1st Term Obama Approval

[PokaDot]

There are more Unalienable Rights than life.

You do know the Declaration of Independence isn't a document that governs laws, right?

I'm also fairly certain the US Government has never taken away a right. I could be wrong, but I'm just too damn lazy to look that up myself. So I'm going assume I'm right, and I'll wait for your bitter (and probably Fox News related) argument to prove me wrong.

[emmiedahl]

They have taken away the God-given right to own slaves and abuse your wife. Both are Biblical! How dare they!

[Rowan]

They have taken away the God-given right to own slaves and abuse your wife. Both are Biblical! How dare they!

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

And while it's not legal stuff, my pursuit of happiness is tied up in the health thing. If I don't have my anti-depressants, "slightly unhappy/depressed" is about as good as I get usually. Severe depression = not wanting to live. So they all tie up into each other.

Interesting that "Liberty" - one of the major things that Fundie females DON'T have hasn't been brought up.......

[0KidsAndHappy]

I'm also fairly certain the US Government has never taken away a right.

Lincoln and Bush both suspended Habeas Corpus. Sadly, no one really seemed to care (or even know) that one got taken away.

The people of this country should stand up for our rights, including standing up against those running for President that want to repeal healthcare and deny us the right of life, as I have a pre-existing condition and can be denied if it were repealed.

[PokaDot]

Lincoln and Bush both suspended Habeas Corpus. Sadly, no one really seemed to care (or even know) that one got taken away.

The people of this country should stand up for our rights, including standing up against those running for President that want to repeal healthcare and deny us the right of life, as I have a pre-existing condition and can be denied if it were repealed.

Snarky answer: Those two are Republicans, and were acting on behalf of God, so it doesn't count.

Real answer: I stand corrected. However, doesn't current suspension only apply to terrorists who are non-citizens?

Healthcare in this country is not a right. Most anti-healthcare people would argue that you losing your life to a medical condition is your own fault. I'm in the same boat with you on pre-existing (genetic). I can't even get health insurance on my own.

[StarrieEyedKat]

My mind is still reeling from the iPhone thing. Does anyone really think that makes sense? Having access to healthcare - no matter who you are - will help keep you alive. Having access to an iPhone, I guess for some people, would make them happy for a little while, but to try and correlate it to "the pursuit of happiness"? That's really reaching, dude. Hell, access to healthcare = the ability to pursue happiness better than an iPhone does.

[Mama Mia]

Obama has turned out to be too tied to the corporations and bends over too much for my taste. BUT - I would certainly take him over any of the whack jobs who are running against him. I find all of them (with the possible exception of Romney) entirely too insane and extreme in virtually all their views. Romney is just such a huge corporate tool that he does actually make Obama look like liberal - which for all the cries of "commie socialist" is actually hard to do.

I think the best things he has done is to try to provide something of a safety net to prevent the complete and utter collapse of the economy that was in the works. It was a pretty unweilding and insanely cumbersome and convoluted safety net .. but I do think it prevented actual people from actually starving in mass quantities.

[Witsec7]

Obama has turned out to be too tied to the corporations and bends over too much for my taste. BUT - I would certainly take him over any of the whack jobs who are running against him. ...

All politicians in the US are bought by corporate dollars. Unfortunately voters get to choose the politician that best can manage the trickle down flow of income to the average Joe. Like you and many others I think my own lot in life would be worse off under a republican. But factually politics, regardless of the party is badly contaminated by business interests.

[JesusFightClub]

Aargh! It drives me MENTAL to see people blaming other named people for the recession. Yes, they can contribute. But capitalism caused the recession, and it will keep on doing the same.

Capitalism works on cycles of boom and bust. When it's a boom, you praise your leaders for their wise leadership. When a bust, you complain about your leaders. Do they influence stuff? Yes. Do any of them control all global capital? No.

Nothing is unprecedented. Nothing here is new. This is Capitalism 101.

[Sola]

Let me make a better comparison. Heath care is to life as I-phone is to the pursuit of happiness. Heath care can save my life and and Iphone can bring me happiness, but neither is actually an Unalienable Right. Heck, if something didn't even exist when the Declaration of Independence was written, how can it be an Unalienable Right?

You can be happy without an iphone. Without healthcare your right to life is severely compromised. Your analagy is flawed.

[debrand]

I don't want the government giving me rights. If they give them, they can take them away. The only rights the government should be involved with is defending our Unalienable Rights. The right to Health care is not an Unalienable Right.

I hope that Jericho returns because I'd like to discuss this comment a bit more in detail. Religious people on the right often make the statement that god gave them their rights not government. Somehow they seem to believe that claiming their rights came from god will protect those rights from being taken away. The problem with this line of thinking is that throughout history, political systems that combined governement and religion were not exactly the most free.

What is missing is the knowledge that we, all of us, are the government. Jericho is the government, I am the government. Every single person in America is part of the government. We decided to give ourselves these rights. To me, the fact that I am responsible for perserving my own rights and the rights of other is far more powerful than saying some unprovable diety figure gave me those rights.

By the way, where in the bible is the right to free speech? If rights such as freedom of press and speech are in the bible, I'd like to see those verses.

[debrand]

You can be happy without an iphone. Without healthcare your right to life is severely compromised. Your analagy is flawed.

The fact that anyone would compare the possibility of dying to an iphone boggles my mind.

Doesn't America actually spend more on health care than other nations? If we spent money on preventative care, we'd actually save money and lives.

[Guest Anonymous]

Do you not get the irony in what you are saying, Jericho?

It is only the followers of Jesus that are mandated to give to the poor. And also only the followers of Jesus that object to giving to the poor via taxes.... ;)

[formergothardite]

Ahhh Jericho. The guy who thought sending single mothers and their small children back to the early 1900's was a grand idea. Who then got mad when it was pointed out that that era SUCKED for poor people and accused me of asking trick questions.

Jericho believes that if the government stopped caring for the poor that the church and private charities would just step in and take care of it all. The big problem with that, history proves him wrong. History shows that when the government doesn't care for the poor, their living conditions drop dramatically. Jericho, doesn't give a fuck as long as he gets to keep his money and make sure it only goes to people he approves of caring for.

Jericho I would like to remind you of Jesus' words:

"Give to every man that asketh of thee; and of him that taketh away thy goods ask them not again."

The government is made up of people, people who, according to you, are wanting to take your money and give it to the poor. Guess what, Jesus said you should stop complaining and you shouldn't even ask for it back.

Also, have you studied the Bible wih an unbiased mind to see if you can find the verses that say a fetus is valued by God? Or that abortion is wrong?

[CC3]

I'm not voting for Obama. He doesn't seem to be able to lead. But he does give very loooooong speeches and loves TV. LOL

[debrand]

Ahhh Jericho. The guy who thought sending single mothers and their small children back to the early 1900's was a grand idea. Who then got mad when it was pointed out that that era SUCKED for poor people and accused me of asking trick questions.

Jericho believes that if the government stopped caring for the poor that the church and private charities would just step in and take care of it all. The big problem with that, history proves him wrong. History shows that when the government doesn't care for the poor, their living conditions drop dramatically. Jericho, doesn't give a fuck as long as he gets to keep his money and make sure it only goes to people he approves of caring for.

Jericho I would like to remind you of Jesus' words:

"Give to every man that asketh of thee; and of him that taketh away thy goods ask them not again."

The government is made up of people, people who, according to you, are wanting to take your money and give it to the poor. Guess what, Jesus said you should stop complaining and you shouldn't even ask for it back.

Also, have you studied the Bible wih an unbiased mind to see if you can find the verses that say a fetus is valued by God? Or that abortion is wrong?

Jesus also said that if you have two coats, give away the second coat. He never said to ask the other person if they follow your religion or meet any other criteria.

[Austin]

I'm not voting for Obama. He doesn't seem to be able to lead. But he does give very loooooong speeches and loves TV. LOL

That's a very well-considered argument. Good for you.

[Spider Burps]

That's a very well-considered argument. Good for you.

Austin, I just imagined someone doing the most sarcastic slow clap EVER along with your response to that comment. It made me laugh out loud, so, thanks! :clap:

[Avalondaughter]

I agree with this. He stepped into a hot mess when he took office.

I would also add:

Sweet!

If you like a more foul-mouthed version, you can go to this site http://whatthefuckhasobamadonesofar.com/

I'm not 100% pleased with his performance, but look what he has to work with. I think people saw him as a savior who could fix everything overnight. The world doesn't work that way and he has so many enemies who want to block him at every turn just because they want to make sure he fails.

[emmiedahl]

Do you not get the irony in what you are saying, Jericho?

It is only the followers of Jesus that are mandated to give to the poor. And also only the followers of Jesus that object to giving to the poor via taxes.... ;)

It is only the followers of Jesus who are protesting having to help to help the poor. The rest of us don't mind.

[formergothardite]

He is mad because someone besides Jesus is mandating that he give to the poor.

[GolightlyGrrl]

Then by extension neither is the right to life! Since a lack of healthcare usually results in death...

Abortion party at my place! :dance:

I am so there. I'll bring a bag of potato chips and my goat cheese chip dip.

And are we getting a band or will we have a dj?

[freejoytoo]

It's hard to argue with someone trying to compare healthcare to an iphone.

Jericho, let me make this clear. No one is going to drop dead if they don't have the latest model phone upgrade, but people WILL die if they can't get insurance for chemotherapy, surgery or a burst appendix because they can't afford treatment or don't bother to go in the first place because they don't think it's worth paying to see the doctor. Do you not see how horrific that is? You are a member of society. Everyone is part of society and thus you have a duty to pay into it so you and others can benefit. If you're so anti-tax then I assume you are also militantly opposed to schools, emergency services and driving on roads.

[emmiedahl]

A lot of TP people in my area actually are opposed to public schools.

[formergothardite]

That one blogger, To the Last Ditch, argued once that all roads should be private and if the rich people bought up roads and cut the poor people off from food, jobs, medical care, then so be it. It wasn't the government's job to make sure you have roads.

He also thought that if poor people couldn't afford to send their kids to school than they could just be left with no education.

Jericho, are you for or against legalizing gay marriage? I'm guessing since you are all about getting the government out of your business you would be for it.