'Always Learning' asks, “Why buy the cow...?�

[fundifugee]

Don't lesbian couples have the highest rates of the monogamy? Sort of the opposite of rare there....

And, statistically, the safest sex. It is god's design for marriage!!! The healthiest sex ever!!!111!!!!!

[fundifugee]

Here's another blog post about marriage from the nutcase blogger of "Biblical Womanhood":

wow, I am just not seeing a single plus here, only minuses.

[gezykah]

Why buy the cow? For the same reason I wouldn't buy a car without test driving it.

[ShadowyOne]

Here's another blog post about marriage from the nutcase blogger of "Biblical Womanhood":

My biblical knowledge is a little rusty, but if my dim memory (along with recollections from "The Handmaid's Tale") are correct, i believe that Abraham and Jacob both had multiple wives and concubines. Far from being disastrous, they are the epitome of virtuous biblical patriarchs!

[Childless]

I had sex before marriage and my husband still married me. What pre-marital sex got me was a healthy, loving, and respectful marriage and a gorgeous son. Oh, the punishment! LOL

[ShadowyOne]

Why buy the cow? For the same reason I wouldn't buy a car without test driving it.

I've been together with my husband for 11 years, married for 5 1/2 (and no, we didn't wait 5 years to have sex). There's no way that we would have been prepared for marriage (or children) when we were first together, nor would we have been prepared for the necessary compromises involved in cohabiting/marriage if we hadn't been with other people beforehand. I think that all of the emphasis on courtship (which must work almost immediately, or you might give a piece of your heart away) among fundies is just a recipe for disaster. Not only do the young people have no practice at the compromises of daily life (of course, who needs compromise when the woman just submits in everything?), but the sex is sure to be just awful. In reality, nobody knows what they're doing at first, but the expectation in the courtship model is that once it's sanctified, it's going to be all holy and beautiful (listen to the tape that's playing in the car at the very end of Duggar wedding, when Josh & Anna are driving to the honeymoon suite). What an enormous disappointment that's gotta be for both parties!

[1004srs]

I dated and then lived with someone who wouldn't sleep with me until we were married. We slept in the same bed, but nothing else.

I ended the relationship over it. I actually wanted a test drive to ensure I didn't get a lemon.

[fundifugee]

I dated and then lived with someone who wouldn't sleep with me until we were married. We slept in the same bed, but nothing else.

I ended the relationship over it. I actually wanted a test drive to ensure I didn't get a lemon.

wow, that pings the self-hating, closeted gaydar.

[fluttershies]

My biblical knowledge is a little rusty, but if my dim memory (along with recollections from "The Handmaid's Tale") are correct, i believe that Abraham and Jacob both had multiple wives and concubines. Far from being disastrous, they are the epitome of virtuous biblical patriarchs!

Their relationships with their children were...not great, though. I have no problem with polygamy but I wouldn't call Jacob's family the best example of healthy family life ;)

[fluttershies]

wow, that pings the self-hating, closeted gaydar.

I am waiting until marriage to have sex, but am in no way self-hating and am openly bisexual. For me, sex is such a uniquely intimate thing that I don't want to share it with anyone but my future spouse. I'm OK with others having pre-marital sex, but why is it not OK for people like me to abstain?

[emmyfair]

I am waiting until marriage to have sex, but am in no way self-hating and am openly bisexual. For me, sex is such a uniquely intimate thing that I don't want to share it with anyone but my future spouse. I'm OK with others having pre-marital sex, but why is it not OK for people like me to abstain?

I think the comment was case-specific and not ment in general. IMHO.

[spragger]

And, statistically, the safest sex. It is god's design for marriage!!! The healthiest sex ever!!!111!!!!!

In my experience there are cheaters of every kind, and drama abounds in the lesbian community. All of my straight friends are faithful, while about half of my lesbian friends are. IDK if that is typical of everybody tho, or what's statistically true.

[fundifugee]

In my experience there are cheaters of every kind, and drama abounds in the lesbian community. All of my straight friends are faithful, while about half of my lesbian friends are. IDK if that is typical of everybody tho, or what's statistically true.

My "safe" comment was in reference to the much lower rates of sexually-transmitted infections.

[fundifugee]

I think the comment was case-specific and not ment in general. IMHO.

^ yes, case-specific. And, I admit, anectdotally based, on the experience of a close friend who thought she had an extraordinarily principled boyfriend, only to find out that the sex really sucked after marriage and it was all because he was trying not to be gay.

[spragger]

My "safe" comment was in reference to the much lower rates of sexually-transmitted infections.

Sorry, I got what you meant, just got you stuck in with the quote b/c it was in with the discussion.

Although, I don't think there have been that many tests done on STD transmission and lesbians. Admittedly, I am not that well versed on the subject. I have only read a few articles about lack of studies regarding AIDS in the lesbian community. You would think there would less risk of infection. Most guys would :lol: at gloves and dental dams, but most clubs and bars these days hand them out like you're facing a death sentence if you don't use them.

[fundifugee]

I read a study in med school that cited much lower rates, but still encouraged us to promote using condoms on sex toys, discussing other methods of sanitation if sharing toys, other barrier methods, etc.

[fluttershies]

Sorry, I got what you meant, just got you stuck in with the quote b/c it was in with the discussion.

Although, I don't think there have been that many tests done on STD transmission and lesbians. Admittedly, I am not that well versed on the subject. I have only read a few articles about lack of studies regarding AIDS in the lesbian community. You would think there would less risk of infection. Most guys would :lol: at gloves and dental dams, but most clubs and bars these days hand them out like you're facing a death sentence if you don't use them.

I know there's been more focus on telling gay women in the UK to have regular smear (pap) tests since they can still get HPV.

[spragger]

I read a study in med school that cited much lower rates, but still encouraged us to promote using condoms on sex toys, discussing other methods of sanitation if sharing toys, other barrier methods, etc.

There is this club I used to go to "back in the day" (I feel so old just typing that) and they handed out kits that contained a condom, a latex glove, and a dental dam. I'm not sure how many of them actually got used, but the women handing them out seemed to feel like they were making a difference.

[Witsec7]

Spragger, those kits are ubiquitous in my uni town. FWIW my DD and her peers had the fear of STDs put into them by some fierce crunchy granola moms, they are all barrier users.

[IamCanadian]

I had a look at a few posts on her blog, and this one made me angry. The post is not terrible, but the comments are another story. (It's basically a Debi Pearl / CTBHHM love fest)

lorialexander.blogspot.ca/2012/03/not-created-to-be-abused.html

stefanie · 3 weeks ago

I honestly think any woman who believes her submitting to her husband would lead him to abuse her, is a fool. Either for marrying a psychopath in the first place, or for having such a low opinion of her husband.

Just sayin' ;)

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3 replies · active 1 week ago

Kristi · 1 week ago

Do you really think that Abusive Men all are psychopaths? What about a Godly, hard-working man whose strong Christian parents have been married almost 40 years now? He never showed any abusive signs before we got married. In fact, we started our marriage egalitarian, but he decided that he was now the head of the home and I have no say in the matter. Many decisions have been discussed between us where I feel that God has asked me to let him decide, but I am unwilling to let him make all decisions with or without my agreement the matter.

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Kristi · 1 week ago

He yells at me and calls me names. He tells me regularly how disgusting I am. He yells at me when I'm holding our baby and am asking him to please wait until the baby is in bed. He tells me how everybody else thinks that I am boring and how friends are only ever being polite to listen to me. He tells me all the time how lucky I am to have him, because nobody else would want me because I am a useless wife, usually because I haven't cleaned the house to his standards. The first year of our baby's life, he got up 0 times in the night to take care of her.

None of my friends who knew him extensively before we got married can believe that he's the same guy. He's changed so much.

Submitting to him is laying down completely and dying. Not fighting for my own worth as a person of equality in this marriage and I refuse to do so 100%. I will continue to listen to God and continue to submit as He calls me to.

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+1

Lori Alexander · 1 week ago

God calls you to obey your husband in everything. Learning to treat others the way you want them to treat you, forgiving them, blessing them, and loving them is how God changes them. When you submit and forgive, even when it seems unfair, joy will flow from you as you walk in obedience to God but as you hold onto your "rights" you will never find true joy and happiness.

And now climax of Kristi's situation, Lori offeres another piece of counsel:

Kristi · 1 week ago

Why does it always talk about physical abuse only? How many of you have been married to "Godly, Christian" men who yell and swear at you and call you names, because you didn't sweep the floor before leaving the house? Have you been yelled at and told how your daughter is going to pay the price for you making him 10 minutes late for hanging out with friends? How many people have lived in this fear and been told that it's only okay to leave IF there if physical abuse? What happens to those of us who can't speak up for ourselves, who cannot protect our children? Why is hitting someone so much worse than yelling at them for 30 minutes and telling them how worthless they are? Not a single statement here has been exaggerated from my real circumstances. And everyone I tell only asks me: "Has he hit you?" No, but I'm still dying inside.

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2 replies · active 44 minutes ago

+1

Lori Alexander · 1 week ago

I am very sorry for your situation Kristi. I have been praying about giving you my advice. The Bible doesn't give an out of marriage for a spouse yelling at you. God hates divorce because it causes so much pain. Yes, you are in pain now, but divorce won't lessen your pain, especially your children's pain. Children want a daddy, even a daddy that yells at them. I would suggest you read my post "Soft Answers Turn Away Wrath" http://blahblah.com..

I would also like you to search your heart and be honest with yourself about things you are doing wrong in the marriage. Are you trying to please him, honor him, love him, not nagging or angry with him? Is your heart filled with bitterness and anger? You can only change yourself and as I have mentored women, as they have worked on changing themselves, their husbands have changed 100% of the time.

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That broke my heart. I even did something I've never done before on a blog found through FJ. I left a comment for Kristi. All those women telling her to just suck it up for Jesus really grinds my gears.

(edited for riffles)

[spragger]

Spragger, those kits are ubiquitous in my uni town. FWIW my DD and her peers had the fear of STDs put into them by some fierce crunchy granola moms, they are all barrier users.

Yes! This club was adjacent to the campus area. The clubs in the downtown area just had dental dams in the bathrooms. Actually my daughter found out what condoms were years ago from playing Fable with her father. :doh: Not an easy concept to explain to a 6YO. (Which is why a 6YO should not be playing Fable.)

[JesusFightClub]

I feel so sorry for the woman in the abusive relationship in the comments. DV is super triggering to me (cause I sat through a murder trial about it and lost a friend to it) and I wish I could go to Kristi's house with a few of my biggest mates, the ones who train in MMA, and tell him if he ever yells at her and scares her again...well. ;)

And tell her privately to divorce him. No one is intended to live in utter misery.

[LucySnowe]

All of my straight friends are faithful

How do you know? I mean, it's possible that someone's cheating on the side and being extremely discreet about it.

[lilah]

#1 My mom never gave me the cow lecture. Quite the opposite. She said, "Would you buy shoes that you never tried on?" I was mortified.

My mom was similar, she told me sex was too important to a relationship to wait for marriage, you had to know if you connected on that level.

[Rowan]

Here's another blog post about marriage from the nutcase blogger of "Biblical Womanhood":

Hmmm. Jacob was married to Rachel and Leah AND had kids with their servants. Really, no examples at all? Ok, there was sibling rivalry but it all worked out in the end and it really didn't have much to do with the mommy situation.

And people are gay because they were abused and had horrible fathers? I'd like to introduce her to my uncle. Youngest of a family of four - 3 boys and my mom. He's the only one that is gay. Their father was an amazing man who was quicker to accept his youngest son for who he was than their mom was. My uncle's been with his partner for the entirety of my living memory (I'm nearly 33). That bitch needs to STFU.