Thinking about Smuggar

[Kitty]

I don't know if Josh is secretly having doubts about the way he was raised, or just indulging himself now that he has some freedom.

I think it's both.

[Feberin]

I don't think Smugger will change his ways at all. He won't break free and will continue indulging. He'll probably have heart problems and hopefully for Anna's sake trouble getting it up.

[thoughtful]

I think it's both.

I suspect as much, as well - my sense is that he's mostly disagreeing with the parts that didn't let him indulge, and hasn't thought much about doctrine or the rights of women.

But there's no way to know.

Yet. :)

[bananacat]

If Josh does ever "rebel", I suspect he'll continue being a giant misogynist douche but with a different religion or none at all. I don't expect him to ever become a decent human being, although I could see him switching to a different flavor of jerk.

[NJMom]

I'm actually a little sorry for Josh. It seems like he's under tremendous pressure to live exactly the way Jim Bob and Michelle did when they were young, and he's not allowed to express a different opinion even if he has one. Anna was raised under similar circumstances, though her family was smaller (I think I read once her mom is actually older than her dad, late 50s now,so they may not have gotten into the movement until close to age 30, hence the smaller family). The two of them most likely really don't know any other way to live, they've had no other close relatives or friends to look to if they did decide to leave Gothardism. They're married and have children of their own yet still have to be a part of 19 Kids and Counting (guess the money they receive as a separate paycheck must be a lot better than the car lot). It appears no one in Jim Bob's family is allowed to say no to him, even his mother follows them around on camera and lives in their house. I guess everybody's afraid of being cut off from Jim Bob if they dared to express a difference of opinion- Josh and Anna have already seen it with some of her siblings and I'm sure they don't want that for themselves.

[snickerz]

In reference to some earlier posts about how fertile Anna may or may not be - her sister Esther had 7 children by 9.5 years of marriage. So I do think Anna is capable of super-fertility. Whether she pops them out as regularly as her sister, or slows down (and eventually shuts down) the baby factory, remains to be seen.

[Sola]

If Josh does ever "rebel", I suspect he'll continue being a giant misogynist douche but with a different religion or none at all. I don't expect him to ever become a decent human being, although I could see him switching to a different flavor of jerk.

Yeah, I think that if he rebels, he'll still be an asshole. He'll just be an out of control asshole.

[Milly-Molly-Mandy]

Patriarchy sucks for women, but it sucks for men too. Josh must be under TREMENDOUS pressure to provide for his family knowing that there will always be more kids to feed and that Anna will not be a significant financial help no matter what. The economy sucks, he'd need retraining to do anything else and there's nothing he can do about these problems.

Exactly. While I do this women get it worse than men by a LOT, men get a pretty shit deal too having to support everyone, take all the financial responsibility and decisions and stress of a large family.

[Daenerys]

I'm actually a little sorry for Josh. It seems like he's under tremendous pressure to live exactly the way Jim Bob and Michelle did when they were young, and he's not allowed to express a different opinion even if he has one. Anna was raised under similar circumstances, though her family was smaller (I think I read once her mom is actually older than her dad, late 50s now,so they may not have gotten into the movement until close to age 30, hence the smaller family). The two of them most likely really don't know any other way to live, they've had no other close relatives or friends to look to if they did decide to leave Gothardism. They're married and have children of their own yet still have to be a part of 19 Kids and Counting (guess the money they receive as a separate paycheck must be a lot better than the car lot). It appears no one in Jim Bob's family is allowed to say no to him, even his mother follows them around on camera and lives in their house. I guess everybody's afraid of being cut off from Jim Bob if they dared to express a difference of opinion- Josh and Anna have already seen it with some of her siblings and I'm sure they don't want that for themselves.

The problem is, JB and J'Chelle were able to ride the property boom and the good times of the 1980s to give themselves a base: Josh is expected to do the same in an awful recession.

[koolmom]

Like Danny Bonaduce??

[Buzzard]

I wonder if JD or some of the other male slaves havent been married off yet because of the way smugs has turned out. Sure, he's popping out the grand duggars, but he's a douche and looks like he cant handle the freedom, which is a reflection on his upbringing. He has no real education and his business is a joke... doesnt look like the poster family!

I think boob is setting JD up better before he can leave the nest.

[meow139]

I don't know if Josh is secretly having doubts about the way he was raised, or just indulging himself now that he has some freedom.

Sadly, he may end up keeping the patriarchal right-wing douche part while rejecting the hard-working self-control part, for the rest of his life.

But maybe there's a decent human being in there.

I do, however, see one short-term source of money for him, once the TLC gravy train is gone.

I wonder if Josh will do some time as the spokesperson for one of the weight-loss programs that sends the food to the consumer.

He'd get it free, Anna will prep it for him, and it's back to the simplicity of an authority figure telling him what to eat, limiting portions, and setting it in front of him.

As long as he doesn't cheat, it seems custom-made for him.

So there's a potential year or two of income, and perhaps help for his health and public image, as well.

Was that sarcasm? If it wasn't, I apologize for laughing my ass off.

This topic had really made me (coughforcedmecough) to reevaluate Smuggar. I kind of feel bad for him now. I still hate him, but there's so much pressure, and Anna is obviously not as... ahem, "fertile"... (coughcoughwillingcough)

[Buzzard]

Maybe this is some gothard master plan! A bible diet with prepared meals that he blesses! Joshie can be the spokesman, but first he has to need it!

[freealljs]

I've always felt bad for Smuggar. He got a shitty education at the dining room table from a teacher (Mullet) whose only ambition in life has been to make it into the world record books, mak money, and be famous for having a uterus of steel. He may have wanted to become a lawyer, but now has to contend with being a car salesman. If he wants to go to a real brick and mortar university (screw College Minus), he will most likely have to take remedial college courses just to learn what he would have been taught if he went to a real school and not Dining Room High School. I wish I could put Boob and Mullet in a police interrogation room and let them know exactly what I think that they are doing to their children by suppressing their education and dreams.

I don't know if Boob is preparing John a little better (as someone previously posted) given how Smugs turned out. I wonder how much of John not being married off is not so much Boob's wishes, but more John's desire to not turn out like his older brother: fat, miserable, with two kids, and a wife who wants to pop out babies like his mother. From previous episodes, I didn't see a lot of closeness between Boob and John, like I did with Boob and Josh, prior to Josh getting married. But I could be wrong though about that.

Yea, I wish I could wake Smugs up and tell him to get an education with the some of the money he got from TLC. But I think it will take something big to change Smugs from being someone smug and pompous, who lives under his father's thumb, into a humbled man with ambition and drive.

[thoughtful]

Was that sarcasm? If it wasn't, I apologize for laughing my ass off.

Mostly just riding the idle speculation bus, but I'm not bothered by the fact you found it funny - no apology needed. :)

Josh may turn out to be a permanent mess, a fame whore who jumps from one opportunity to be faux-famous to another, a total Dominionist douche, or a guy who actually wants to leave all of that behind.

But I don't know if he can ever pull himself out of the hole into which his weird upbringing has put him, even if he develops an open mind at some point.

[thoughtful]

Maybe this is some gothard master plan! A bible diet with prepared meals that he blesses! Joshie can be the spokesman, but first he has to need it!

Aha! That's it! :D

Like the witch in Hansel and Gretel, Gothard had to get him fattened up first.

That Josh -- he's so brave and self-sacrificing! :lol:

[helloemi]

Well... Lots of cheap beer could account for the bloat.

I wonder of his parents have an opinion on the giant TV. Sometimes I feel the "TV is evil" stance is so that a person is able to take an outward stance. Fundies seem to have a tough time with Christianity being about inward faith, versus outward (head covering, kosher diet, long skirts).