Jump to content
IGNORED

Only 39% of Americans believe in evolution


celestial

Recommended Posts

That's because evolution is not taught in public schools, and when it *is* taught, it must be "balanced" with a non-scientific viewpoint. People are being told in schools that they need to choose between religion and verifiable fact, a false dichotomy. So evolution remains a vague, strange idea that involves chimps and early people mating, and only college-level science students ever get to witness the simplicity and elegance of the idea.

One big problem with public schools is an almost total lack of national standards. Each state decides what to teach, and even within states different districts are often given a lot of power. You can get weirdos on school boards, especially in places where it's an elected official. So there's a ton of variation by location, and also over time. But for every school that teaches evolution thoroughly, there are many more that do a mediocre job or just don't teach it at all. My school did a decent job of it, but didn't really go far enough. When I got to college and took my first freshman bio course, it was really amazing how much the students differed in their knowledge, with some knowing a lot and most not understanding at all.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 85
  • Created
  • Last Reply

I learned about evolution, without any reference to intelligent design, or a disclaimer saying "it's only a theory." In a North Carolina public high school. It was never mentioned in middle school, but in middle school the focus was more on cool experiments and there weren't any standardized tests.

I'm amazed that North Carolina is more progressive about this than other states. Southern states aren't supposed to be... not ass-backwards.

I think another poll that came out a few years ago said only 25% of Americans believed in evolution, so 14 percentage point gain? fucking awesome.

I first learned about evolution at age 8, was fascinated by fossils, and then one day when I was in church (at age 11), the adults put in a video that said dinosaurs were planted by Satan. In high school I had to put up with creationists arguing with the teacher over the existence of Australopithecus afarensis, and in biology, the same ones arguing over evolution. When I got to college, though, nobody said anything about it and everyone seemed to understand it just fine.

But yeah, telling people that religion and science don't mix... that's basically telling them reality and science don't mix.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news ... 29204.html

To adapt an Arkansas saying, thank God for Turkey. At least we're not last. :lol:

I was taught evolution pretty in depth in 10th grade biology, and even more so in AP Biology. We had a creationist in class who was totally obnoxious about it and very disrespectful to the teacher. He was awesome, though, and shut down all of her (very poor, even by creationist standards) arguments.

In college I also took a history class that started with the evolution of humans (the professor was really an anthropologist, not a historian). Some of the students decided that they didn't have to learn about that, and they surfed Facebook and chatted to each other the whole time and started to take notes only when the teacher moved on from evolution.

Oh, and then I took an Evolutionary Biology course and sat behind a guy who spend the entire time looking at Answers in Genesis on his laptop.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes

Why in the world would that be weird? Plenty of people believe that. I guess if you ask "Is X weird?" you're bound to find at least one person who says yes.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This is my first post on the new forum.

I too was taught evolution in middle school and high school. In fact, it was also touched on in 4th grade, I believe. This was during the 70s in FL. I graduated in 80. My 4th grade teacher preferenced it by talking about some people sitting on a fence (middle ground b/t belief/science - odd that I remember this explanation and not the actual item taught) but nothing seemed earthshaking about the teaching. At the time I believed in God and found nothing wrong with both the science of evolution and that God created life via use of evolution.

At this time, FL was only geographically southern but was quite liberal/northern in it's thinking, no massive church going, etc. I did also go to church - some Baptist in elem school but mostly a progressive presby church during middle and high school, if I went at all.

I moved from FL to Atlanta, GA in 88 and suffered culture shock at the religiosity and backward superstitious thinking that abounded from the religous right. (I worked with a guy on a psych unit who was sure psychotic people were possessed by demons.)

I'm now in Erie, PA with a large catholic contingent. I'm not too sure how this area feels about evolution.

I can recommend a great doc by Nova entitled Judgement Day: INtelligent Design on Trial. It is avail in one showing (rather than segments) on Youtube.

As of my early 20s, I vascillate b/t atheism, agnosticism, and Hinduism. Either way, I find people who beleive in the literal interpretation of the bible, a real Adam and Eve, and those who refuse to accept evolution as being generally superstitious. I'm sure there are a few exceptions to this.

I have a thought regarding young earthers but I think that needs to be another thread.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

My husband grew up in Erie and he, his family, and all their friends from there - the majority of whom are Catholic - believe in evolution. The Catholic church teaches evolution happens, just that it is guided by the hand of God. I remember my 4th grade teacher, a nun, telling us about evolution and dinosaurs. She also told us the book of Genesis were just stories to teach a point.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

She also told us the book of Genesis were just stories to teach a point.

Doesn't that kind of destroy their theology? I'm thinking of the whole "original sin" thing. If Adam and Eve and the Garden of Eden never existed and no one ever disobeyed Yahweh by eating an apple, then no humans were guilty of bringing about a "fallen world" and thus there would be no reason for Jesus to come and save humanity from something that didn't exist in the first place.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

We had a courses in high school called "zoology" which was evolutionary biology (basically, you can't avoid evolution). Each time the evolutionary process was brought up, the teacher was obligated to say, "if you believe in evolution". It got to the point of ridiculousness like saying "if you believe in gravity" while trying to teach Newtonian physics. If anything, it highlighted the importance of evolution in the study of biology. Looking back on it, I realized my teacher was probably legally obligated to say this because of some crap antievolution legislation. I lived in a really dumb state.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes

No, of course it is not weird. There is no conflict between God and science, no reason God couldn't have created the universe and let it evolve.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The fact that increasing amount of education is correlated with a higher percentage believing in evolution is probably the main reasons why the Duggars don't encourage their children to get a real education or go beyond the SOTDRT.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You know how I learned about evolution? I watched Fantasia like crazy when I was little. I was fascinated by the idea that every living creature came from a few cells that happened to divide, and that life eventually branched off into many forms. The public schools I attended rarely, if ever, mentioned creationism as a legitimate idea. As an adult, I've come to consider "the miracle of life" as something that's spiritually guided, since I believe that everything works so perfectly that it must be the work of a guiding force. Lesson: Even an ebil Disney movie won't make a kid believe that everything around us arose out of nothing, and that there must be a God in some shape or form.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would suspect that the bulk of "real" creationists in the UK are Muslim, with a smaller portion of their few fundie Christian groups. I don't know if the study inflated the numbers because of the way the questions were worded - in the UK students can opt out of science classes before they really get in depth in any subject - so it may be a case of creationism by default.

My pet YEC at work insists on making such statements as "I can't believe in evolution because it's random" and "scientists don't always have the right answers" and then will turn around and admit that she only took science up to year 8 (13 years old). Far out.

Yes, this. I opted out of biology when I was 14 and never learned about evolution. I looked into it a little myself and already knew not to trust preachers over scientists. Plus the creation account doesn't make sense logically.

Muslims aren't approaching 50% in the UK though (they are far below that, and are not all creationists anyway). So I am curious as to how the question was worded.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

:o I shouldn't be surprised at this statistic, but I am anyway. All of my schooling was done in asomewhat conservative area in PA, and we were always taught evolution as a fact without having theology shoveled down our throats at the same time. Strangely enough, there is also a large number of people of faith. The thing is, they get their science in science class and their religion in church, as it should be.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Why do fundies stop with the theory of evolution? I suggest they also:

(1)Refuse to believe in Einstein's theory of relativity: fly at the speed of light - you will get your work done faster.

(2) Refuse to believe in the theory of plate tectonics - live right on the San Andreas fault - what could go wrong?

(3) Refuse to believe quantum theory - MRI's, nuclear bombs, X-rays ? really who can believe in these things?

(4)Refuse to believe in photosynthesis - you don't like eating greens anyway

(5) bernoulli principle? really? planes fly by magic right?

I could go on and on but I just can't understand why fundies limit themselves so.

They don't limit themselves. Especially with #2. If you look at some of the statements by fundies (and even liberal religious people), they will make comments about how god caused the earthquake/tornado/other natural disaster due to some sort of sin.

What gets me are these fundies and other religious types who cry about the evils of science...as they type on their computers, drive their cars and use medicine.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Evolution isn't something you "believe in". You accept it based on the overwhelming evidence supporting it. Or you reject it in favor of ignorance and superstition. Lots of people manage to accept the truth of evolution and continue to believe in their religion.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Doesn't that kind of destroy their theology? I'm thinking of the whole "original sin" thing. If Adam and Eve and the Garden of Eden never existed and no one ever disobeyed Yahweh by eating an apple, then no humans were guilty of bringing about a "fallen world" and thus there would be no reason for Jesus to come and save humanity from something that didn't exist in the first place.

Catholics are not biblical literalists, so it isn't just this one nun. I think the idea is that we all know (or are supposed to know) that we are born sinful and that the story of the garden of eden is a story to help us understand why, but it isn't to be taken as strict truth. Instead, we are probably supposed to reflect on how God created us, but we are sinful.

I'm a lapsed Catholic without a copy of the cathechism, so if someone understands this better, feel free to step in.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Why in the world would that be weird? Plenty of people believe that. I guess if you ask "Is X weird?" you're bound to find at least one person who says yes.

Because plenty of people believe that, it isn't weird??

At this day and age with all the scientific knowledge, plenty of people still believe in some sort of deity, I find that weird.

But of course I don't live in a country where only 39% of the population believe in evolution.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Evolution isn't something you "believe in". You accept it based on the overwhelming evidence supporting it. Or you reject it in favor of ignorance and superstition. Lots of people manage to accept the truth of evolution and continue to believe in their religion.

Margie, This is not what I was going to share, but it is so on point that I needed to quote you.

I went to public school in the 60's and 70's in Philadephia. Evolution was taught the same way as Geometry. It was a part of the basic set of facts that govern the universe. They deferred the conversation about whether or not this all was guided by a supernatural force to our home lives. In high school there was some discussion about beliefs, but the teacher only kept us civil to each other and did not offer comment. The discusssions were ended without comment becuase it was time to move to the next topic. There really was no controversy.

I would like to see the wording of the question in this poll as well. I suspect that the wording may have affected the results. I know a lot of people who believe in evolution who also believe that is was guided by god. Depending on the wording of the question, their answers may be different.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Evolution isn't something you "believe in". You accept it based on the overwhelming evidence supporting it. Or you reject it in favor of ignorance and superstition. Lots of people manage to accept the truth of evolution and continue to believe in their religion.

This :clap:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Muslims aren't approaching 50% in the UK though (they are far below that, and are not all creationists anyway). So I am curious as to how the question was worded.

I really didn't communicate that well - I don't think that the poll accurately reflected the number of creationists in the UK at all.

What I was meant was - of the population in the UK who are creationists, I suspect the bulk of that number will be Muslim. Now if you follow Islam at all seriously*, you pretty much have to be an Old Earth Creationist. It's a bit different to the YEC Christians who claim 6 days/ 6,000 years ago. The Quran has a 6 day creation but then explicitly says in other places that thing similar to liberal Christians' belief that a day to God is like an eternity to humans, etc. So Muslims are generally OK with the Big Bang and the creation of the universe; however, the Quran also talks about the creation of the first two humans - so absolutely no sharing a common ancestor with apes! Some more liberal Muslims believe every other species evolved but humans are the special exception. This belief in creationism can cause a lot of difficulty when Muslims enter the field of medical science. Some time last year a doctor in London said he thought there might be some truth in evolution and had to retract his statement when he had death threats from other congregants of his mosque

* I'm not talking about those who are sort of "culturally" Muslim, I know some people who only go to a mosque when they're dragged there twice a year by their relatives - like cultural Christians who show up for the Christmas carol service and maybe Easter.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Catholics are not biblical literalists, so it isn't just this one nun.

Does anyone know what's with all the wannabe fundie Catholics in the US who espouse creationism now like Santorum, Andrew Schafly and what's-her-name on the Bill Maher show that thought she was a witch?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Because plenty of people believe that, it isn't weird??

At this day and age with all the scientific knowledge, plenty of people still believe in some sort of deity, I find that weird.

But of course I don't live in a country where only 39% of the population believe in evolution.

:roll: Oh get off your ridiculous high horse. Plenty of people believe in both religion and god and don't see them as mutually exlclusive. "Science is the how, religion is the why" I believe is the saying.

Yes! Even in Europe!!!!!!!11!!!1!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Someone mentioned upthread that kids in U.S. public schools are taught intelligent design as an alternative to the theory of evolution. If they are, it's illegal because it violates constitutional prohibitions against government imposition of religion. Doesn't mean it's not happening, but it shouldn't be!

I suspect that more often than not public school teachers, especially in the Bible belt, are just staying away from the whole topic so as to avoid controversy and fundie outrage. As a result, an overwhelming number of people are ignorant of what the theory entails and as I think Emmiedahl said, they are picturing whacky things like croc-a-ducks.

One comforting thing: the remaining 61% of Americans aren't necessarily rejecting the theory of evolution or embracing full-blown creationism. The poll says that 36% simply say they don't know either way. I like that because one of the most disturbing things about the creationists is their insistence that they know better than the scientists even though they often haven't studied evolution or the evidence. Although ignorance of basic science in the American population is troubling, I would rather see people who admit to ignorance because it shows some intellectual honesty.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

:roll: Oh get off your ridiculous high horse. Plenty of people believe in both religion and god and don't see them as mutually exlclusive. "Science is the how, religion is the why" I believe is the saying.

Yes! Even in Europe!!!!!!!11!!!1!

Not in my part of Europe and my high horse is far from ridiculous.

But if you, or anybody else for that matter, choose to believe we find the 'why' in a 'deity', well by all means do so, but I find it weird.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I wonder if they phrased it like, "Do you believe that God created the world, or that it evolved from nothing?" or some other weird wording.

That comes a long a lot. I hate it when they make people feel like these have anything to do with each other. It's fully possible to believe in God and also realize that evolution happened/happens.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.




×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.