Seven Sisters on pinterest - racist or just weird?

[fluttershies]

I posted the definitions and asked what part of what the Seven Sisters did matched any of the definitions. No one gave an example. You are welcome to find the post with the definitions and let me know how "I heart Chinese children" matches one of the definitions.

You posted the following definition of racism:

racist: a person who believes in racism, the doctrine that a certain human race is superior to any or all others.

racism: the belief that races have distinctive cultural characteristics determined by hereditary factors and that this endows some races with an intrinsic superiority over others

2. abusive or aggressive behaviour towards members of another race on the basis of such a belief

Hereditary factors are physical, therefore racism is constructed around physical differences between races.

[Boogalou]

I found this:

Modern discrimination is commonly thought to manifest itself as 'cultural racism' (the belief that your culture is superior to another's therefore justifies their exclusion, subjugation or elimination).

So that might be where Theologygeek is getting the idea that racism is based on culture, not physical characteristics, I don't know.

Since we are talking about whether racism necessitates racial superiority, I'll ask this: is the stereotype that African Americans like watermelons a racist belief? Take a look at this page: http://abagond.wordpress.com/2011/03/10 ... tereotype/ they collect some images of the stereotype. It's kind of interesting. Anyway, I don't really buy that you need to believe your race is superior in order to be racist.

[ladypuglover]

I don't mean to go off topic about the racism but I have a question about the 7 sisters and didn't want to make a new thread.

Are the seven sisters the same group of girls who found/stole roses they just happened to find on the side of the road? I don't mean to bring up the war of roadside memorials again but this might be a clue as to why these girls are so clueless. Also from reading some diaries from the oregon trail has led me to veiw these fundy girls a whole new way. If you all want I can post about it later when I get back from exchanging football gear for my preteen kiddlet.

[terranova]

I don't mean to go off topic about the racism but I have a question about the 7 sisters and didn't want to make a new thread.

Are the seven sisters the same group of girls who found/stole roses they just happened to find on the side of the road? I don't mean to bring up the war of roadside memorials again but this might be a clue as to why these girls are so clueless. Also from reading some diaries from the oregon trail has led me to veiw these fundy girls a whole new way. If you all want I can post about it later when I get back from exchanging football gear for my preteen kiddlet.

I'm pretty sure that was someone else, although I can't remember who. The 7sisters were the ones to whom God provided a ham despite it being crossed off the shopping list :roll:

ETA: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=5611&hilit=flowers+roadside it was the Grady girls.

[Anise]

Uh, there are differences between Caucasian and African noses:

I think part of the problem of talking about racism is that definitions and such exist in a hegemonic structure. For example, that diagram is racist because it is conflating African-American/"ethnic" (wtf do they mean by "ethnic"?) with Bantu people groups. Some other African people groups, particularly those from more northern Africa don't generally have the same nose shape.

[Spider Burps]

I think part of the problem of talking about racism is that definitions and such exist in a hegemonic structure. For example, that diagram is racist because it is conflating African-American/"ethnic" (wtf do they mean by "ethnic"?) with Bantu people groups. Some other African people groups, particularly those from more northern Africa don't generally have the same nose shape.

Plus, check out the almost comical lips on the "ethnic" woman. That makes the graphic that much worse.

[formergothardite]

Totally unrelated to the rest of this thread, but I wonder if they would answer why their mom does the weird stick out her boobs, stick out her leg pose in most pictures.

[terranova]

Totally unrelated to the rest of this thread, but I wonder if they would answer why their mom does the weird stick out her boobs, stick out her leg pose in most pictures.

Isn't it something to do with the fitness regime they're on? They have a name for the pose but I can't recall it.

[darareaksmey]

So it is really hard for the average person to identify what country an Asian person might come from. I doubt the Seven Sisters can do so.

So it's OK for them just to call all Asians Chinese? Just because it's hard doesn't mean it's OK not to try to get it right, or at least to acknowledge that there are different ethnic groups.

Your experience with Asians differs from mine. When I was in SE Asia, people were pretty clear on who was Lao, who was Vietnamese, who was Khmer, etc. based on their facial characteristics and hair types. God forbid you should call a Khmer person Vietnamese. It does make a difference to people. They may be very proud of their racial background, and to be called a different one by people who can't be bothered to at least give it a thought just shows the latter's insensitivity. All Asians are so, so not Chinese.

[jaelh]

So it's OK for them just to call all Asians Chinese? Just because it's hard doesn't mean it's OK not to try to get it right, or at least to acknowledge that there are different ethnic groups.

Your experience with Asians differs from mine. When I was in SE Asia, people were pretty clear on who was Lao, who was Vietnamese, who was Khmer, etc. based on their facial characteristics and hair types. God forbid you should call a Khmer person Vietnamese. It does make a difference to people. They may be very proud of their racial background, and to be called a different one by people who can't be bothered to at least give it a thought just shows the latter's insensitivity. All Asians are so, so not Chinese.

D, you're making an absurd characterization (and I say this as having lived in the region you're talking about for.. a number of years).

The difference in appearance between Viet's and Khmers is manifest: the point being is Khmer's don't belong to the same "light skinned" group of Asians that most Kinh Vietnamese and Han Chinese belong to. North Asian's are manifestly more similar than the much more diverse SEA. It's also ridiculous to suggest that because Vietnamese and Khmer persons, living in those countries, can recognize each other (be that because of how they look, or because of differences in dress and speech) that people without such a nuanced exposure might do the same. Unless you've spent some time in a region, I doubt most people could. The members of the various groups in question (that have a long term enmity) can means *absolutely nothing* in this context.

BTW: if you're going to be waving the OMG RASICT flag, get your facts right in your example. Vietnamese is an nationality; the ethic group you're referring to is Kinh. There are a number of ethnically Khmer Vietnamese and vice versa. Surely it's RACIST not to bother making the distinctions between nationality and ethnicity that matter so much to people in the nations themselves!!!!!!11!!

[clibbyjo]

Isn't it something to do with the fitness regime they're on? They have a name for the pose but I can't recall it.

T-Tapp. Yes, the woman from T-Tapp does that stance and so do the people on her website.(yes, I looked it up and every tried some of the moves lol) The mom is now a certified instructor,so I assume she is taught that in class.

[Witsec7]

Yea the mom is whoring out for TTap now, its not just a physical workout its spiritual too! :lol: Someone should tell her that yoga can be too. Eh,these are some of the most useless fundies around.

riffle

[darareaksmey]

D, you're making an absurd characterization (and I say this as having lived in the region you're talking about for.. a number of years).

The difference in appearance between Viet's and Khmers is manifest: the point being is Khmer's don't belong to the same "light skinned" group of Asians that most Kinh Vietnamese and Han Chinese belong to. North Asian's are manifestly more similar than the much more diverse SEA. It's also ridiculous to suggest that because Vietnamese and Khmer persons, living in those countries, can recognize each other (be that because of how they look, or because of differences in dress and speech) that people without such a nuanced exposure might do the same. Unless you've spent some time in a region, I doubt most people could. The members of the various groups in question (that have a long term enmity) can means *absolutely nothing* in this context.

BTW: if you're going to be waving the OMG RASICT flag, get your facts right in your example. Vietnamese is an nationality; the ethic group you're referring to is Kinh. There are a number of ethnically Khmer Vietnamese and vice versa. Surely it's RACIST not to bother making the distinctions between nationality and ethnicity that matter so much to people in the nations themselves!!!!!!11!!

Me culpa on the Vietnamese ethnic group. I was not there as long as you and I could not think of the name, but I was there long enough to see that it does matter to people in those groups. The sisters could not be expected to make nuanced distinctions, true. But they can be expected to recognize that people in those groups care about distinctions.

ETA: And no, maybe it isn't racist. My failure to correctly identify a group whose name I should know doesn't make me look or feel superior. It makes me look/feel like an idiot.

[jesssnerch]

Totally unrelated to the rest of this thread, but I wonder if they would answer why their mom does the weird stick out her boobs, stick out her leg pose in most pictures.

Channeling Angelina?

[ladypuglover]

I'm pretty sure that was someone else, although I can't remember who. The 7sisters were the ones to whom God provided a ham despite it being crossed off the shopping list :roll:

ETA: viewtopic.php?f=8&t=5611&hilit=flowers+roadside it was the Grady girls.

Ah, many thanks. For some reason I just had it stuck in my head that these group of fundy girls were from the same family. I guess the socially unaware just runs deep in fundy families.

edit because I just remembered the proper wording. getting older sucks.

[terranova]

[

Ah, many thanks. For some reason I just had it stuck in my head that these group of fundy girls were from the same family. I guess the socially unaware just runs deep in fundy families.

edit because I just remembered the proper wording. getting older sucks.

After a while all the ignorance does just tend to blend into one. :(

[ladypuglover]

After a while all the ignorance does just tend to blend into one. :(

And that too. :lol:

[bananacat]

I don't think anyone is expecting the seven sisters to be able to tell all nationalities apart by appearance. The problem is that they use the name of a specific nationality to describe a lot of people who aren't that nationality. I can't easily determine the nationality of most Asian people, but I don't lump them all under "Chinese". Heck, I'm white and I can't even tell a white person's nationality or ancestry by looking at them unless they have a very stereotypical look. I'm a mix of German and Italian, and I don't expect people to know that. However, I would be bothered if someone just lumped me in with other Caucasians and called us French or Polish or Norwegian. The seven sisters managed to at least use a better label for the African group, instead of just using one country to describe them all, although I suspect that none of them could even name a country in Africa if they tried so they don't get much of a pass. But labeling all Asian people as Chinese is the aspect that a lot of people here don't like. I actually didn't think this was a difficult concept to understand, so it makes me wonder if certain people are being disingenuous.

[theologygeek]

In any case, you still haven't said why racism is only based on culture.

Perhaps because that's how it's defined. How old are you? Just wondering.

[theologygeek]

You posted the following definition of racism:

racist: a person who believes in racism, the doctrine that a certain human race is superior to any or all others.

racism: the belief that races have distinctive cultural characteristics determined by hereditary factors and that this endows some races with an intrinsic superiority over others

2. abusive or aggressive behaviour towards members of another race on the basis of such a belief

Hereditary factors are physical, therefore racism is constructed around physical differences between races.

Goodness. Read the sentence you are referencing and take notice to the word "and."

[theologygeek]

But labeling all Asian people as Chinese is the aspect that a lot of people here don't like. I actually didn't think this was a difficult concept to understand, so it makes me wonder if certain people are being disingenuous.

The only thing I'm arguing is that it's not racist. It may be ignorant, offensive, naive, odd...but it isn't racist. The OP asked if it was racist.

[theologygeek]

Plus, check out the almost comical lips on the "ethnic" woman. That makes the graphic that much worse.

I agree with both of you and couldn't even address that picture. It was offensive and just plain ridiculous.

[theologygeek]

I found this:

So that might be where Theologygeek is getting the idea that racism is based on culture, not physical characteristics, I don't know.

Since we are talking about whether racism necessitates racial superiority, I'll ask this: is the stereotype that African Americans like watermelons a racist belief? Take a look at this page: http://abagond.wordpress.com/2011/03/10 ... tereotype/ they collect some images of the stereotype. It's kind of interesting. Anyway, I don't really buy that you need to believe your race is superior in order to be racist.

Yes, that's racist. It falls under "cultural." I was actually going to use that as an example before.

[Boogalou]

Ah, many thanks. For some reason I just had it stuck in my head that these group of fundy girls were from the same family. I guess the socially unaware just runs deep in fundy families.

edit because I just remembered the proper wording. getting older sucks.

I thought they were the same ones too. I need to pay more attention to the more obscure fundies I guess.

[Boogalou]

Yes, that's racist. It falls under "cultural." I was actually going to use that as an example before.

But it doesn't imply any sort of racial superiority, at least as far as I can tell. Is that what you are saying, that racism needs to have superiority involved? Sorry I am tired and having trouble following the conversation.