The Duggars screw over the Friendly Chapel/BATES EPISODE3/13

[pomology]

Actually it's a symbol of states' rights, an important Constitutional concept that's been getting severely trampled for the past 80 years or so. The campaign to paint it as a symbol of racism is part of the larger campaign to federalize/socialize everything, while simply ignoring the Constitution.

No, it's a symbol of the Confederacy (which is kind odd, because it was not the national flag of the Confederate state, but the battle flag of the Confederate army, but nonetheless it has come symbolize the Confederacy and the Confederacy was a racist regime. It prided itself on that.

[tankgirl]

I believe that Tori Amos did a remake of Strange Fruit as well.

Yes, she did, so did Siouxsie and the Banshees. It's a beautiful, but heartbreaking song.

[tankgirl]

So now I'm for "The Cause" because I refuse to apologize for what my ancestors may or may not have done? Funny how my post got turned around. Oh well. I'll just lurk for Duggar info in the future and you can keep your blog neat and tidy the way you like it. And really, fuck you? Come on! Fuck off!

Well, I bet some of your best friends are black.

Sorry, you just sound like a racist ass, the more you talk.

[JenniferJuniper]

So now I'm for "The Cause" because I refuse to apologize for what my ancestors may or may not have done? Funny how my post got turned around. Oh well. I'll just lurk for Duggar info in the future and you can keep your blog neat and tidy the way you like it. And really, fuck you? Come on! Fuck off!

I don't think anyone is asking you to apologize for what "your ancestors" did. However, celebrating what they did is going to be interpreted as racist, plain and simple.

As someone previously alluded to, it's nearly akin to someone of German descent deciding to fly the 1935 - 1945 National flag of Germany (the one with the swastika on it) to show off their German Pride to the neighborhood.

[smores]

I just hate that someone like Francine represents the state that I love, the state I consider my home. I have heard so many arguments like hers from fellow Carolinians, and every single one of those people was a racist. Mostly closet racists, but still racists.

Francine, if I call you a slut but I say that it's okay for me to do so because it's just a word to me, that it has no bad meaning whatsoever to me but is something I consider an endearing term based on my history, does it mean you shouldn't be offended? No, you'd be offended anyways. That's what flying the confederate flag is like to someone who sees it as nothing more than a thinly veiled attempt at racism.

To be fair, I'm ok with seeing people fly it and wearing the stupid Dixie Outfitters shirts and the like... it tells me which people I ought to avoid.

[Queen of Serpents]

The book is more complex than the movie (Scarlett is still pretty annoying), but either one is essential to knowing what the average American believes about the Civil War. Kids study American History, but for most they remember the movies they saw about history rather than the actual history.

I like the book a little better, especially Scarlett's blunt views of the role of women and having children. Her argument about not having more children is more justified and I think she mentions that's she's willing to have an abortion/induce a miscarriage if Rhett impregnates her. I think Ashley's mutual attraction is expressed more in the book so it makes her pining and whining more reasonable (she's barely 25 at the end, right?). The book emphasizes her delightful bitchiness and manipulative traits and it's more obvious that she's a younger version of Rhett. It gives Pork more of a reason to stay with the family as well and I liked the line that Scarlett had about the racist Northerners in Atlanta (which is also, in itself, horribly racist but I like how biting Scarlett is). If anything the book and film make me want to read more about the Civil War- especially the Southern perspective.

[gustava]

I like the book a little better, especially Scarlett's blunt views of the role of women and having children. Her argument about not having more children is more justified and I think she mentions that's she's willing to have an abortion/induce a miscarriage if Rhett impregnates her. I think Ashley's mutual attraction is expressed more in the book so it makes her pining and whining more reasonable (she's barely 25 at the end, right?). The book emphasizes her delightful bitchiness and manipulative traits and it's more obvious that she's a younger version of Rhett. It gives Pork more of a reason to stay with the family as well and I liked the line that Scarlett had about the racist Northerners in Atlanta (which is also, in itself, horribly racist but I like how biting Scarlett is). If anything the book and film make me want to read more about the Civil War- especially the Southern perspective.

Diary of Mary Chesnut

Chesnut was the daughter of a plantation owner and the wife of an aide to Confederate President and arch traitor Jefferson Davis, and thus she was heavily invested, personally and intellectually, in the cause of the South. This would make her diary historically important even if it were nothing else, but alas, Wilson was almost right: Mary Chesnut is a wonderfully immediate writer. She has a perfect ear for when and how often to liven the tempo of her daily accounts with arch humor:

Edited to spell her name correctly. It is Chesnut.

[Guest Anonymous]

Wait, didn't you finally agree that you were being sexist? Didn't you act thankful that we finally showed you how sexist you were being and you decided to work towards change?

Yes, I did. Then when I attempted to explain Southern culture and plainly stated that I don't condone the behavior, I was jumped on again. And again, in my most recent post about believing that immigrants who want to work in America need to learn to speak English more clearly, I was jumped on yet again. For those I will not apologize. There is nothing racist about anything I said, and the only thing you have shown me is is that you are close minded, intolerant, and too quick to judge (the very same things you accuse me of).

[bananacat]

Aww, geniebelle said that she wasn't going to post anymore. I got my hopes up, but then it turned out to just be a lie. I should have known better than to trust someone like her though. It is pretty rude to break promises though :naughty:

[ItISjustme]

Well, I've certainly got the message. Will stick to reading and not posting. Sad to think you can't have a voice unless you're of the opinion of certain posters. Wow. Flying the confederate flag makes my friends racist? Hmmm. We are critical care nurses in a community that is 75% black and we care for the people of this community and strive to help them get better. The people of this community are all hard working people who love each other and love the Lord. They are the sweetest people you'd ever want to meet. They're family bonds are stronger than any I've ever known but they still have the capacity for loving and accepting anyone who shows them kindness and respect. I've learned more from them than I have from my own family. Still, do I owe them an apology? No, I am a person, they are people. We are all striving to survive in this crazy world and if we try to do it separately w/hate, malice and bad feelings ---we get nowhere. I didn't do anything wrong, they didn't do anything wrong. We are one and the same.

You make it sound as if you're studying a colony of animals. Why would their family bonds and 'capacity for loving' be any different from any other community of whatever hue?

Methinks your racist slip is showing.

[Guest Anonymous]

Sad to think you can't have a voice unless you're of the opinion of certain posters.

Yes it is. But having said that, I do believe the Confederate Flag is a racist symbol. I know you don't agree. But, hey, that's your opinion, and you're entitled to it. Being from AL, I kind of know where you're coming from.

[holierthanyou]

Aww, geniebelle said that she wasn't going to post anymore. I got my hopes up, but then it turned out to just be a lie. I should have known better than to trust someone like her though. It is pretty rude to break promises though :naughty:

QFT.

Her comment about not being a member of FJ surprised me though... If this is how often she posts on a site she doesn't consider herself a member of, can you imagine the posts she'd be racking up on a site that she did consider worthy of her greatness?!?

[formergothardite]

Yes, I did. Then when I attempted to explain Southern culture and plainly stated that I don't condone the behavior, I was jumped on again. And again, in my most recent post about believing that immigrants who want to work in America need to learn to speak English more clearly, I was jumped on yet again. For those I will not apologize. There is nothing racist about anything I said, and the only thing you have shown me is is that you are close minded, intolerant, and too quick to judge (the very same things you accuse me of).

You said these exact same things about your sexist posts too. Couldn't it be that we are correct about your racist posts also and you are still in the denial stage just like you were for a long time with sexism?

You said you would never apologize for your sexism, that you would never change your mind, that there wasn't anything really sexist about what you were writing, and that we were just being closed minded, intolerant and judgmental. And then you said that you were glad people kept jumping on you about it because it helped you change your mind. If you were wrong then, what makes you so sure that you are correct in this instance? Especially since people who never agree on anything have come together to agree that in the other thread you are behaving in a racist way.

Think about the teen I know(and another poster I think had a daughter) who is hearing impaired, has spent her life in speech therapy, but still talks with a heavy accent that is hard for some people to understand. Should she never be allowed to work? The northern lady who works near me, when she first moved here she was a single mother and worked two jobs trying to support her family. Should she had not been able to get those jobs since she speeks with an accent many people here can't understand?

What you want to do is erase some of the diversity of this country and have everyone speak in a manner you approve of. You don't want the Indian person (who English really is his first language) to sound like he is from India. You don't want the Scottish person to sound like she is from Scotland. You want them to all lose their accent and adopt some American accent that you approve of. You are saying that their accent is bad (if it wasn't bad why do they need to change it?) and become more like you. That is racist.

[formergothardite]

Yes it is. But having said that, I do believe the Confederate Flag is a racist symbol. I know you don't agree. But, hey, that's your opinion, and you're entitled to it. Being from AL, I kind of know where you're coming from.

Where is she coming from that isn't racist? I know people from AL and they don't act like this or understand it. I live in NC and I don't understand it either. There is nothing good that the South did under the time that that flag was used to fight. They were fighting for the rights to enslave people. The flag stands for that and it always has.

Saying "I don't agree with you, but I understand you." in this case is no better than telling a pro-slavery person "I don't agree with you, but I understand why you want to do that." People would think that was racist too.

[Deleted03]

You said these exact same things about your sexist posts too. Couldn't it be that we are correct about your racist posts also and you are still in the denial stage just like you were for a long time with sexism?

You said you would never apologize for your sexism, that you would never change your mind, that there wasn't anything really sexist about what you were writing, and that we were just being closed minded, intolerant and judgmental. And then you said that you were glad people kept jumping on you about it because it helped you change your mind. If you were wrong then, what makes you so sure that you are correct in this instance? Especially since people who never agree on anything have come together to agree that in the other thread you are behaving in a racist way.

Think about the teen I know(and another poster I think had a daughter) who is hearing impaired, has spent her life in speech therapy, but still talks with a heavy accent that is hard for some people to understand. Should she never be allowed to work? The northern lady who works near me, when she first moved here she was a single mother and worked two jobs trying to support her family. Should she had not been able to get those jobs since she speeks with an accent many people here can't understand?

What you want to do is erase some of the diversity of this country and have everyone speak in a manner you approve of. You don't want the Indian person (who English really is his first language) to sound like he is from India. You don't want the Scottish person to sound like she is from Scotland. You want them to all lose their accent and adopt some American accent that you approve of. You are saying that their accent is bad (if it wasn't bad why do they need to change it?) and become more like you. That is racist.

Immigrants would love to have free english classes, and have a schedule that allows them to take time for free classes... it's easy to say immigrant should not more english when they come in, but once again conservative like wishful thinking more than realist policies.

[Witsec7]

QFT.

Her comment about not being a member of FJ surprised me though... If this is how often she posts on a site she doesn't consider herself a member of, can you imagine the posts she'd be racking up on a site that she did consider worthy of her greatness?!?

she's as irritating as the tiger mom that would not use capitols or punctuation

[dairyfreelife]

I'm going to need some popcorn to read over this thread.

[gustava]

I'm going to need some popcorn to read over this thread.

With butter????

[dairyfreelife]

With butter????

Soy margarine. I can't have butter. Severely lactose intolerant.

[gustava]

Soy margarine. I can't have butter. Severely lactose intolerant.

Bummer. But I'll join you. May I bring my new nail polish?

[dairyfreelife]

Bummer. But I'll join you. May I bring my new nail polish?

Of course. I think my nail polish is all quite old, but may still be useable.

[Guest Anonymous]

Couldn't it be that we are correct about your racist posts

No

What you want to do is erase some of the diversity of this country and have everyone speak in a manner you approve of.

No, only in a way that I don't have to repeat myself a million times, but this has been explained over and over again, and you still don't get it. Speaking clearly does not mean giving up one's accent. But there again, you still don't get that.

[Guest Anonymous]

Where is she coming from that isn't racist? I know people from AL and they don't act like this or understand it. I live in NC and I don't understand it either. There is nothing good that the South did under the time that that flag was used to fight. They were fighting for the rights to enslave people. The flag stands for that and it always has.

Saying "I don't agree with you, but I understand you." in this case is no better than telling a pro-slavery person "I don't agree with you, but I understand why you want to do that." People would think that was racist too.

What I said was I disagreed with her. I do understand where's she's coming from because I encounter people with that same opinion. Saying you understand something doesn't mean you agree with them. Let me make it even more clear. I know you think I'm a sexist, racist bitch. I understand that...meaning I know what you meant. It doesn't mean I agree with you....not by a long shot.

EDITED TO ADD: It also means I can disagree with her without being an angry bitch. But, since this is a snark board, I'm sure that's a foreign concept to many.

[jaynie]

No

No, only in a way that I don't have to repeat myself a million times, but this has been explained over and over again, and you still don't get it. Speaking clearly does not mean giving up one's accent. But there again, you still don't get that.

But speaking in a way that is crystal clear to people from a different place *does* mean giving up your accent. That is the whole point. An accent comprises of the way you pronounce words, the rhythm, and the inflection. If someone from a different country is said to have a mild accent, what it means is that their accent has drifted closer to the norm for their new home. Not everyone will experience this drift, and some parts of your accent will never change, particularily if the new language involves vowel or consonent sounds your native language doesn't have.

In this clip from the show QI, a joke made in a newcastle accent simply does not make any sense to Stephen Fry. So two men from the same country speaking the same first language with different accents cannot necessarily understand each other without clarification. You'll notice that when he says "well, they must go to school" everyone laughs -- because the notion that a whole group of people should have to change the way they speak just so Mr. Fry can understand them is patently absurd.

[formergothardite]

No

No, only in a way that I don't have to repeat myself a million times, but this has been explained over and over again, and you still don't get it. Speaking clearly does not mean giving up one's accent. But there again, you still don't get that.

You said "No" about your sexism too. What makes you so sure this time?

What about the hearing impaired teen I know that will never be able to speak clearly. Should she not be able to get a job? What about the people who are here who can speak English with a heavy accent but because they are struggling to get by they don't have the time or money to go to special classes to learn to lose their acccent. Should they just starve because if they worked you might encounter them and not be able to understand them?