The cost of the no vaxer's

[sassyNoz47]

I have an immune compromised kiddo who is not able to get an MMR or Varicella vaccine so this stuff terrifies me.

It was ridiculous how easy it was to register for kindergarten without it. "Do I need to provide some medical documentation for why we don't have all the shots." "No, just sign right here"

:?

seriously?? Here it was not easy. Paperwork galore..dr note state exemption form again signed by dr and repeated every school year.

[sage]

IIRC the only vax that contains thimerosal is the flu vax and there's a pediatric version that is thimerosal free. Or does the MMR still contain it?

Thimerosal has been slowly phased out of all vaccines and with the exception of the multi-dose flu vaccine, which contains only trace amount, is not present in any. The FDA issued new guidelines in 1999 for the removal from childhood vaccinations, which was completed by 2001 (exception: multi-dose flu). You can get single-dose injections that are Thimerosal-free; they tend to be more expensive, but if you are truly worried about exposure, you can ask for it.

Here is the FDA site for all your Thimerosal needs: http://www.fda.gov/biologicsbloodvaccines/safetyavailability/vaccinesafety/ucm096228.htm and the CDC: http://www.cdc.gov/vaccinesafety/concerns/thimerosal/thimerosal_timeline.html

I have to say that one of my biggest complaints is the screaming of OMG! MERCURY!!!!ELEVENTY!!! Yes, there *is* mercury contained in the Thimerosal, but the problem is: many "studies" (and I use that term very loosely) that have published anything on the "mercury controversy" are using the tables for methylmercury, which does bioaccumulate and can cause harm, but is not what is contained in vaccinations. Vaccinations contain(ed) ethylmercury, which does not bioaccumulate, and is secreted in the stool within two days time at the most.

[Conuly]

God only knows how much blood is on that bitch's hands.

And not just because of non-vaccinated children. For a while they were pushing chelation of autistic kids to "remove" the "mercury". Children died because of this. Multiple children.

I get so angry just thinking about it. I better go take a breather.

[ilovetchotchkes]

Chicken pox is just "annoying" for some kids, even a majority of kids. However, you can't really predict if your kid will be the "more than annoying" case. My husband and his brother got chicken pox in their lungs. They were otherwise perfectly healthy kids. They spent a month recovering from it. I just had an annoying case, but I still have a couple of scars. Even the "mild" versions can leave scars. Of course, you have to do the best thing for your own kids. I'm just offering a data point.

Oh no, he's getting vaccinated for it as soon as he goes in for his 2 year old visit. Once I read the eczema+death complication, I was like, uh "you're getting jabbed kid"

[keen23]

We received notification on Friday of five confirmed cases of Whooping Cough at my kids' elementary school (900+ kids at the school). My kids are fully vaccinated, many others are not.

A friend is dealing with the fact that her husband is sterile, and currently, their doctor believes it was probably caused by the mumps- he had a horrible case when he was in his teens. His parents didn't/don't believe in vaccinations, and now they're paying the price for decisions that his parents made when he was too young to know the difference.

[TXDuck]

Oh no, he's getting vaccinated for it as soon as he goes in for his 2 year old visit. Once I read the eczema+death complication, I was like, uh "you're getting jabbed kid"

:lol: Apologies if I sounded "scoldy". That was most definitely not my intention.

[Dhani_C]

I have a sibling with a rare and very genetic disease, although my family has absolutely no history of anyone having this disease*. A family with an autistic child once told my parents that autism couldn't be genetic because you can't have a genetic disease without a family history. My parents were like, um, funny story.**

:doh:

*It's either a recessive trait that got passed down without making a homozygous pair until she was conceived or she got a de novo mutation on her own. But they know exactly what single protein is missing to cause the disease, so it's been connected to genetics more easily than Autism, which is probably associated with multiple genes instead of just one, and is therefore harder to parse.

**Actually, they weren't like that. They didn't say anything to refute the other family's genetic theories and just let it go, because they're a very non-confrontational people. Only later were they like, wow, were they so wrong about genetics or what? I think it would have been awesomer if they'd said something at the time, but oh well.

The thing is, as my genetics professor told all of us, autism is one of those conditions whose criteria has changed so frequently that it could be in your family without one realizing it. If you ever read about or heard from an older relative about a family member that was "off", "weird", or "strange" then there's your genetic link (not in all cases, but it's a strong possibility). Of course, I am not insinuating that autistic people are off, strange, or weird- just that if these descriptions were ever attributed to a family member's behavior (before autism was recognized as a disorder) then it's likely they could have been suffering from it.

[emmiedahl]

Doggie, thank you for posting this - it is a subject near and dear to my heart. Not only am I an infectious disease researcher (in a nonprofit organization), but I am also the mother of an immunocompromised little boy. Oh, and I livw in Washington. Seeing as he was just released from the hospital today (he had been there since Friday for an infection), can quite honestly smack the first non-vaxer Icame across had my son been infected with something vaccine preventable (not the case tis time around).

FYI, I am not including those who do not continue to vaccinate because of a previous bad reaction to a vaccine or a family history of really bad vaccine reactions. I am, OTOH, including those morons who don't vaccinte because they still believe the thoroughly debunked study by Wakefield that claimed to connect the MMR vaccination with autism.

I live in Washington also, and the numbers of unvaccinated children are astounding. We have a pertussis season here. A completely preventable disease and there is a fucking season for it???

[ilovetchotchkes]

We received notification on Friday of five confirmed cases of Whooping Cough at my kids' elementary school (900+ kids at the school). My kids are fully vaccinated, many others are not.

A friend is dealing with the fact that her husband is sterile, and currently, their doctor believes it was probably caused by the mumps- he had a horrible case when he was in his teens. His parents didn't/don't believe in vaccinations, and now they're paying the price for decisions that his parents made when he was too young to know the difference.

Yeah, my rabbis' daughter had it AND she had been vaccinated, so... I have come to the completely unscientific opinion that whooping cough is one NASTY bastard of a virus.

[BelieveinScience]

Yeah, my rabbis' daughter had it AND she had been vaccinated, so... I have come to the completely unscientific opinion that whooping cough is one NASTY bastard of a virus.

I had whooping cough in high school. The best part I was walking around with that fucker of a virus for a long time before being diagnosed because my parents thought it was just a "cough" related it to be cold outside. It wasn't until I stopped breathing and lost consciousness that anything was done.

[ilovetchotchkes]

I had whooping cough in high school. The best part I was walking around with that fucker of a virus for a long time before being diagnosed because my parents thought it was just a "cough" related it to be cold outside. It wasn't until I stopped breathing and lost consciousness that anything was done.

My friend who has a reaction to the pertussis vaccine so she can't be vaccinated for it has had it TWICE. She said "it was the worst ever, I coughed until I threw up, multiple times a day, Get your kid vaccinated"

[emmiedahl]

The flu doesn't work that way. As for what you saw on a morning show, ask any practicing doctor about news coverage of health issues. I'm surprised their eyes don't fall out, they roll them so hard.

About the flu getting worse, look up the Spanish flu of 1918. People died within hours of developing symptoms. It killed more Americans than both world wars. In many cases it turned hemorrhagic, like ebola-type shit. Modern medical professionals live in fear of a flu like that getting out in modern times.

[Kaylee]

I just wish they would seperate the vaccines for the boosters. When the schools required my DD to get the DTap I pulle dher from school because my DH & eldest DD have had reactions to the Tetanus part of the vaccine if given too soon. She would have only had 5 years since her last Tetanus which was way too soon in my mind. I have asked the Clininc if they can do just hte pertussis and they say it doesn't work that way. So she will be getting it this year after she turns 16 and has a 10 year gap.

As a child I had all 3 diseases MMR and even had chicken pox twice. My 2 eldest have had the pox, my youngest DD had the vaccine which I am told she will need a booster since it wears off?

Nobody manufactures a separate Pertussis vaccine. You can get Tetanus alone or D/T, which is mostly for people who've had bad reactions to the Pertussis part of the vaccine, but doctors and clinics can't separate them other ways because the separate vaccines are not available.

MMR is similar. You used to be able to order the vaccines separately and give separate shots, and Merck had claimed they were going to reintroduce them in 2011, but decided not. It's more profitable for them to focus manufacturing their MMRV vaccine which combines the MMR & chickenpox vaccines.

There also seems to have been some perception that offering separate vaccines caters to anti- vaccine fears, but I think dropping them makes people on the fence less likely to vaccinate. I was hoping for the separate shots for as many things as possible because my husband and I both have histories of severe vaccine reactions, the the point that my pediatrician advised separating MMR so we could still give the other 2 if there was a reaction to one part. We ended up doing titer tests and he has some immunity for all 3, so we are holding off on the shots and re-testing yearly to see if/when he will need a shot. The titer tests can be expensive though, and I don't know if most doctors go for them or if schools will accept them in lieu of vaccines.

[DarkAnts]

I don't care if someone chooses to vaccinate or not vaccinate their kids. The problem I've found though is that people who are against vaxing their 'sources' are all biased. I have yet to meet an anti vaxer who has found their information through non biased sources(as in websites that say their mission is to stop vaccinations etc..) or I find a lot of anti vaxers get hung up on the "vaccines come from aborted fetuses" bull shit.

Some vaccines are grown on human diploid cells. There are two cell lines used for this. Both cell lines originally came from fetus that were aborted. The cells are grown in the lab and are used because the vaccines wont grow on animal tissue. The cell lines were obtained in the 60's so there is very little chance that the original fetal cells are still in them.

The parents of the aborted fetuses agreed to let doctors use the cells from the fetus to grow vaccines. I point that God may have moved the parents to do this to anyone who gives this as a reason not to vaccinate. They never agree with this reasoning :roll:. They seem to think that its Gods plan to have thousands of children suffer and possibly die from diseases that are preventable with vaccines. If this is Gods plan then I want no part of it.

[BelieveinScience]

My friend who has a reaction to the pertussis vaccine so she can't be vaccinated for it has had it TWICE. She said "it was the worst ever, I coughed until I threw up, multiple times a day, Get your kid vaccinated"

It was nasty I had symptoms for months and it sucked I missed a ton of school. Only a couple of times I coughed until I threw up instead I would cough then temporarily stop breathing. I was given a daily inhaler to try and help my symptoms but it didn't help. It royally sucked I would rather contract my parasite again then get whooping cough again and that's saying something.

[Austin]

Oh no, he's getting vaccinated for it as soon as he goes in for his 2 year old visit. Once I read the eczema+death complication, I was like, uh "you're getting jabbed kid"

I have taken major shit over the years for having my sons vaccinated against the chicken pox, but basically my message back can be summed up as this: .

One of my sons was very symptomatic with his asthma back then and asthma can seriously complicate chicken pox. I didn't see the need for the other two to suffer through it, either. That was 10 years ago or so. They all got CP booster shots at their well-visits in 2010.

[BelieveinScience]

Some vaccines are grown on human diploid cells. There are two cell lines used for this. Both cell lines originally came from fetus that were aborted. The cells are grown in the lab and are used because the vaccines wont grow on animal tissue. The cell lines were obtained in the 60's so there is very little chance that the original fetal cells are still in them.

The parents of the aborted fetuses agreed to let doctors use the cells from the fetus to grow vaccines. I point that God may have moved the parents to do this to anyone who gives this as a reason not to vaccinate. They never agree with this reasoning :roll:. They seem to think that its Gods plan to have thousands of children suffer and possibly die from diseases that are preventable with vaccines. If this is Gods plan then I want no part of it.

Correct. These people I'm referring to still think that when you get an abortion the evil scientists snatch the aborted fetuses out of the trash can to put into the vaccines all because a "nurse from PP told them so"

[tacky]

My children were selectively vaxed and vaxed on a delayed schedule with the input/support of our pediatrician. My husband's brother had a severe reaction to a vaccination and ended up in a coma and mentally handicapped. Our ped advised that our kids not have any live vaccines (polio was live at that time...not sure what it's like now) and obviously we skipped the one that my brother-in-law reacted to so badly. She also suggested we forego the chicken pox vax, which we did. They all caught chicken pox when my oldest DD brought it home from preschool. I'm in no way an anti-vax crusader, but I am comfortable with our decision.

[DarkAnts]

Yeah, my rabbis' daughter had it AND she had been vaccinated, so... I have come to the completely unscientific opinion that whooping cough is one NASTY bastard of a virus.

Whooping cough is caused by a bacteria not a virus. It can be treated with antibiotics, but, its still miserable to get it.

[DarkAnts]

My children were selectively vaxed and vaxed on a delayed schedule with the input/support of our pediatrician. My husband's brother had a severe reaction to a vaccination and ended up in a coma and mentally handicapped. Our ped advised that our kids not have any live vaccines (polio was live at that time...not sure what it's like now) and obviously we skipped the one that my brother-in-law reacted to so badly. She also suggested we forego the chicken pox vax, which we did. They all caught chicken pox when my oldest DD brought it home from preschool. I'm in no way an anti-vax crusader, but I am comfortable with our decision.

But, you have a valid reason to skip some vaccines and vaccine on a delayed schedule. Your children are one of the reasons its important for everyone else to get vaccinated. Herd immunity can help protect those who cant get vaccinated.

[DarkAnts]

I have taken major shit over the years for having my sons vaccinated against the chicken pox, but basically my message back can be summed up as this: .

One of my sons was very symptomatic with his asthma back then and asthma can seriously complicate chicken pox. I didn't see the need for the other two to suffer through it, either. That was 10 years ago or so. They all got CP booster shots at their well-visits in 2010.

I got chicken pox as a child. This was before the vaccination came out. I have asthma and eczema. It was miserable. I would have been in the hospital if my mom had not been a nurse.

[kb2]

The thing is, as my genetics professor told all of us, autism is one of those conditions whose criteria has changed so frequently that it could be in your family without one realizing it. If you ever read about or heard from an older relative about a family member that was "off", "weird", or "strange" then there's your genetic link (not in all cases, but it's a strong possibility). Of course, I am not insinuating that autistic people are off, strange, or weird- just that if these descriptions were ever attributed to a family member's behavior (before autism was recognized as a disorder) then it's likely they could have been suffering from it.

Oh, I definitely get the argument that autism really is in families with "no history" just because there were older generations who went undiagnosed due to either diagnostic substitution or how mild they were on the spectrum. But you also don't need a family history in an individual's family for a disease to be genetic--so even if people are unwilling to connect their "weird" relatives to autism, denying a family history does not rule out a genetic cause as some people think. Recessive traits, or new mutations, or expanding triplet repeats (as in Huntington's) are all capable of causing genetic diseases to pop up in families with no history.

I think we agree with each other, I just wanted to :angry-soapbox: some more : )

[Terrie]

Whooping cough is caused by a bacteria not a virus. It can be treated with antibiotics, but, its still miserable to get it.

And often, by the time you're diagnosed, the antibiotics are as much to prevent spreading as they are to shorten the length of illness. You're still going to cough until you can't stand it.

[starfish]

Chicken pox is just "annoying" for some kids, even a majority of kids. However, you can't really predict if your kid will be the "more than annoying" case. My husband and his brother got chicken pox in their lungs. They were otherwise perfectly healthy kids. They spent a month recovering from it. I just had an annoying case, but I still have a couple of scars. Even the "mild" versions can leave scars. Of course, you have to do the best thing for your own kids. I'm just offering a data point.

Please reconsider the chicken pox vaccine. It was horrible for me personally and I do still have scars. Scars are the least of the problems, though. I have also known of children, before the vaccine was available, who suffered terrible consquences from it (one will not be able to have children). Also, please consider the fact that if your children do contract cp, they are at risk for developing shingles later in life. Shingles are serious business. In addition to being an extremely painful disease, you can also go blind and have other complications.

[geniebelle6901]

Chicken pox is just "annoying" for some kids, even a majority of kids.

I disagree with this. It was more than annoying for me and. I had them from head to toe & even got pneumonia. But maybe that's because I had them when I was 7 years old back in 1976, so maybe that had something to do with how sick I got. But I wonder, if this puts me at risk for shingles later on in life?

ETA: I haven't had any "booster" vaccines since I was a child except for a tetanus shot several years ago. Should I consider getting any "boosters". I am 100% for vaccines.