Another questionable adoption blog-SHE FOUND US UPDATE

[Guest Anonymous]

We hurt her little feelings, bless her heart.

I actually wasn't all that concerned about the adopted kids in this particular family until nice hubby referred to them as 'strangers'.... :roll:

[Koala]

Does she really need his help? Pathetic.

Pathetic indeed. 3 posts of her own, and she still hasn't gotten her point across? :roll: I guess it's time to pull out the big guns now.

Thanks for coming out to play Mr. Mom, but maybe you should be doing other things...like getting to know the little "strangers" that you were generous enough to adopt. :shock:

[Koala]

ps. If you are hitting kids, it's abusive. Are there some degrees of abuse that are worse than others? Absolutely! Are all forms of hitting abuse? Absolutely. Even if you give it a special name like "spanking".

[Guest Anonymous]

About 1% of men actually read a book after graduating college. So they are educated?

Hi, douchenozzle. All of my friends read books - women and men. For education, and for fun! What kind of backward morons are you hanging around with that 99% of them don't?

And that "strangers" thing - holy shit! Way to make it obvious that you don't consider those poor kids your own. The more fundies try to defend themselves, the more clearly their asshattery is revealed.

[polabear]

I don't know what ages they adopted their ethiopian kids at. But, there are massive problems with corruption in ethiopian adoptions at all levels. It's even worse with smaller kids - a lot of parents and relatives have given kids up to orphanages, with the understanding that they were just being sent to the US to be educated, and would then be returned. Babies have been outright bought or taken under false pretenses. On top of that, a lot of families would be able to keep their kids with only a little bit of support - but instead westerners are spending tens of thousands of dollars to adopt kids. There is a big waiting list to adopt a child under 5 from Ethiopia. There's a waiting list to adopt a child with minor medical needs, including AIDS, from Ethiopia. The kids that are languishing in orphanages are the older kids and kids in larger sibling groups.

To switch subjects, I have a college degree in Political Science. I do not work in Politics. But, I wouldn't have my job without a college degree.

[LilMissMetaphor]

I don't know what ages they adopted their ethiopian kids at.

They don't know either. But, apparently God told the Embassy doctor how old they were.

When they were officially referred to us about two weeks later (Aug 4), we were told they were 5, 6 and 7 years old. After measuring them and comparing their heights with our kids here, we decided they were 6, 7 and 9.

...Today I got an email from the agency saying that the girls had had their medical exams by the Embassy doctor and the doctor had determined that the girls are actually 7, 8 and 11!

If we had started out with these girls in mind for our home study, we may have only had the oldest age listed as 10 thinking surely she's not more than 3 years older than what she came in as.

God totally knew that we needed to have that age on our home study! Isn't that awesome!?!!

[Arielkay]

What annoys me is that he cherry-picked from what was actually a very nice response by Sola, as follows:

Another FJ'er here. As I posted on the board, I don't think you're that bad. OK you probably don't even want my stamp of approval!

FJ aren't all that bad. Yes we do snark, but the people we snark about are the people who harm, and promote harm. I don't see a problem with that.

We snark about the people who advocate beating 4 month old babies with plumbing lines, who lie, who would take away the rights of others, who viciously hate those who live a different life to themselves. Again, I don't see a problem with that.

Now if you want to be snarked about by FJ, here are some tips;

Beat your babies into submission.

Prevent your daughters from pursuing higher education.

Call for enforced birth in all situations.

Shout to the world that gay people should be stoned (and not in the mind bending drugs way of stoned either).

Have a zillion kids you can't provide for and house them on shelving or on urine soaked sheets on top of bare mattresses

Do that and we'll reserve the right to snark on you.

We don't snark on people just because they adopt and/or have huge families. My 'quiver' was full at two kids, not through choice either. Some other FJ'ers have a houseful of kids.

But what we all agree on is that ALL kids should be provided for, fed, educated and loved properly. You seem to be doing OK with that, judging by the pics of your lovely daughters.

He takes the middle part out, and disregards the rest of what she says. I bolded what he should have taken from the message - that she DIDN'T seem to meet that criteria. And yeah, people had different opinions, but most of them - before that letter anyway, were supportive of her. Jeeeez. Now I just find her a speshul snowflake and freaking irritating. And that bit about how she homeschools because she actually loves and likes her kids. WTF. I love and like my kids too but I have to work because my husband's income doesn't cover it all, AND because I like working and being an example to my daughters that women can be professionals as well as homemakers - that both are worthwhile. Also, I don't feel like I can teach every single subject as well as many different professionally trained teachers could. Honestly.

[emmiedahl]

The age thing does not phase me at all. I have several friends who were given children who were older than the agency claimed. The one closest to me adopted a "nine" year old boy who insisted he was twelve. The pediatrician also thought he was more likely to be twelve. People want younger children, the younger the better, and foreign adoption programs know that.

[Dev83]

I don't know what ages they adopted their ethiopian kids at. But, there are massive problems with corruption in ethiopian adoptions at all levels. It's even worse with smaller kids - a lot of parents and relatives have given kids up to orphanages, with the understanding that they were just being sent to the US to be educated, and would then be returned. Babies have been outright bought or taken under false pretenses. On top of that, a lot of families would be able to keep their kids with only a little bit of support - but instead westerners are spending tens of thousands of dollars to adopt kids. There is a big waiting list to adopt a child under 5 from Ethiopia. There's a waiting list to adopt a child with minor medical needs, including AIDS, from Ethiopia. The kids that are languishing in orphanages are the older kids and kids in larger sibling groups.

To switch subjects, I have a college degree in Political Science. I do not work in Politics. But, I wouldn't have my job without a college degree.

I think the fact that a liberal arts education is not intended to be career training is lost on fundies. Sure, many people do use their liberal arts Bachelor's in their field, but most people do not. A BA or BS is, in many cases, education for the sake of education. Completion of the degree tells employers that you are educated, but also that you are diligent and capable of completing what you start. I have a degree in sociology, but I do not work in that feild at all. Yet a college degree has been immensly beneficial in my career.

[slickcat79]

LOL, we'll totally support our kids' choices in what they want to do with their lives...but we really, really hope they don't want to go to college. Do you know these imaginary "stats" about how expensive and useless that shit is? In the meantime, we will subtly (or not-so-subtly) encourage our children to do something in life that doesn't require higher education.

I can be added to the list of people whose job is not directly related to their field of study. But my degree certainly helped me secure my job in the first place, and gave me justification to demand the highest pay grade that they were offering for that position at the time. If I'd been making 25-30% less, I don't know that I could have afforded to live on my own, buy a car, establish short-term savings, save for retirement or a number of other things that I've been able to do in the last 4 years. And hey, that difference in pay has more than covered the cost of my college education since I graduated :dance:

[Katiebug]

Did you all see her post about how those with no kids or only a few are apparently made miserable by their children?

Anyone asking that question in that way obviously views children differently than we do.

And I actually understand. When we were first married, I didn't want any kids, EVER! The kids I saw at restaurants or anywhere were noisy, disobedient, whiny and unruly. And when we were first married, there was a member of our family rebelling against her parents and breaking their hearts. My thought was, "Why in the world would I want to spend all those years taking care of some kid who's going to put me through that?"

I also understand those who have kids who are exhausted by them and who look at me and say, "I don't know how you do it? I can barely deal with the two I have!"

I get that.

If our kids made our lives miserable, we wouldn't want any more either.

But you see, we enjoy our children. We don't just love them, we like them. We have invested loads of love, time and energy into teaching them how to be kind and unselfish, how to love others and how to honor us and God. They are by no means perfect. But they are a blessing to us!

So if these people who think we're wacko for wanting more kids had kids in their lives who brought as much love and fun and enjoyment as ours, they wouldn't think we're so wacko!

I know for some the thought of more kids only gives them visions of financial strain. "How can we afford them?" they ask. For us, we've always trusted God to take care of us financially and He has. This year Roddy made 50% more than he did last year. I choose to believe God blessed us for our obedience. We've never had to live off of handouts or the government or family.

We are more blessed than we deserve, that's for sure. And I don't just mean financially.

Behold, children are a heritage from the LORD,

the fruit of the womb a reward.

Like arrows in the hand of a warrior

are the children of one's youth.

Blessed is the man

who fills his quiver with them!

He shall not be put to shame

when he speaks with his enemies in the gate.

Another question I hope to answer soon is how we are able to spend enough quality time with each of the children when we have so many.

I find "If our kids made our lives miserable, we wouldn't want any more either. But you see, we enjoy our children." to be an incredibly holier-than-thou statement.

I do enjoy our child. I enjoy being her mother more than anything in the world. We are incredibly blessed and fortunate to have a healthy, sweet little girl who is (in my not-so-humble opinion) the best kid a mom could ever hope for. That doesn't mean that I don't sometimes find it exhausting to chase after a 17 month old! This chick can take a long walk off a short pier for shaming parents who do find it exhausting at times. That's exactly what she's doing by saying "I get that" about the exhausted mom of two, and then the next sentence is her BS about how they actually like their kids. You know, as opposed to those of us in the mainstream who apparently just don't like our kids very much and therefore aren't inclined to have a family large enough to field our own soccer team. :roll:

And she's yet another fundie mother who insists that finances shouldn't come into play when determining family size. Don't even get me started on that one...

[simplysweet]

Don't you just love it when the menfolk get on their high horses and take up for their delicate little flower brides?

She's a freaking adult. Why can't she answer for herself or if she doesn't want to, just ignore. Does she really need his help? Pathetic.

By the way, I don't even know who this is. . . I just popped onto the last page of this topic and saw yet another headship acting up.

I got on her blog long enough to see her husband "jacked it" so I left...........blogging is best left to the wimmin. You just come across as a controlling asshat.

I do love that FJ is considered a "feminist" blog........ Really?

[Boogalou]

Stalk: to read and comment upon a publicly viewable blog. HOLD ON! That's not what that word means. Stalk: to pursue obsessively and to the point of harassment. I don't think that really applies here.

To the blog writers: if you are reading here stop making blog posts about us and we will stop stalking discussing you. It's not really a difficult concept.

[MonkeyMomma]

Hi, douchenozzle. All of my friends read books - women and men. For education, and for fun! What kind of backward morons are you hanging around with that 99% of them don't?

And that "strangers" thing - holy shit! Way to make it obvious that you don't consider those poor kids your own. The more fundies try to defend themselves, the more clearly their asshattery is revealed.

THANK YOU. All the college-eduated men I know read books all the damn time. In fact, all the men I know who haven't gone to or completed college ALSO enjoy reading. The fuck?

Ditto on the strangers thing. They're your children now, dude.

[emmiedahl]

My husband hates to read books, for the most part. He was assigned the most boring stuff possible in school. But he will still read a book occasionally because he wants the information inside it: books on fixing things, or a book written by his favorite comedian.

I would consider my husband to be at the extreme end of the spectrum when it comes to disliking reading, and he still reads occasionally. I wonder where this guy got his figures.

[booksnbeats]

Some people just don't want to be parents, or don't want to have "a million" kids. Leave us alone, lady.

My husband hates to read books, for the most part. He was assigned the most boring stuff possible in school. But he will still read a book occasionally because he wants the information inside it: books on fixing things, or a book written by his favorite comedian.

I would consider my husband to be at the extreme end of the spectrum when it comes to disliking reading, and he still reads occasionally. I wonder where this guy got his figures.

But does he read stuff online?

[formergothardite]

My kids don't make my life miserable and I really love being around them. But having another child wouldn't be good for our family and I love my girls more than my desire for another baby. If you put your desire for more children above the needs of the children you already have, then you are selfish.

[polabear]

I dated a guy who graduated from college, but didn't really read books. I'm not sure he had a book in his apartment. Completely freaked me out. But I'm sure that even if he had been home schooled, he still wouldn't read. It just wasn't something that interested him.

My husband reads, but he doesn't read a ton every day. On the train, he talks to people. (SO WEIRD. He just took a flight and met a minor radio personality. Who talks to people on flights? :)) He typically conks out as soon as he gets into bed, unlike me, who reads for an hour or more. But, he'll read while we eat, or in bits.

[Witsec1]

I commented in response to another commenter who got the impression we were accusing the Wagners of doing all those things on the list when the plain sense of Sola's post was exactly the opposite. We'll see if they approve the comment, if they don't then I'll conclude they care more about appearing like martyrs than they do about truthfulness.

swright, it's unfortunate you got the impression that the Wagners are being accused of these things. Here is the full comment, which is quoted out of context in this post:

Another FJ'er here. As I posted on the board, I don't think you're that bad. OK you probably don't even want my stamp of approval!

FJ aren't all that bad. Yes we do snark, but the people we snark about are the people who harm, and promote harm. I don't see a problem with that.

We snark about the people who advocate beating 4 month old babies with plumbing lines, who lie, who would take away the rights of others, who viciously hate those who live a different life to themselves. Again, I don't see a problem with that.

Now if you want to be snarked about by FJ, here are some tips;

Beat your babies into submission.

Prevent your daughters from pursuing higher education.

Call for enforced birth in all situations.

Shout to the world that gay people should be stoned (and not in the mind bending drugs way of stoned either).

Have a zillion kids you can't provide for and house them on shelving or on urine soaked sheets on top of bare mattresses

Do that and we'll reserve the right to snark on you.

We don't snark on people just because they adopt and/or have huge families. My 'quiver' was full at two kids, not through choice either. Some other FJ'ers have a houseful of kids.

But what we all agree on is that ALL kids should be provided for, fed, educated and loved properly. You seem to be doing OK with that, judging by the pics of your lovely daughter.</b>

Of course, FJ is a forum with many differing viewpoints. If you actually read what most people commented in the initial thread, most people disagreed that there was anything of concern portrayed in your blog. You may have opinions about people who spend time our time discussing other people's blogs, and that's your right. But overall, people were not equating the Wagners with the people who do the things outlined by Sola in her comment.

Right now people are snarking a bit at the overreaction of this post, and the recent post where you accuse people with small families of not loving their kids as much as you do. That rises to snarkworthy, IMO. I have one kid, and I love her to pieces and enjoy her company. I admire adoptive parents who really love their adoptive kids, as you seem to do. I don't agree with some of the books and Christian lifestyle gurus you promote, but as Sola said, you are adults and don't need anyone's seal of approval.

[divadivine]

They are the ones who put themselves out on the internet. Everyone will not agree with everything you post. This is life. That is how things happen in real life. Some people will like you and some people won't. Whining about people who don't agree with everything you say/do/believe is annoying and makes people who already don't like you, like you even less. If I complained about all the people who didn't agree with me, I'd never get anything done, except for complaining. When you put yourself out on the internet, you either need to take a big girl/boy pill, pull on the big girl/boy panties and suck it up or make your blog accessible to only your family and friends. Otherwise, you can't complain when people disagree with you and point it out.

[The Archivist]

I love it when people's feelings get hurt on the internet and they call in their husbands to defend them.

STFU and GTFO already. It's the internet.

[Morton Fan]

Ugh! I know it's already been said, but the 'strangers' thing makes me livid! Aren't ALL children strangers until they are born or adopted?

(Also, hi everyone! Not really my first post, but my first since the new board. I had two babies since the switch, and time on the computer drastically reduced! :))

[emmiedahl]

But does he read stuff online?

Not as much as I do, but he does indeed read online. Mostly news and weather.

He will talk to random people, like another poster reported about their own husband. He comes off the bus every day with a new story. He especially likes homeless, mentally ill people. Not even in a snarky way, he is really interested in their version of reality. And the city bus is the perfect place to meet them!

I agree with whoever said that all children are strangers when they come into your home. If you want to put it that way. From what I have seen, adopting an older child from another country puts your family into instant-crisis-mode, which you need to be prepared for. But it is not your new child's fault, they are the victim. As their parent, you are supposed to make it all better for them.

[Milly-Molly-Mandy]

He changed it from strangers to girls

Re college-my brothers 1st degree he does not use, however he wouldn't have got his job as a lawyer for the dept of finance for our fed govt without his politics/economics degree

And without my degree i would not be an RN and earn what I do

Oh-all the guys in my family and the guys I've dated and know (bar one who is an ignorant wanker) read

[breaker]

I commented in response to another commenter who got the impression we were accusing the Wagners of doing all those things on the list when the plain sense of Sola's post was exactly the opposite. We'll see if they approve the comment, if they don't then I'll conclude they care more about appearing like martyrs than they do about truthfulness.

Well they've approved a bunch of other comments since then but not yours, so one can only assume it's the former. Context be darned, they've got a point to make.