Are "ethnic" fundies different?

[2xx1xy1JD]

As I've mentioned before, I known very few fundies. The evangelical Christians that I do know personally are generally Filippino, Korean, Chinese or Black.

Most of the snark-worthy blogs mentioned here seem to be by American, non-ethnic whites, and some seem to have a downright racist vibe (eg. encouraging lots of baby making just to avoid having America taken over by immigrants).

Can anyone enlighten me about the relationship between ethnic and non-ethnic fundies? How different are their views and positions?

[Rosa]

The theology's often the same, but the cultural biases are different.

All the immigrant fundies I've known have been strivers, too - all the Nigerian immigrants in the Vineyard church, for example (I worked for a Vineyard family) - they definitely don't do the "women not working" thing because they want their families to thrive, and they pursue education as a means towards that too. And the spanish-language mostly-immigrant fundy churches around here, all the women work. They may talk "virtuous womanhood" but it doesn't mean the same thing at ALL.

[tabitha2]

Their were black slave owners and traders and Jewish Nazis;People are people and have all sorts of reasons for their actions and believes that go beyond ethnicity and can always talk themselves into believing their is no dissonance so I believe over all not much different than white ATI/VFers.

[kamcho_papio]

As I've mentioned before, I known very few fundies. The evangelical Christians that I do know personally are generally Filippino, Korean, Chinese or Black.

Most of the snark-worthy blogs mentioned here seem to be by American, non-ethnic whites, and some seem to have a downright racist vibe (eg. encouraging lots of baby making just to avoid having America taken over by immigrants).

Can anyone enlighten me about the relationship between ethnic and non-ethnic fundies? How different are their views and positions?

In the US there's a huge Hispanic Evangelical movement; many sociologists have noted that part of the movement is symbolic (an old world/new world split), or part of the "Americanization" of first and second generation immigrants, although that's a bit oversimplifying.

When I lived in Texas, I often saw a lot of Hispanic families who looked fundie (long skirts, severe hair, headcoverings pretty often) but at first I thought they might have been crypto-Jews, or at least the folks who converted based on the semi-myth of the conversos and crypto Jews. I never had a chance to talk deeply with any of these students at my school, or even to figure out if they were recent immigrants from Mexico or Central America, or if they were long-settled, self-identifying as Hispano or Hispanic. The boys worked but a lot of the girls went to college for nursing or pre-K education. It was a rural area, so I don't know how many had homesteading fantasies already. As a group, they weren't as flamboyantly fundie as many of the other white American fundies.

[Kitty]

Evangelicalism is very much a white, middle-class movement, and the American brand of fundamentalism is also majority-white. This doesn't stop blacks or Koreans from being evangelical or fundamentalist, since neither one is inherently racist.

The difference, however, is that evangelical and fundamentalist churches wind up segregated by race. You have white churches, black churches, Korean churches, etc. I've never understood this; growing up in the South I was told that my lily-white, ginger self didn't belong in a black church, but there were a few black people in my very white church. I think each ethnicity has a different take on fundamentalism, and white evangelicals/fundies wind up seeming racist because of the untruths they've been fed over the years (like "black people need to get up off their lazy asses/welfare," never mind the Duggars' MakaziVille). White fundies, in regards to views on race, aren't actually all that different from white non-fundies. At least in the South :?

[Rachel333]

There's a Chinese fundie family around here who I met through music stuff. I'd love to know their story. I think they immigrated within the last decade or so, if I remember correctly. Their oldest child has a Chinese name and the rest have your typical fundie names. They have a whole bunch of children and the girls dress very fundie. I think I saw them on the Duggars' show once.

[lilwriter85]

In the US there's a huge Hispanic Evangelical movement; many sociologists have noted that part of the movement is symbolic (an old world/new world split), or part of the "Americanization" of first and second generation immigrants, although that's a bit oversimplifying.

When I lived in Texas, I often saw a lot of Hispanic families who looked fundie (long skirts, severe hair, headcoverings pretty often) but at first I thought they might have been crypto-Jews, or at least the folks who converted based on the semi-myth of the conversos and crypto Jews. I never had a chance to talk deeply with any of these students at my school, or even to figure out if they were recent immigrants from Mexico or Central America, or if they were long-settled, self-identifying as Hispano or Hispanic. The boys worked but a lot of the girls went to college for nursing or pre-K education. It was a rural area, so I don't know how many had homesteading fantasies already. As a group, they weren't as flamboyantly fundie as many of the other white American fundies.

There are some descenedants of crypto Jews/conversos in southwestern states. A lot of them have DNA evidence of their Jewish heritage but most don't convert to Judasim. The ones have converted don't wear long skirts, or anything like hat.

[lilwriter85]

My brother knows a fundie Hispanic couple. The wife wears long skirts and has her hair long and homeschools. There are some fundie lite Hispanics in New Mexico. But a majority of Hispanics in New Mexico are Catholic.

[deelaem]

Back when I lived in the Central Valley of California, there was a fairly large faction of Latino fundies. There were more of them than Caucasian fundies. They were generally Apostolic or Penecostal. Not all of them homeschooled, because I can think of a few little girls that were in my sons' classes that I used to feel so sorry for. They kept to themselves, and of course would not associate with the Catholic Latinos.

[kamcho_papio]

There are some descenedants of crypto Jews/conversos in southwestern states. A lot of them have DNA evidence of their Jewish heritage but most don't convert to Judasim. The ones have converted don't wear long skirts, or anything like hat.

Depending on the study, some or none at all have any distinguishing DNA markers identifying people of Hispanic descent in the southwest as crypto-Jews. There have been recent studies about this, and they basically conclude through ethnographic surveys and DNA analysis that there is a very, very small group, but most of the people who claim the ancestry (and converted!) aren't actually of Jewish heritage.

I like this article (from 2000): http://www.theatlantic.com/past/docs/is ... /ferry.htm

It's definitely a charged topic, but a lot of shows on Christian cable networks repeat the same story in many different parts of Latin America: my grandparents weren't Catholic! they didn't eat pork! They did Jewish-y things! One of the suggested cultural explanations for people latching on to the crypto-Jew idea is that it added an extra dimension to the racial and cultural hierarchy of southwestern culture. As in, there's already some tension between the Hispanos and the Mexicans and the extra layer of 'authenticity' is somewhat unimpeachable.

The reason I thought that the Hispanic fundies might have been New Mexican Jews was just basic confusion. They didn't look quite like the fundies I'd seen, but they definitely weren't just wearing long skirts and denim frumpers for funsies. The older women often wore tichels like the Messianic Jews documented here (Lina and Suzanne), but at the time, the only Messianics I had known were suburban types who liked to mix up their evangelical Christianity with a Passover seder and some Hebrew vocab. I got a Fiddler on the Roof sort of vibe, is all. :oops:

edited to add stuff

[JesusFightClub]

I used to know some Korean and Filipino fundie-lites, and there were a few similarities ("keeping sweet" towards each other, modest dress, though not excessively so, concern about appearance of evil).

But what was absent was any of the malice our snarkable fundies display. They came across as bland and sweet. They would never bitch, talk politics or ever (heaven forbid) be rude. They did disapprove of me, but one of the girls once came round to where I was staying and saw I had an icon given by a religious but non fundie pal and she got quite tearful "Oh, how beautiful! God is working on your heart! What a blessing!" It was a bit embarrassing, really.

So I would say "actually being nice" would be the main difference. But I don't know why this is.

And like I said, apolitical. They were mostly girls that I knew, and if there was a scandal or a big political issue they would say "Gosh, how terrible. I will keep those people in my prayers" and that was about it. American fundies are super politicised.

[doe]

I do know of a couple of black women fundies online who are into head covering, old fashioned modest clothes, submission, etc. At least one of them follows blogs/is friends with several white women fundies who are into the same things. She is also a SAHD.