Anderson Cooper Rocks/Pearls=Another Death (MERGED)

[synchroswimr]

You should see some of the crazies on other forums. i ran into some on free jinger and I went a couple rounds with some Christian stalkers who think spanking is vile and evil. See

He "ran into?" good grief. You came here and sought us out. :roll

[Austin]

Biting was a serious issue in my 2 year old class when I was a preschool teacher. Two year olds get frustrated and have no power to change a situation or even words to express themselves. We simply removed the biter from the situation immediately and lavished sympathetic attention on the victim. We told the biter, "Use your words. If she takes your toy, tell her that you don't like that." I don't know if this worked so well in a group of 12; it seemed like as soon as one stopped biting, another would start. :) But we kept it under control.

One of our twins occasionally bit the other when they were around that age. I agree that it is frustration that drives them to it, as they are not completely verbal yet and the frustration overtakes them. Removing the biter from the situation and giving the victim some sympathy worked well. I also found that this particular child tended to bite (not that he did it that often, but it was more than once or twice) when he was very tired and he just needed a firm admonition and then some quiet time when he would usually fall asleep straightaway.

[Austin]

He "ran into?" good grief. You came here and sought us out. :roll

Sort of O/T, but I was a huge Six Feet Under fan and there was an episode where one guy (Keith) from the gay couple (David & Keith) was hired as a body guard for a famous female star and he ended up sleeping with her. So he comes home and confesses to David that he slept with her and the conversation went something like this:

David: What do you mean, you slept with her??!!

Keith: I swear, it was an accident!

David: What? Did you trip and accidentally fall into her vagina??

I know, I'm easily amused, but that scene always makes me giggle and this jackass' claim to have "run into" us reminds me of it.

[Brainsample]

I have heard the same story, but I have heard of kids who did not stop biting because they were bitten back. In fact, I know of a CPS case that occurred because a mom was biting her toddler back. The kid was covered in bite marks because it kept happening.

Biting was a serious issue in my 2 year old class when I was a preschool teacher. Two year olds get frustrated and have no power to change a situation or even words to express themselves. We simply removed the biter from the situation immediately and lavished sympathetic attention on the victim. We told the biter, "Use your words. If she takes your toy, tell her that you don't like that." I don't know if this worked so well in a group of 12; it seemed like as soon as one stopped biting, another would start. :) But we kept it under control.

eta: most toddler issues can be dealt with by understanding what motivates the bad behavior and then working to a, remove the motivater and b, give the child other ways of dealing with the issue. I don't think a very small child is capable of making moral decisions, so I would not bring the issue of right and wrong into the picture.

My 1 yo bites occasionally simply because he is putting everything in his mouth and there happen to be teeth there. I just tell him no biting and then move on.

My mother said that I bit her once and only once, and I never bit another person after that. But she told me years later that I bit her while she was trying to force me to take a medication when I was probably about 3 years old. She said she wouldn't let me out of bed until I took the medicine, so she sat on the floor, figuring that it wouldn't last long. She said she sat on the floor all night. When she decided to force it on me, I bit her. And she bit me back. (She was still angry at me about it, the last time it was mentioned when I was an adult, though I have no memory of it, and I think that given the circumstances, it was actually a healthy thing to do. "No one should put something in your mouth if you don't want it" is a pretty healthy concept in later life, an healthy boundary.)

What are you going to do? She was a victim of doing what she was told at all costs, now 70 years old and from a couple of generations ago. She could have called the doctor for an alternative, not realizing that a therapy is ineffective if you can't follow it.

It just pops into my head when I hear this hair pulling and biting discussion.

[emmiedahl]

I was not picking on your mother. My mother did the same thing to my younger brother when he bit, because the wisdom of the time was that this was how you deal with a toddler.

[Austin]

Me, neither, Brain. I heard a lot of parents say that, especially when I was younger.

[Brainsample]

I was not picking on your mother. My mother did the same thing to my younger brother when he bit, because the wisdom of the time was that this was how you deal with a toddler.

I didn't think you were "picking" at all. She was a new mom, very stressed, and it was a different era. I wouldn't have brought it up if it were a troubling thing.

I think the hook for me is that if anything sets me off with kids, it's the spitting and biting stuff. I get a little irrational with that, and then it becomes an infection control issue, too. In this discussion about aggressive discipline, that is the one thing that I think might send me over the edge into overkill. With the discussion of breastfeeding and biting, that comes to mind.

Nobody gets it all right anyway...

[emmiedahl]

I have never had a spitter. That would gross me out, I'm glad I have never had to deal with that!

No one gets it all right, this is true.

[Bella99]

I have never had a spitter. That would gross me out, I'm glad I have never had to deal with that!

No one gets it all right, this is true.

I tell my fellow "parents in arms" that the jury is out until the kids are 40! Keep loving them and most turn out fine. ;)

[Austin]

I tell my fellow "parents in arms" that the jury is out until the kids are 40! Keep loving them and most turn out fine. ;)

So true. My friends and I decided recently that we all do it right and we all do it wrong. It's too complicated and too protracted of a "task" for anyone to get it all right. :D

[notsocommon]

If you are a Christian, then you would agree that it is God who gives wisdom. A man who has devoted his life to helping others, who loves the Lord, has raised 5 healthy children, is more qualified than some secular humanist with a degree and an atheistic worldview.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

As a Christian, I could not disagree with this more. Anyone can claim "God's word" and twist and pervert the Bible to support just about any 'teaching' they want. Just because someone can say something then throw a Bible verse at it does not make it 'Godly' or 'Biblical.'

I'll take a well taught and researched/studied child development theory over some backasswards country bumpkin's hair brained idea, any day.

[jenny_islander]

Of course I agree that God gives wisdom. How does raising healthy children prove that a man is wise? A dog can do as much. And while Pearl may think he is helping others, others are free to disagree. He says that the best way to help a certain group of people involves inflicting physical pain until they send an acceptable signal to stop. When two adults do this, having agreed beforehand on the signal, it's just a consensual kink. When an adult does it to a child . . . not so much.

[notsocommon]

It just disgusts me that people try to pull the "Godly Christian" card. In fundie (even fundie light and more liberal circles) questioning and calling out so-called Christian leaders/teachers is just not done.

I am often amazed by the bull people buy just because someone can throw a Bible verse at their twarped ideas. Just look at Pearl. The Bible says to use the rod and Pearl adds all kinds of sick, sadistic stuff....but it is BIBLICAL because he quotes the Bible!! Nevermind that the Bible NEVER advocates beating kids. The rod does not mean what they think it means.

The fundies we snark on do it to girls and women. They take a few verses and go light years beyond the meaning of those verses and call their teachings 'Biblical.' It is so bad that they have to shoe horn their teachings into the stories of women like Deborah, the P31 woman and the NT women. They all really were submissive little lambs (except Deborah who was a judgement!) who served their husbands at home....pay no attention th what is actually said!

It is all man-made bullshit and not God honorng at all....but people buy into it.

[apple1]

It just pops into my head when I hear this hair pulling and biting discussion.

(My breastfed kids are adults now). Breastfeeding and biting- Gah! Unlatch the kid (every BFing mom should know how to unlatch), put child down, put breast back inside mom's clothing. done.

No reward for the undesirable behavior. Kid stops biting. Done.

[jenny_islander]

I had one who would clench her jaw very tightly just as she dropped off to sleep. I learned to recognize the chin wobble that preceded this and unlatch her rapidly but gently. No hair pulling needed.