Have you ever encountered Baha'i's that aren't Fundies?

[I live off the state]

I have a couple of Baha'i classmates and they are not fundies in the typical sense ( the girls van wear trousers, get degrees, a job and things) but it is a religion that is out for world domination.

 

One of my classmates went to a conference called "towards the new world order", they are striving for one worldwide Baha'i government. I was looking at some of the study material for the conference which included a Q&A section. One of the questions was "when a country become officially Bahai, will non-Bahai be allowed to vote and hold public office?"...I had assumed that given the whole tolerance and "unity in diversity" public face of the religion the answer would be "of course" but instead it was more like "we will see....all political decisions need to be made by the universal house of justice (the top of the Bahai hierarchy). Indecently, the study material was produced by the universal house of justice.

 

The same classmate announced in a lecture on human rights the there would be much less abortions if women just dressed properly.

 

Both of them run "philosophy classes" as extra curricular activities in local schools but think there is nothing wrong with moving on to evangelizing to the kids when they think the kids are ready, without having to discuss it with the school or their parents.

 

 

So yeah, I was wondering if you had ever encountered Bahai's that weren't crazy fundies?

[dawniecakes]

My coworker from Iran, is Bahá'í, and the most left-wing liberal you would ever meet. My friend's stepmom is also Bahá'í and totally not fundy... she hasn't pressured her husband, who is athiest, or their kids (who are Christian and agnostic) into it. So I guess I never realized that Bahá'í could fit into our fundie mold? Interesting.

[Dinorah]

I used to have some Ba'hai friends and they definitely had some fundie-esque tendencies, not so much as to women'role but as concerns sexuality as well as politics. One guy in particular firmly adhered to the idea that he needed his parents' consent to marry (he was in his 30s) and wa politically conservative (he thought that US military intervention in Iran might be a good idea). But I don't want to make generalizations. However, I get the sense that the culture overall stresses the idea of dating for marriage and strongly discourages premarital sex. It seems some of the rigidity of Ba'hai might be related to the fact that it's such a minority religion and somewhat self-enclosed.

The "new world order" stuff surprises me. I thought one of the tenets was that all religions are equal and that they aren't very big on proselitism.

ETA: I would never call the ones I've met "crazy fundies". More like "fundie lite", perhaps?

[Mama Mia]

My best friend growing up was Ba'hai.. I never in a million years would have put her family into the 'fundie' category. She did go through a born again phase in her late teens /early twenties but that was completely separate from Ba'hai.

That really surprises me that they are fundieish ... of course everything seems to have taken a huge swing to the conservative and extreme in the past 30 years.

[kamcho_papio]

The handful of Baha'i I've known didn't strike me as fundie-ish at all, although they were really keen on telling me about Ba'b and Baha'i early and often.

[easternabeille]

I've never met a fundie Baha'i in my life and I grew up with them in my smallish hometown. I remember they used to get together and march in the 4th of July parade with a banner that read 'love' or something like that :)

[Beeks]

I knew some in college. They didn't kiss before marriage and had some wonky ideas, but never seemed to push those on anyone else (as far as I could tell). They seem really open and accepting.

[fundifugee]

I was in university with a Baha'i woman who described herself as a liberal feminist and was always organizing some kind of political protest or group.

In second year, she left her husband after he threw her down the stairs while she was pregnant.

In fourth year, she announced she was pregnant again, and she was back with the physically abusive guy because marriage is forever or some such. She was definitely out to have a large number of children and wanted them all to have the same dad, and couldn't for some reason end up hooking up with someone else, so back to Abusive Man it was.

She lost some of her liberal feminist cred with me at that point.

[FaustianSlip]

I don't know any Baha'i folks personally, but Khalil Fong a Hong Kong-born Mandopop singer is Baha'i, and I don't get a particularly fundie vibe from him at all (fundamentalism in East Asia in general tends to be relatively rare, though cultural attitudes can be very traditional). I was always under the impression that Baha'i as a religion was relatively inclusive and liberal. Guess I need to read up more.

[Renting with Raggles]

In my experience:

1) Persian Baha'i women from Iran - all left-wing, very liberal, strong emphasis on gettinga good career that would take them outside the home, and more importantly, out of Iran where they faced persecution.

2) Western Baha'i converts - all out-there, knit-your-own-tofu hippies. All have careers, but sandals are not optional attire so no business district types.

[pomology]

One of my closest friends in the world is Baha'i and she is not even remotely fundie.

Like, not at all.

In fact, I saw the title of this thread and was utterly confused because from my experience Baha'i is like the least fundie religion ever.

[2xx1xy1JD]

The ones that I know aren't remotely fundy, at all. [i'm not Baha'i, but hubby and I agree that it would be our 2nd choice religion]

I wouldn't necessarily say that a Baha'i who supports American intervention in Iran is politically conservative. I'd say it just means that they want to see political change in Iran, and are upset that the US did nothing in 2009. Baha'is have faced an insane level of persecution in Iran since the revolution, so I'd expect it to be an issue for most of them.

AFAIK, they support gender equality. They also recognize prophets from several religions, so instead of labelling adherents of other faiths as heretics destined for hell, they basically see some common moral principals and see other religions as part of the ongoing process of divine revelation. They will "share" their faith, but not pressure anyone into converting. They support human rights. While their teaching say that sex should be only within a heterosexual marriage, they oppose intolerance or shoving their beliefs down the throats of others. There also seems to be a teaching against being involved in partisan politics, although taking administrative government jobs is fine.

There is a belief in the unity of humanity and a hope in the eventual establishment of One World Government. Since they are such a minority in the world, that's not likely any time soon, and I've never heard of any religiously-motivated violence BY Baha'is, only against them. On a practical level, it results in them supporting things like universal human rights.

They also like science, and think that there is no contradiction between faith and science.

Source of info: http://info.bahai.org/article-1-7-0-1.html

[Kelya]

The few I've met have been absolute fundie nutcases. I'm surprised at the variety of our experiences with such a small religion.

[Avalondaughter]

In my experience:

1) Persian Baha'i women from Iran - all left-wing, very liberal, strong emphasis on gettinga good career that would take them outside the home, and more importantly, out of Iran where they faced persecution.

2) Western Baha'i converts - all out-there, knit-your-own-tofu hippies. All have careers, but sandals are not optional attire so no business district types.

I've never personally known an Baha'is, but I went to temple in Chicago a few months ago (what an amazing building! I wanted to tell them I was in the choir and start singing so they would let me up in the choir loft) and everyone who worked there seemed very UN-hippieish in terms of dress and behavior.

I really don't know much about their politics. On the surface, their creed is something I could get behind. I doubt I'll be a convert though. ;)

[DistantStar]

I was Baha'i for a couple of years, in my very early twenties. They tend to be theologically quite conservative, though lacking the whole hellfire thing, and socially pretty progressive with some huge gaps -- women are not allowed, for example, to be elected to their highest council. The excuse I was given was that who would want that job and don't we have better things to do anyway. Riiiiiiiiight. And their views on homosexuality are on par with the 1950s. Those were the big two things that pushed me away. It's a more authoritarian religion than it looks like on the outside, which is weird. I see some parallels with the Mormons in that way.

But most Baha'is I've met are, as individuals, awesome people. And oh, the Persian food...yum! They are very big on multicuturalism and peace and unity and all that stuff. The treatment they get in Iran pisses me right off. These are not people who are going to be taking over the world anytime soon.

[Linnea]

The one Bahai I know (a convert) is an extremely crunchy "knit-your-own-tofu" type. (What a great phrase!) She puzzles me because she spouts the talk about no-sex-before-marriage and so on, but definitely doesn't practice it. She's bisexual, but periodically says that she won't sleep with women because it's against her religion.

[Rachel333]

The few I've met were quite liberal. The one Baha'i I know well can be kind of obnoxious about it, though; she's somewhat self-righteous about not drinking, and finds a way to bring her religion into any topic.

[camdendayton]

Rainn Wilson (Dwight on The US Office) is Baha'i, and it of course sounded really benign when he described it on WTF podcast.

[Ralar]

My orthodontist is Baha'i. He's a 30-something, possibly gay, young man who immigrated with his family from Iran when he was a toddler. He is very personable (very attractive, lol) and does not strike me as even the tiniest bit fundy.

[Kitchen Princess]

My coworker from Iran, is Bahá'í, and the most left-wing liberal you would ever meet. My friend's stepmom is also Bahá'í and totally not fundy... she hasn't pressured her husband, who is athiest, or their kids (who are Christian and agnostic) into it. So I guess I never realized that Bahá'í could fit into our fundie mold? Interesting.

Those are the kind of Bahá'í I know, too. Very peaceful, loving, out-in-the-world family.

[MamaJunebug]

I haven't met any members of that faith personally, but vividly recall the following:

We were in the audience for a Native American singing and dancing performance by a member of one of the tribes from up north. Can't remember his name or nation for anything. Anyway, at one point his grown son came on stage and the two of them did a dance side-by-side, perfectly synchronized. It was pretty cool.

Then he witnessed to the audience for Baha'i and several people around us groaned loudly. This was decades ago, when it didn't faze me to hear Christians witness hither or yon, so initially my response to the groans was, "Oh, calm down, freedom of speech, etc."

Decades later, in retropsect, that seemed pretty fundie-esque.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

For a couple of years, the Baha'i community had a nicely hand-lettered sign near a highway intersection reading:

One planet

One people

Please

-- the Baha'i

At the time I thought how nice it was that they were polite and said "please" even though what they were asking seemed a perfectly fine idea to me as I drove past.

~~~~~~~~~~~~

And Rainn Wilson (Dwight Schrute) is Baha'i and has used his celebrity to advocate for persecuted members of his religion in other countries. That's about all I know, but yes, there do seem to be some parallels. Possibly there are wide divergences in other parts of their practice...?

[aelar]

The Baha'i family I know is hippie to the max (I am in CA after all). I think that while the parents wish their kids would have followed all the rules, they didn't themselves, so they don't make a big deal out of their kids partying, being bisexual, having sex, etc. It felt to me more like how most Christians, even non-fundie ones, will say that waiting until marriage for example, is the best thing to do religiously, but in real life, people make different decisions, and it doesn't make them bad people.

[PBrooke]

The one I knew, I knew all through college. Super liberal, majored in a science, dated and I am sure kissed, totally not fundie. Never really brought it up. The only time I even remembered about the Ba'hai thing was as it pertained to alcohol; but since I myself was a super-liberal but a goody two-shoes when it came to alcohol (my, how things change) it never really affected anything.

[Angri-la]

I knew many Baha'is in Chicago, as there is only one temple in North America, and that is it. And one appears in the "Convert the Heathens" game on The Simpsons, at the Flanders: "Oh Look!A gentle Baha'i!"

I like the tenets of their faith, that all religions are the same, save the Prophet, who is sent to teach the social teachings of the time, Jesus, Zoroaster, Buddha, Mohammad, etc. I went through a brief "seeker" phase with them, and saw much beauty within the texts. The issue with them, is there are so many differing stories because humankind is involved. Once humankind is involved with anything as pure as faith, so creeps in the frailties of man: pride, avarice, lust, greed, etc. I met some wonderful people of their faith, and some horrible ones.

I do think American Christians should look at the persecution of Baha'is in Iran, if they would like an illustration of modern faith-persecution. They executed a 13 year old girl there in the 80s, for refusing to give up her faith.

The Baha'i custom really is that both sets of parents must write a letter giving blessing for the wedding; to ensure no familial discord, and they must have a public wedding, wherein the only Baha'i requirement is the phrase: "We will all, verily, abide by the will of God", repeated by bride and groom. I attended a full Catholic mass that was also a Baha'i wedding.

Their joke is: What is the Baha'i fruit? Cantaloupe. *rimshot* Because couples cannot elope.

[ladypuglover]

My abusive ex is a Baha'i and that most likely taints my view of Baha'i because all I can see is the abuse he put me through in the name of his religion. So I may not be the best person to ask. In comparing it to the fundy attitude I saw a lot of of me man/you nothing. I wasn't allowed to go to church in my faith nor take my infant sons, not even for weddings or deaths. I take that back, an exception was made for one funeral in my family only if my husband would go with me which he did.

This little group had me renounce my faith in a tounge I didn't know and it bothered me for me many years after I found out what they made me say.

They encouraged my ex to beat the living snot out me and our infant son if we didn't follow what they said were our roles. How can an infant, a 6 month old have or know his role in life?

When I left my ex we had to follow a rule of no sex with each other or any other person for 365 days or else we couldn't get divorce. That didn't happen as my ex couldn't leave the teen girls alone, so I pushed for divorce anyway.

I had to have therapy for awhile to deal with the religious abuse that this group did to my son and self and I don't think I ever got over it. It is still hard in my mind to seperate my ex from the religion.

I have a lot more that happened but I can't go there. Not today or maybe ever.

I don't know if my ex's religion was different from other Baha'i's or not and I'm still not able to find out.

The point of my story is that I personaly find the Baha'i religion very abusive but I guess any person could say that about any religion, even my own, if religion was used to abuse a person. :(