Santorum Challanges Policy On Prenatal Testing

[debrand]

The government should never require health care providers to fully cover the cost of prenatal testing such as amniocentesis, which can determine the possibility of Down syndrome or other problems in the fetus, Republican presidential hopeful Rick Santorum said Sunday.

In particular, amniocentesis "more often than not" results in abortion, said Santorum, a strident anti-abortion politician, on the CBS program "Face the Nation."

"People have the right to do it but to have the government force people to provide it free, to me, is a bit loaded," Santorum said in arguing against what he called a mandate in the health care reform bill passed by President Barack Obama and Democrats in 2010.

Santorum was responding to questions about comments he made the day before at a Christian Alliance luncheon in Columbus, Ohio, in which he said the mandate in the health care law was intended to increase abortions and reduce overall health care costs

http://edition.cnn.com/2012/02/19/polit ... index.html

[figuring it out]

If Rick is elected, I think I'll give up my citizenship. He can't really be elected can he? Really?

[countressrascal]

Ok Ricky-if you don't want a prenatal test then don't do it, if after one you don't want an abortion don't have one. It is called CHOICE. You are really too stuipd to live. I know your platform is GOD, GUNS and GAYS, we get it so shut your stuipd mouth.

[Kishiria]

Actually, Santorum is no fan of the 2nd Amendment. My husband and I are avid shooters, and will never support him because of his beliefs and laws he's supported against firearm ownership.

[Austin]

I would think prenatal testing would, just on a cost benefit analysis basis, save insurers money. Many parents do opt not to bring a child with severe disabilities into the world and thus save the insurer the cost of covering care for such a child. This is not intended to address the morality of it one way or another, just the finances of it. Because generally that's what insurance companies are interested in.

Same with contraception. I saw someone on FJ the other day complaining that with the president's compromise, someone will still have to be pay (it will be you and me - oh noessss). Providing contraception is a heck of a lot cheaper for insurance companies (and thus you and me) than providing maternal care and then care for a child for years.

[desertvixen]

Santorum can be summed up as being totes cool with massive government intrusion into your lives as long as it's in pursuit of something he supports.

[AudreyE]

Amniocentesis is a procedure that has its own inherent risks, and doctors only suggest it when it's really advisable, but... you know, whatever. What do doctors know?

Obama's healthcare would be way more palatable, if it didn't guarantee people healthcare.

[Katiebug]

Eff you, Frothy.

I had an amniocentesis because at the age of 28 my genetic screening had given worse than 1 in 50 odds that our baby had Down Syndrome (for reference those are the age-based odds of a woman in her mid-40s). We wanted to know for sure so that if the baby did have it, we would have additional monitoring during my pregnancy, we'd be able to find a pediatrician who had worked with kids with Down Syndrome before, we could make proper child care arrangements, etc. We wanted to know not so that we could terminate but so that if the baby had the condition we could come to terms with the diagnosis and make plans to welcome our baby. Our insurance covered the amniocentesis and the rapid FISH test and we found out three days later that our baby had the normal number of chromosomes. Honestly, if a positive screening like the one we had with our first baby happens in a future pregnancy I don't think we'd rush to the amnio. For Down Syndrome there's now a maternal blood test that's something like 99.8% accurate without being invasive like CVS or amniocentesis (it's called MaterniT21).

There's also a difference between prenatal screening and prenatal diagnosis. With the exception of the MaterniT21 blood test for Down Syndrome the only highly-accurate prenatal tests for chromosomal issues are CVS or amniocentesis. Because those are invasive and carry a risk of miscarriage, there are screening tests to determine if the risk of a chromosomal problem is greater than the risk posed by an amnio. Many, many women have the screening tests done. I had the integrated screening - well, at least the first part (nuchal translucency and blood tests). When I had my high risk result from the first trimester screening I learned that roughly 5-7% of women having the screening will have a high risk "positive" result, yet more than 95% of those will be false positives like mine turned out to be. There are also rare cases where a woman's screening is normal yet her baby is born with Down Syndrome (Trisomy 13 and 18 cause issues that are apparent on ultrasound later on but Down Syndrome can be undetected until birth). It's all based on statistics.

When a pregnant woman screens positive she's offered a number of options, none of which are "terminate!" My OB explained my options: trying to get a CVS test done (I didn't want to risk it), to wait and have an amnio (safer than CVS), to continue with the second part of the screening and wait for the Level II ultrasound at 20 weeks, or to do absolutely nothing. Like I said, the screening tests are not diagnostic and the overwhelming majority of positive results are false positives. They simply give pregnant women information so that they can decide what to do with that information when it comes to more invasive/risky diagnostic testing. Those screening tests offer reassurance to most pregnant women and no one is going to be aborting a wanted pregnancy because her first trimester screening came back "positive". Additional diagnostic tests have to be done for termination to even be mentioned and even then it's the mother's decision. While some women do choose to terminate others will choose to carry to term - as is their right.

So is Frothy just against amnio and CVS being covered by insurance, or is he against ALL prenatal screening being covered? It doesn't matter because either is batshit insane but I think the latter is one of the craziest things I've ever heard a politician say.

[bananacat]

Once again, here's a conservative who cares more about stopping abortion than helping actual living people. He'd rather see women forgo prenatal testing and have a resulting birth be less healthy than it could be than to let a woman have an abortion. Prenatal testing does more than detect Downs Syndrome, and even when it does, it's not always with the intention to have an abortion. Parents who know what to expect will be able to provide better support for their child with special needs.

[Austin]

The fact is that termination is an option and should be. And it doesn't matter why women have prenatal testing. Some tests are done as a matter of course and some are based upon results from the matter of course tests.

[lovefromgirl]

You know what, government? Raise my taxes so more women can have contraception and prenatal screening. Make ME pay through the nose for my sisters' healthcare. I will gladly empty my bank account for such a good cause.

[bea]

As someone who DID have an abortion after a fatal prenatal diagnosis, I find this so absolutely offensive that I'm slightly nauseous.

This idea that it's acceptable to restrict the information given to prenant women because they might make a decision some random politician might not agree with? How is that even acceptable in this day and age? When was it EVER acceptable?

"You could have this information, but we're not going to give it to you, because the government/men/some random dude doesn't think you'll make the choices that he would - despite the fact that none of this has an effect on him."

And honestly, lots of women who get prenatal testing these days are doing so in order to gain information they might need - discovering that your fetus has spina bifida, for example, changes where you deliver and HOW you deliver, otherwise the baby's life is at risk. A vaginal delivery might very well kill a baby with spina bifida, and if the hospital doesn't have a very good NICU on hand, that might kill the baby too. Same thing with knowing ahead of time if the baby has a heart condition, a chromosome disorder, or anything else.

This assumption that all women are going to go straight off to get an abortion after a poor or fatal prenatal diagnosis is infuriating. Some of us do get abortions. Just as many of us don't. The distrust of women and our decision-making about our own bodies and our own childbearing choices is staggering.

And all from people who claim that they want to make government smaller.

[browngrl]

Frothy disgusts me. He simply can not see past his nose.

Diagnostic tests are useful REGARDLESS of whether termination is an option or not. For those who do not consider termination to be an option - a prenatal diagnosis can help tremendously in planning. For example: a serious defect is detected - the patient may choose to deliver in a tertiary care centre with a NICU or a serious genetic disorder is detected - the parents now have the opportunity to gather information, speak to other parents of children with the same disorder, organize their house (if special equipment/nursing care etc might be needed) or it may just give the parents a chance to accept/mentally process the diagnosis. All of these are hugely useful. Not every parent chooses abortion when faced with serious fetal abnormality but every parent could do with more information so that they may make the choice that is best for them.

[ems]

Santorum can be summed up as being totes cool with massive government intrusion into your lives as long as it's in pursuit of something he supports.

This.

And I'm bothered by his assumption that the only reason a woman would want pre-natal testing is that she plans on aborting a disabled child. Wanting time to prepare emotionally, financially, etc. for a special-needs child is a total no-no in his book I guess.

[mirele]

Actually, Santorum is no fan of the 2nd Amendment. My husband and I are avid shooters, and will never support him because of his beliefs and laws he's supported against firearm ownership.

Wow, seriously? I thought that being anti-gun ownership was the kiss of death in the GOP.

ETA: Dear Ricky: I don't want the government to get up in your twig'n'berries, why do you want to get the government up in my hoohaw?

[1004srs]

I chose not to have an amnio. It was my choice. I really felt my OB, Perinatologist, now ex husband's family, and my friends tried forcing me to do it. The geneticist was more on my side.

It is my body and my choice.

Women and their partners should be able to make educated choices themselves without interference from anyone.

[NurseNell]

If Rick is elected, I think I'll give up my citizenship. He can't really be elected can he? Really?

No.

[ADoyle90815]

Frothy disgusts me. He simply can not see past his nose.

Diagnostic tests are useful REGARDLESS of whether termination is an option or not. For those who do not consider termination to be an option - a prenatal diagnosis can help tremendously in planning. For example: a serious defect is detected - the patient may choose to deliver in a tertiary care centre with a NICU or a serious genetic disorder is detected - the parents now have the opportunity to gather information, speak to other parents of children with the same disorder, organize their house (if special equipment/nursing care etc might be needed) or it may just give the parents a chance to accept/mentally process the diagnosis. All of these are hugely useful. Not every parent chooses abortion when faced with serious fetal abnormality but every parent could do with more information so that they may make the choice that is best for them.

This. Often, parents use the prenatal testing results to prepare for their child, which might mean choosing a hospital with a better NICU than their local hospital. Even if a couple decides that abortion is still the best option, the woman should be able to say what happens with her body.

[NurseNell]

And I'm bothered by his assumption that the only reason a woman would want pre-natal testing is that she plans on aborting a disabled child. Wanting time to prepare emotionally, financially, etc. for a special-needs child is a total no-no in his book I guess.

I know. Friends of mine had it done and it not only prepared them emotionally for their special needs baby it allowed them to get resources lined up. It also gave them the information they needed to deliver at a hospital with a NICU and special team of doctors. Their baby has a rare, very serious heart defect. She will need several heart surgeries done. They are thankful they had this knowledge ahead of time.

[ladypuglover]

Once again, here's a conservative who cares more about stopping abortion than helping actual living people. He'd rather see women forgo prenatal testing and have a resulting birth be less healthy than it could be than to let a woman have an abortion. Prenatal testing does more than detect Downs Syndrome, and even when it does, it's not always with the intention to have an abortion. Parents who know what to expect will be able to provide better support for their child with special needs.

^ this.

[LeatherCouch]

I had an amnio done at 36 weeks due to growth retardation and pre-eclampsia. It was used to help determine if baby would fare better out than in. We were walking a fine line in keeping us both alive, and the amnio helped make the best decision. I had fantastic medical care, a lot of testing and the result was a healthy mom and a tiny, but healthy baby, thanks in large part to prenatal testing.

[desertvixen]

And all from people who claim that they want to make government smaller.

Small enough to fit in our uterus. And mine.

[Three and Done]

Slightly OT - Fiance is Catholic AND right wing Republican (I'm a Democrat, and sort-of-maybe believe in something - interesting for us LOL) and even he states he "Is not voting" in the next Presidential election because the Republican candidates are so pitiful/unelectable. He thinks Santorum is a nut (just not as much as I do!)

[HijabiLady]

It's amazing, the Republican party has become a caricature of itself. The Republicans are supposed to be about small government, conservative fiscal spending and allowing the states to moderate their own local legislature. But instead they are trying to turn the nation into a place where big brother is in your bed, your uterus andyour religious houses. In the meantime they are taxing the shit out of the lower/middle classes and pouring money into the top 5% of the nation's wallets. Oh and bombing the hell out of anywhere there are brown people and oil.

[Three and Done]

Again, OT - I've never mentioned that Fiance is Puerto Rican (directly from the island, not born here), and "brown" himself. It often amazes me that he falls for the Republican garbage... but.. he is also well educated (a mechanical engineer, with a well-paying, long-term job) and it seems that has affected his reaction to some of their nonsense.