A Sober Look at the Duggar Situation

[Burris]

16-week-old fetus

 

I would like to weight in on the still-birth – yeah, I know; miscarriage, but I'll get back to that in a moment – of Michelle Duggar's 20th child.

 

To Michelle Duggar and her family, that was a baby, not a fetus, and it was still-born. It looked human. It once had a heartbeat. It was alive. It had hands and feet and it was a wanted child.

 

In March of 2007, I had a miscarriage – eight weeks along - and it was made all the more painful because that was the only time in my life I've ever been pregnant: I've never been able to conceive again. It was a fluke. A Miracle. And it lasted only eight fucking weeks! When my younger brother found out, he and his girlfriend were curious as to what the miscarried fetal material looked like – information I wasn't much interested in offering. If this fetus had been still-born at 20 weeks, they would never have been so insensitive – and I doubt my family doctor, who knows my husband has a disability, would have said, “Well, miscarriage is nature's way of taking care of potential children too disabled or deformed to live.â€

 

I thought a lot about it then – about Western privilege and all that, about whether or not it's wise to potentially pass on certain genetic mutations, about the high infant mortality rate in many developing countries. I wondered if it were right to grieve; self-indulgent given how many full-term babies die of wholly preventable causes such as malnutrition.

 

I came to the conclusion that grief is free. There's an unlimited supply of the stuff ready to meet any horror involved with the human condition. It was alright for me to grieve because, well, I needed to do it and there was no cost uncured by it for those who've suffered greater losses than me.

 

I had disposed of the remains in the only manner I could, given the situation – a fairly undignified procedure that reminded me keenly how all flesh is grass. I wanted something, somewhere, to show that for however brief a period, there was a life here – or at least the potential for it – that no longer is. My husband and I commissioned a small and simple monument that now sits, along with my great-grandmother’s pocket watch, in a curio cabinet hidden in my closet.

 

The Duggars are fame-whores and child-collectors whose activities are damaging to their own children and to the environment in general. Their extremism is a blight. But they're still human and no different on the inside than anyone else, politics notwithstanding.

 

What happened to them could happen to anyone – literally any woman of child-bearing age. It could happen with a first pregnancy, or a second, or a tenth, or a 20th. It's not an imputation of Michelle Duggar's character or the result of negligence on her part, as some have speculated: It's simply a natural event that could befall any woman. Any.

 

For the last several years, the Duggars have been living their lives in the public eye. Their specials garnered so much attention and so many questions that they were offered their own reality TV show – a contract they, with their then-15 kids, would have been crazy not to accept. These contracts entail certain obligations, however: TLC, for example, seems to have had a lot of editorial control for the Joshua Duggar wedding and the resulting Very Special Episode.

 

Michelle Duggar, whose other miscarriage(s) happened much, much earlier in the pregnancy than this one, probably wasn't prepared for what she saw or what she felt or that she would actually need to go through labor to deliver a dead child – but, well, she's a public figure and a part of the TLC machine. I doubt she had a lot of choice, either because of public speculation or because of TLC's meddling, but to do this thing in public too. She asked for privacy. She probably wanted it. She didn’t get it, so she did what she could with what she had.

 

Was it merely pro-life propaganda that drove her and her family to do this? I don't think so. She was traumatized enough by a previous and early miscarriage to foreswear birth control, which she considers an abortifacient, and go on to bear 20 – 20! - children in service to her beliefs. Imagine it – spending more than ten years, altogether, being pregnant; being bulky, retaining water, having to piss every five seconds.

 

The tampon funerals that have been going on around here are great satire – especially for the anti-abortion nuts (who also eschew condoms, because the nuts are also dumb). Where a 16-week loss is concerned, however, it's not really comperable.

[debrand]

I agree that her grief is real but I don't think that TLC is responsible for her family being so public with their suffering.

[Iamthatbean]

Did you read the thread where the woman actually cremated pads from her chemical pregnancy? I think that's more where the tampon funerals are coming from

Edited because I really do know how to spell...

(I blame my bad gallbladder)

[Lainey]

You know, Burris, a few days ago I might have agreed with you. But after the obituary, the funeral, the photos broadcast to the world, the letter to Jubilee from Michelle full of pro-life propaganda about how little "society" views children, and then the re-recording of the letter to shut up the critics who want to know why there wasn't this big production for the first miscarriage--well, I have nothing to say but that they disgust me. It's all just so blatant.

[Alecto]

The difference between you and the Duggars is that you didn't give a people magazine interview at the funeral.

That being said, the tampon funerals have less to do with the Duggars and more to do with another whack-a-doodle who creamated her pad for a chemical pregnancy.

[treemom]

I am allowing her her grief and any other woman theirs. And yes, women are treated callously sometimes in early pregnancy (but I can tell you it happens at late stages too from my own experience.)

I don't even wan to tell her how to grieve. Funeral? Sure. Pictures? Trust me I am comfortable with that. Editing a message you recorded to that baby? Yeah that is beyond me. There was an easy answer to j'cale b and jubilee being treated different. They are different people.

I am pretty comfortable with grief and the many ways it comes out...but there is an unmistakable element of famewhoring going on hear you simply don't see from other people...common or famous.

And all I can think of is poor Anna.

[desertvixen]

I agree that her grief is real, and that nothing she did caused it. (I don't understand having so many children, or getting pregnant again after going through the experience of having Josie, but it is her choice and I respect.)

I also think that they're the ones bringing all this into public, whether they are doing so because TLC is pulling the strings, or because they're trying to use it as anti-choice propaganda. I find the whole re-recording of the letter and the whole Jubilee counts but Caleb does not thing to be disgusting - I think Caleb not counting can be justified, but there should be honesty about it (ie, them saying that their beliefs have evolved, perhaps) - to simply rerecord the letter like no one is going to notice is either a) TLC trying to hang them with their own rope or b) them making a decision that sounds good now without really thinking it all the way through.

ETA: Just read treemom's post and realized mine got a little confused-sounding

[Buzzard]

You know, Burris, a few days ago I might have agreed with you. But after the obituary, the funeral, the photos broadcast to the world, the letter to Jubilee from Michelle full of pro-life propaganda about how little "society" views children, and then the re-recording of the letter to shut up the critics who want to know why there wasn't this big production for the first miscarriage--well, I have nothing to say but that they disgust me. It's all just so blatant.

I agree. When she first miscarried there was no snark. Sure, there were comments that she had better not get pregnant again etc, but there was the sensitivity that her grief was real and that was cool. Its the subsequent actions that are snark worthy. They've taken something that is very real and personal to many people and exploited that pain for profit. Thats disgusting.

[treemom]

I agree that her grief is real, and that nothing she did caused it. (I don't understand having so many children, or getting pregnant again after going through the experience of having Josie, but it is her choice and I respect.)

I also think that they're the ones bringing all this into public, whether they are doing so because TLC is pulling the strings, or because they're trying to use it as anti-choice propaganda. I find the whole re-recording of the letter and the whole Jubilee counts but Caleb does not thing to be disgusting.

I think they could have rationally explained that as when it happened their beliefs weren't as concrete as they are now or that simply this pregnancy felt different. What they did instead just seems to be untruthful.

[desertvixen]

See where I edited my post above.

I'm in agreement with you on the idea that there are ways they could have explained it that would not have seemed... blatantly famewhoring.

[Vex]

What happened to the family is a tragedy. It's always a tragedy when a very much wanted baby never comes to pass. I completely agree that their grief is sincere. They saw it as a baby as real as one that breathed and cried and thought - and why shouldn't they? Most people see a wanted pregnancy as a baby from the moment they find out, which is totally okay and understandable.

What got me was the fact that they're giving Jubilee more attention than their living children, and they're counting her when they didn't count her other miscarriage(s). Was it because she was a later miscarriage? Perhaps. But it still seems highly hypocritical to me.

I understand the obituary. I understand the casket, and the plot, and the funeral. I think the funeral they had, with over 300 people in a mega church, was very tacky. That contributes to my anger. Grinning over the body of your dead daughter/sister as if you were posing at a book signing rubs me the wrong way. I also somehow don't think they were contractually obligated to grant an exclusive graveside interview with People, which again, rubs me the wrong way. I try not to judge the way people grieve. I work with death and the people left behind, and I've seen people honoured after death in many ways.

I agree with some of what Burris wrote. They might have genuinely wanted privacy, weren't given, and chose to handle the media 'graciously' rather than turning them away. They obviously did genuinely feel the loss in a very profound way. That candid shot at the graveside spoke volumes, but I think by now people are too jaded and too disgusted with what they have done wrong to really consider anything they might have done 'right'.

I cannot feel for them like I would anyone else. I think they've been so tacky with this whole thing. I can't get past that word: tacky. It sums up the whole funeral circus to me. I would have wholeheartedly agreed with Burris a few weeks ago, or even if they'd handled this differently.

*edited for riffles

[treemom]

The rerecording of that letter tells me it was record primarily for public consumption, not recorded as a grieving me hanism that was shared publicly.

[Linnea]

The rerecording of that letter tells me it was record primarily for public consumption, not recorded as a grieving me[c]hanism that was shared publicly.

Excellent point.

[bananacat]

If Michelle truly believed that it was a baby and not just a fetus, she wouldn't have been smiling like a maniac at the "funeral". I don't give a flying fuck whether people mourn miscarriages or not. But Michelle wasn't mourning. She was attention-whoring. And yeah, the actual photographs of fetuses don't look as life-like as cartoon drawings. Drawings can't convey the transparent skin and other weird things that make it look unlike an actual baby.

[holierthanyou]

Burris, I'm sorry for your pain and that experience. I don't think most posters meant to come across as judging those who grieve a miscarriage, I think (?) the criticism was more of how it became an intentional media spectacle. Or at least that was how I understood the criticism.

I think it is very sincere and thoughtful for you to personally share your grief with close friends or family, or to have a gathering that provides comfort and meaning for you.

[Queen of Serpents]

If Michelle truly believed that it was a baby and not just a fetus, she wouldn't have been smiling like a maniac at the "funeral". I don't give a flying fuck whether people mourn miscarriages or not. But Michelle wasn't mourning. She was attention-whoring. And yeah, the actual photographs of fetuses don't look as life-like as cartoon drawings. Drawings can't convey the transparent skin and other weird things that make it look unlike an actual baby.

THIS. She has the creepy cult smile and just seems to be milking the limelight.

I was also born at 24wks. I looked weird.

[treemom]

Excellent point.

Thanks for the typo correction :)

[Alana Rickman]

I would believe she actually wanted privacy if she hadn't called People magazine THE SAME DAY she found out her baby had no heartbeat. They went in for a routine ultrasound on December 8, got the bad news, and called People so soon afterwards that the magazine had a full story up on the website by 4:30 that afternoon. Those are not the actions of a woman who wants privacy.

[treemom]

If Michelle truly believed that it was a baby and not just a fetus, she wouldn't have been smiling like a maniac at the "funeral". I don't give a flying fuck whether people mourn miscarriages or not. But Michelle wasn't mourning. She was attention-whoring. And yeah, the actual photographs of fetuses don't look as life-like as cartoon drawings. Drawings can't convey the transparent skin and other weird things that make it look unlike an actual baby.

I am not sure. There is a very awkward picture at my stillborn daughter's funeral where I seem to be full of glee. That bothers me less than the pageantry aspect of the whole thing.

And I admit I am concerned for her mental health and the kids. Grief is a nasty, nasty beast and they are barely in the new stages of it.

[meow139]

I understand that they want to mourn their daughter. But still, this is too much. I could understand maybe one or two magazine interviews a couple days later, a tiny funeral in a small church. But what they are doing isn't mourning. It's exploitation, and it's cruel to the folk who have gone through a miscarriage. You would think she had already been alive for years with all of this. And the letter... just foolish.

[Burris]

I do understand where you're all coming from - now even more so that I've read that tampon lady's fucked up blog. (She's a psychologist? That woman has her head so far uo her own ass that she could tickle her tonsils with her tongue.)

Here's a quote from her blog:

Monday, when I was walking out of church, or perhaps it was last Thursday or Friday, a woman we know pretty well and consider a friend, walked up to me, literally handed me about 4 baby outfits that were pastel in color, and warm fleece. Yes, she literally handed them to me. She put her hand in mine, dropped the clothes hangers, and I literally grabbed them so they wouldn't fall on the floor. Then she let go, so as to have me have to grab them. This wasn't an accident or miscommunication. This was the THIRD time this has happened, and always when I am having a difficult day, right as I got centered and am leaving church. By the third time, I had to ask myself what was going on and what the payoff was for the woman. There's obviously something there- an issue. She would say to me, "Would you mind taking these, please, and giving them to Paul to drop them off at the White Rose for me?" She would let go each time so that they had to literally fall into my hands. That is not normal. The first time I was so shocked, I just stood there in the middle of church with them in my hand, and she was gone pretty quickly. The second time, I was still shocked, and had to ask her to repeat herself. (After all, not only had she presented me with a HUGE trigger, but she placed it in my hand, ON a part of my body. And I know from all my trauma training that the closer in proximity you are to the situation, the more traumatic it is for you.) NOTHING in this world is more traumatic than having your dead baby fall out of you right into the toilet, AND being all alone while this was happening. This is Danny's story, as Paul was stuck at the pharmacy waiting in line for more meds to kill the pain. They took their sweet little time. I still think that if one had a pain killer prescription, they would have moved it a little faster, but no

Wow! Mind. Blown.

Every Thing Is About HER; every little slight is a grevious insult. What the fuck is the MATTER with this moron???

Where Michelle Duggar is concerned, however, I still maintain - it's just my own opinion - that she's pretty much stuck between a rock and a hard place here. It may have been a situation of her own making, what with all the publicity stunts she has pulled over the last few years, but it's still a tight spot and she's wedged into it.

I do think her giving an interview to People is beyond the pale, and I don't understand why she did it, but then I also don't have people e-mailing me every day looking for advice and comfort. I don't have a website with the kind if traffic the Duggars get. It's possible TLC is pushing her. It's even possible she feels obligated to grieve in public, even as she has rejoiced in public.

[treemom]

Burris,

I agree. I think she is stuck between a rock and a hard place. She got herself stuck there...but the truth is they would have been criticized no matter what they did.

I am hoping much of this is bad decisions based on grief and being influenced by people.

[Renting with Raggles]

I don't think they should be criticised for the mega-church funeral, or the display photos, or even the strange grins (they're not professional actors, anyone can make weird faces in response to uncomfortable or emotionally charged situations). I don't doubt they are mourning - some people feel the need for big ceremonies at death.

It was the letter to Jubilee that undermined the sincerity of their grief show for me. Why did Michelle make those pointed little jabs at practically every other mother on the planet, when she was supposedly mourning her daughter? I've never heard someone make evil, petty comparisons like that at anyone's memorial service, regardless of age. How would Michelle like it if someone else eulogised their infant by saying - 'you were going to be born to a mother who actually wanted to interact with you your whole life, not fob you off on an older sister like that horrid Duggar woman'? It was totally inappropriate and unnecessary to insult others in that letter - that showed how much the whole circus was about pro-life propaganda and how little on genuine mourning.

[fundiefan]

I didn't listen to or read the letter and only heard it existed in this thread.

I don't think anyone was making fun of the miscarriage. I think everyone was saddened by it, as much as one can be when someone they don't know has a miscarriage. Many understand the emotion involved, the rest know it's there even if they haven't experienced it.

Snarking or criticizing subsequent actions is not snarking on the miscarriage. However you morn, whatever you do, it's right for you.

The Duggars are an entirely different case though, since they chose to make every aspect of it public. They put it out there for public consumption and with all the 'support' they get by doing so, they know they also get criticism and judgment. They make their choice anyway. They choose publicity.

And the tampon baby snark is unrelated to the Duggars for the most part and the inspiration for that thread is the crazy lady. And, again, no one is snarking on loss. They are snarking on the crazy.

[valsa]

Meh. I'd feel sorry for her if I thought she was actually grieving. She's got a desperate, bordering on pathological, need for attention that this miscarriage fills. As much as it disgusts me to say, she's eating up the attention this miscarriage brings. Also, the Duggars are not some backwoods country folk who are being taken advantage of by TLC. They've always been playing to an agenda and are very shrewd and calculating. If they really wanted privacy, they would have it.