whatever problems they have developed, if any, are fairly recent are not the same as a couple who have never managed to conceive a biological child naturally.

[lilwriter85]

OT but You know most Hollywood actresses do it or just adopt because they don't what to deal with weight loss and gain.

That is probably the reason some of them use surrogacy or adopt. I read about Elizabeth Banks using surrogacy and I did wonder if she went that route because of weight issues. Katey Sagal used surrogacy mainly because she had miscarriages and other health issues in the past. I think some actresses adopt for reasons not related to weight issues. There are few a 40 something actresses that have recently adopted, but I get the vibe they did it because they probably don't want to go through midlife pregnancies and they wanted to help children in need.

[icecreamycakeycake]

Tagg, Tripp, Track, what next, Dodge Ball?

Red Rover...duh!

[cindyluvs24]

OT I remember Sarah Palin saying, "we named our son, Track because we love to run and we named our daughter, Bristol because we love Bristol Bay." I wonder if they named their son, Trig because they love math ;)

Jeez i lucked out. My mother was taking a class in soviet economic policy. I could have been named "Five Year plan"

[roddma]

Twins could be Polo and Puck or Hockey and Puck. Ghees I thought Moon Unit and Dweezel were bad enough.

[margiebargie]

Simonsays?