Liar, liar, pants on fire? Atheist Conversion

[HijabiLady]

A guy named Ergun Caner claimed he was from a deeply fundamental Muslim family and raised to be a terrorist. He claimed to convert to Christianity and he even worked as a dean at a Chritian college. His "testimony" was rife with inaccuracies about Islam and his basic understanding of Islam seem to come from a cereal box. A Muslim named Walid Zafar systematically listened to his taped testimonies and youtube videos and dismantled him a piece at a time.

Of course Ergun's defenders were tripping over themselves trying to make excuses and Caner himself went and cleaned up his website to remove those pesky inaccuracies. When his college caught wind of the issues they decided to have an inquest and ask for certain paperwork (Caner was in Canada and Sweden when he was supposedly being trained a terrorist madrasa). It became VERY clear that this guy was blantantly lying about his upbringing and background. Seems his father was a Muslim but secular and not very religious, his mother was Christian who was of the same leaning as well. He was raised as your average Western kid and made up almost 90% of his testimony. Even the guys Arabic sucked.

For your viewing pleasure

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/walid-zaf ... 82225.html

[Beb]

My neighbors often tell me a story that a special forces member gave to their church. I've always sort of doubted the story but, I admit, I might be wrong. Apparently, this guy was having doubts about all the violent things that he had to do as a soldier. He couldn't make some of his actions line up with his faith and yet, he needed to do certain things to succeed. Anyway, he prayed and prayed for faith.

One day he went on a mission and saved some hostages from the Iraqis. When he saved one of the people, he said, "We love you and God does too." At that moment, he knew why he was supposed to be in the special forces.

I have no idea if the man is really special forces. To be honest, I've never really met him but I've heard his story so many times from my nieghbors that I can quote it word for word.

My neighbors can't answer why the man was allowed by the military to tell that story but couldn't give names. That stikes me as odd. Why tell the story at all? It is the type of story no one can verify and that makes me suspicious. I am always suspicious of people who claim their work is secretive because if it is secretive why are you telling me it is secretive? Just shut up and don't say anything.

This great Christian also told his wife of many years to get out of his house because he was divorcing her.

He could be violating The Stolen Valor Act.

http://www.wired.com/threatlevel/2011/1 ... eme-court/

An elderly gentleman in the area where I live made all sorts of claims of valor during WWII; he even spoke over the years to schools and groups in the area and even traveled to tell his stories. His fame preceded him (locally, anyway). He had medals, BUT when it was investigated last year, it turns out he had no official citations. Of course, the man had intricate explanations as to why. Turns out, though, it was all a lie, but I'm not sure what action was taken, apart from being very publicly outed in newspapers, etc.

From what I've read, there is currently a rash of this type thing going on in the U.S.

[apple1]

A guy named Ergun Caner claimed he was from a deeply fundamental Muslim family and raised to be a terrorist. He claimed to convert to Christianity and he even worked as a dean at a Chritian college. His "testimony" was rife with inaccuracies about Islam and his basic understanding of Islam seem to come from a cereal box. A Muslim named Walid Zafar systematically listened to his taped testimonies and youtube videos and dismantled him a piece at a time.

Of course Ergun's defenders were tripping over themselves trying to make excuses and Caner himself went and cleaned up his website to remove those pesky inaccuracies. When his college caught wind of the issues they decided to have an inquest and ask for certain paperwork (Caner was in Canada and Sweden when he was supposedly being trained a terrorist madrasa). It became VERY clear that this guy was blantantly lying about his upbringing and background. Seems his father was a Muslim but secular and not very religious, his mother was Christian who was of the same leaning as well. He was raised as your average Western kid and made up almost 90% of his testimony. Even the guys Arabic sucked.

For your viewing pleasure

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/walid-zaf ... 82225.html

Liberty University's response to all this was way too slow, but at least it did happen. First he was demoted, then forced out entirely. Unfortunately, another church-related "college" (of miniscule size, if I understand correctly) has now hired him as their "provost".

[Boltingmadonna]

I never believe anyone was in the Special Forces unless I have some external evidence that it's true. It's one of the more common crackpot claims that people use to get attention. I've heard a lot of "testimonies" in my day and learned to take them with a grain of salt as well. When someone like Kirk Cameron says he went through an atheist phase it just makes me laugh. "Aw! Did widdle baby Kirk forget to say his prayers for a week when he was 12?" Those people haven't had a big enough life to have room for anything to testify about.

It still boggles my mind how much religious people lie. I still watch EWTN, the crackpot Catholic channel, occasionally for the LOLs. Last week, an obnoxious woman named Barbara McGuigan cited the infamous McMartin day care prosecution as an example of actual, real Satanists in action. (This case ended with no convictions after years of mismanaged prosecution. It started with an accusation by a mentally ill woman that someone there had raped her child, which heaven knows is horrible, but in this case it turned out to be unfounded as far as anyone could tell. Poorly done questioning of the children led to pre-schoolers supposedly testifying that day care owners flew in the air, took them through tunnels, sacrificed babies, etc. etc. No evidence for these things was ever found, and children later recanted their testimony and said they'd only been saying what they thought the adults wanted to hear. This case is actually notorious as an example of "Satanic panic" and how NOT to pursue an investigation.) Anyway, McGuigan claimed this proved that actually Satanists are stealing our children and performing human sacrifices.

Later in the show, she claimed Wicca and Satanism were the same, then that abortion was a form of human sacrifice and was Satanic. She also said that the Virgin of Guadalupe appeared while the Aztecs were still performing human sacrifices (not true) and that her message was that they should stop doing that. (Also not true and never claimed by the Catholic church.) Two priests were with her on the show, and they were clearly aware she was lying. They shifted uncomfortably in their chairs and said stuff like "well . . . not exactly . . ." but they never stopped her and said what she was saying was just not so. They went along with it because it's good propaganda. My jaw was on the floor.

[apple1]

Ok....now, if the bitch witnessed human sacrifice of an infant, she has witnessed a crime. Shouldn't she be interrogated for something like that?

Yes. (That she apparently has not been, says that the tale is not credible).

[browngrl]

Chris Jeub must read here. Here is a quote from his latest post: jeubfamily.com/2011/11/25/together-encountering-christ/

"Want to know something funny? I was an atheist when I flipped that car and almost died. I was knotted up, angry, a typical “I know what life’s all about†kind of teenager. I figured life was much simpler than it really was, that my purpose was just as miserable as my understanding of life. Life was empty, God wasn’t real, and my life was what it was. Period. End of story."

not a very imaginative lot these fundies - it seems that the only spice for most of their "testimonials" is atheism

[browncoatslytherin]

"Aw! Did widdle baby Kirk forget to say his prayers for a week when he was 12?"

HAHAHA i thought this smiley was appropriate --> :liar:

[emmiedahl]

The Cameron family is very fundie. I remember reading about their faith in the early nineties--their lifelong faith that they had to work so hard to keep in the midst of Hollywood, etc. Yeah, if Kirk was an atheist, it lasted about two minutes.

[Patsy]

If you feel anger, you have committed murder in your heart. Sure, they're full of shit and making stuff up, but if at any point they weren't as crazy fundie as now, then they were atheists in their hearts. :roll: Really, hearing some of their definitions of 'Satanism' and 'atheism' and so on, I think that mightn't be too far from their reasoning.

[darareaksmey]

I never believe anyone was in the Special Forces unless I have some external evidence that it's true. It's one of the more common crackpot claims that people use to get attention. I've heard a lot of "testimonies" in my day and learned to take them with a grain of salt as well. When someone like Kirk Cameron says he went through an atheist phase it just makes me laugh. "Aw! Did widdle baby Kirk forget to say his prayers for a week when he was 12?" Those people haven't had a big enough life to have room for anything to testify about.

It still boggles my mind how much religious people lie. I still watch EWTN, the crackpot Catholic channel, occasionally for the LOLs. Last week, an obnoxious woman named Barbara McGuigan cited the infamous McMartin day care prosecution as an example of actual, real Satanists in action. (This case ended with no convictions after years of mismanaged prosecution. It started with an accusation by a mentally ill woman that someone there had raped her child, which heaven knows is horrible, but in this case it turned out to be unfounded as far as anyone could tell. Poorly done questioning of the children led to pre-schoolers supposedly testifying that day care owners flew in the air, took them through tunnels, sacrificed babies, etc. etc. No evidence for these things was ever found, and children later recanted their testimony and said they'd only been saying what they thought the adults wanted to hear. This case is actually notorious as an example of "Satanic panic" and how NOT to pursue an investigation.) Anyway, McGuigan claimed this proved that actually Satanists are stealing our children and performing human sacrifices.

Later in the show, she claimed Wicca and Satanism were the same, then that abortion was a form of human sacrifice and was Satanic. She also said that the Virgin of Guadalupe appeared while the Aztecs were still performing human sacrifices (not true) and that her message was that they should stop doing that. (Also not true and never claimed by the Catholic church.) Two priests were with her on the show, and they were clearly aware she was lying. They shifted uncomfortably in their chairs and said stuff like "well . . . not exactly . . ." but they never stopped her and said what she was saying was just not so. They went along with it because it's good propaganda. My jaw was on the floor.

I cannot bear more than 30 seconds of Barbara McGuigan without wanting to punch someone. She will lie and lie and exaggerate and exaggerate in that grandmotherly, soothing voice of hers. She is Joseph McCarthy in a skirt and sensible shoes.

[bea]

My favorite "used-to-be" who turned out to be nothing of the sort is Mike Warnke, who claimed to be a Satanic High Priest who dealt drugs and hung out with Charles Manson before he saw the light and became a Chrisitian. Cornerstone did the expose on him; seems to have had no effect on his ministry.

I have to find the series Cornerstone did on him - fascinating reading.