Jump to content
IGNORED

Our Stories (why we snark)


Olive Plant

Recommended Posts

I snark because I have a fascination with cults. These "super Christians" as I like to call them, certainly feel like cults to me. In fact, most of the evangelical churches feel like cults to me. One of them called The Bridge holds services at my kids' school, which makes me crazy. They are constantly "forgetting" to put away their literature and notices, so that the kids are being exposed to their message in a public school setting.

I was Catholic until 4th grade, and then my Mom got sick of the treatment of women in the Catholic church (plus I had a nun for CCD who liked to hit and humiliate kids in the class). She joined a very liberal UCC congregation. A congregation that was one of the first ones in Massachusetts to vote to hold gay marriage ceremonies in the church, a movement that was passed by 96% of the congregation. If I was religious, this would be the church that I would want to be part of. My Dad went on a religious pilgrimage of sorts, trying out all brands- but it turns out that he's too self-centered to be a Jehovah's Witness, likes caffeine and R rated humor too much to be a Mormon, and refuses to proselytize which puts him out of the running for most other churches. 10 years after my Mom joined the UCC church, my Dad followed her there.

I've become pretty much an atheist. This life is the only one I have, so I might as well make the best of it. I have no desire to spend an eternity in a sexless, ever lasting church service (which is pretty much how I expect a Christian Heaven would work). My husband is a non-practicing Catholic who was pretty scarred by his religious upbringing. He still believes in the Catholic mythologies, but has no desire to expose our children to them, considering how much of a mindfuck it was to him.

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Interesting topic. I snark because it makes me feel better. It's a safe place to get out my gut feelings, even if people don't like me :)

I was raised in a fundie-lite home. Both my parents worked but we were still expected to be a good christian family. My mother did all the cleaning, my father did all the bitching. We went to public schools (the best our city had to offer) and hung out with our friends on weekends. However, I am gay and thus didn't fit well with the ideology of the church. I was raped at 13 and I think that's when I lost all respect for my father. He told me the rape was my fault because one of my attackers, 2 guys at church I'd grown up to respect, at the time, told him I enjoyed it because I had an erection. I came out as gay a year or so later to my friends, and it got back to my family. My father tried beating it out of me, having the elders of church lay hands to pray it out of me, using "reeducation" techniques, blaming my mother for "babying" me... all to no avail, I'm still gay. At 17 they kicked me out. That was almost a decade ago and I'm now happy in a gay relationship with an awesome guy who loves me and respects me. We are getting ready to start a family and I just can't imagine doing what was done to me to my children.

I snark because what these people are doing and then claiming is Christian is wrong. I snark because these people have taken something beautiful (love and marriage, a family, life) and perverted it into something that no one in their right mind who agree to.

  • Thank You 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think my reasons have evolved. At first, it was just a fascination with how these uber-Christians behaved (not so Christian) and relating that back to my own fundie-lite upbringing and adult life. There's still some of that, but now I think it's more that I see religion as such a damaging force. I hate what it does to people, how it kicks them around and drags them down.

I hate that one of my sons feels guilty for "sexual sin" when in reality, he's just a normal adolescent, who still happens to be a virgin. I hate that his 18-y-o girlfriend from a Baptist family feels like a "slut" (her words) because she slept with one boy who she was dating exclusively last year and it weighs on her so heavily, it makes me tear up to think about it. I hate that women are thought of as less than, no matter how everybody tries to pretty up or switch around the words, even the egalitarian Christians. I hate the boxes that it puts people in who live their whole lives never feeling like they can explore their potential, or even knowing they have more potential.

I am ashamed of the role I played in Christian-land until recent years, and while I never bought into the lies about "teh ebil gayz" or "men lead better because they have penises" crap, I bought into it enough to stay in it, even if just on the margins, for years. I want people to know that you can be a moral, caring person without religion, that no magic formula is able to produce the life you want for yourself, and that basically, the universe is indifferent (as Don Draper would say). I want them to know that we are guaranteed* just this one go-around and to embrace their potential and the people they love and just *live*.

I want to be one person who stands up with many, many other people to say "NO!" to the influence of religion on USA society, in our public squares, and in our public leaders.

So while the snark is part of it, more than anything, I want the leaders of these religions exposed for the hucksters they really are.

ETA: * I say "guaranteed" despite knowing that many believe in heaven or an afterlife of some sort. I don't know what I believe about that, but I do know that none of us really *knows*. There is faith, but faith is not fact.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I think my reasons have evolved. At first, it was just a fascination with how these uber-Christians behaved (not so Christian) and relating that back to my own fundie-lite upbringing and adult life. There's still some of that, but now I think it's more that I see religion as such a damaging force. I hate what it does to people, how it kicks them around and drags them down.

I hate that one of my sons feels guilty for "sexual sin" when in reality, he's just a normal adolescent, who still happens to be a virgin. I hate that his 18-y-o girlfriend from a Baptist family feels like a "slut" (her words) because she slept with one boy who she was dating exclusively last year and it weighs on her so heavily, it makes me tear up to think about it. I hate that women are thought of as less than, no matter how everybody tries to pretty up or switch around the words, even the egalitarian Christians. I hate the boxes that it puts people in who live their whole lives never feeling like they can explore their potential, or even knowing they have more potential.

I am ashamed of the role I played in Christian-land until recent years, and while I never bought into the lies about "teh ebil gayz" or "men lead better because they have penises" crap, I bought into it enough to stay in it, even if just on the margins, for years. I want people to know that you can be a moral, caring person without religion, that no magic formula is able to produce the life you want for yourself, and that basically, the universe is indifferent (as Don Draper would say). I want them to know that we are guaranteed* just this one go-around and to embrace their potential and the people they love and just *live*.

I want to be one person who stands up with many, many other people to say "NO!" to the influence of religion on USA society, in our public squares, and in our public leaders.

So while the snark is part of it, more than anything, I want the leaders of these religions exposed for the hucksters they really are.

ETA: * I say "guaranteed" despite knowing that many believe in heaven or an afterlife of some sort. I don't know what I believe about that, but I do know that none of us really *knows*. There is faith, but faith is not fact.

Spoken perfectly! I really like this reply, Austin, well said!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest Anonymous

I was very interested in the crossroads of faith and US politics. A friend who studies white separatists tipped me on the QF movement decades ago. At the time I was involved in a labor history project involving Harry Bridges. Following the politics of the great strike of 1934, I started to follow the money. With the rise of the religious right in the US and the FOIA more documents became available to understand the linkages between ATI and our current spathe of conservative politicians. One of the things that interested me is that these folks have supporters across political lines.

I snark because its a respite. I've read a few of the fundy blogs, but its a lot easier for me to read a synopsis here and decide if I want to dig deeper.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I snark because religion, especially fundamental religion, is very very interesting to me. I also LOVE politics, and the combination of fundies and what they are trying to do to influence the American political system and government is scary as hell.

I also hurt inside for those women stuck in abusive marriages. I am a survivor of domestic violence, and reading this stories reminds me of my own. My relationship was never based on religion, but the domination and physical, mental and verbal abuse were very much tools of control to keep me in "line" with what he wanted. By snarking and poking holes in these douchefaces "religions" I am hopeful that even one woman will realize that life does not have to be like that - that they can free themselves from the oppression (since we all know that fundies lurk here).

Personally, I was raised in a non-denomonational mega-church (Rick Warren's church, Saddleback). I REALLY wanted to believe, I read the bible, went to church every Sunday and went to mid-week bible study. Yet, nothing. I never fully bought it, as much as I tried. After I graduated HS, I stopped going to church, and I have not been back (except to sit in a service to write a paper for a religion class in college). I now consider myself agnostic most days, although I am almost in the athiest camp. I am a VERY liberal feminist, married to an awesome guy for 5 years who is my equal partner in everything life throws at us.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I was raised 'fundie-lite/medium' but my family was on the periphery (but not deeply involved in) more 'big' fundie things that I can count during our travels and through their connections.

(yoga was wrong (for us--my folks were good about saying they felt it was wrong but didn't hold the rest of the world to that standard), meditation was a sin (for us), young earth creationism, we girls were expected to be educated and could do anything (except be pastors)--but were expected to be SAHMs...but asking questions was never a bad thing. I mean, the church may have (and did) disagree but I could ask any theological question and debate any of it w/ dad and that was OK. We were expected to have intelligent discussions on religion and politics and whatnot)

One set of grandparents got involved in Jim and Tammy Faye Baker (sp) and moved to PTL. We visited them there for a few weeks. I nearly drowned at their under-regulated waterpark. I met them and went to their church. I remember my grandpa (FTR, this set of grandparents = a touch crazy before this. Actually, grandma still says 'the devil destroyed a beautiful thing') driving around and getting us 'freebies' at the PTL stores because residents could get free samples at the candy store 1x per day. I remember being bummed when they moved (before things exploded) because I never DID get to ride the damn elephant--I was to short.

My dad would have liked to home school (but I'm so glad we didn't). We did the fundie-esque RV travelling--I have, with 3 kids, 2 adults, a dog and a cat, ridden in small crappy RVs through 45+ states and a lot of Canada (for 6-8 weeks at a time). Our summer vacations were almost home-schooling, by a lot of definitions. Mr. Dawbs will turn "how it's made" on and say "oh, look--your childhood" because we toured tons and tons of factories (which, actually, was and is pretty damn cool. And I can say "oh yes, I've been to a potato chip factory/watch factory/8 different hydroelectric plants/etc" :lol: )

When we stopped on Sunday, we'd go to a protestant church--wherever we could find one--so by the time i was a teenager I'd been to inner city salvation army churches, I'd been to 1 room churches that were nearly Amish, I'd been in Pentecostal churches where they cast deamons out of my family members, I'd been in churches where the sterotype that 'overnighters' (people who camp overnight in areas where most people 'summer'--there's a distinct hierarchy with 'summers' at the top and 'weekenders' in the middle) were dirty (possibly *somewhat* true--depending on whether or not we'd had access to flushing toilets and running water in the days previous--you can be 'not smelly' but not exactly clean and presentable--even with the butane curling iron's effort) and thieves and I've been to wonderful open churches where we were taken home and fed dinner.

After having a lot of doubt and soul searching, I decided I needed to lave my little town but not go to far (I'm still a smalltown girl at heart) and went to a small college which was/is NOT Xian but that still gets FJ snark (I'd rather not out myself, I'm sure some of you know/can guess)--where I got a damn fine education and left as someone who was still Christian, still a virgin, still a feminist (who self-identified as such), had a degree in biology, believed in evolution. And I had mre fundie friends than I ever thought possible.

(I married someone who identifies as 'Deist' and have, fairly recently, had a wonderful daughter. STill working in the sciences/education. Still happliy married.

None of that lead me to the snark.

What DID lead me to it was 2 prong.

One was deciding that I cannot become a member of my church. If I did, I was selling out my daughter--I can't be a member of a group that makes her a 2nd class citizen. I had always questioned and rankled under the sexism apparent in protestant Christianity but now I'm saddled with the knowledge that I made it out (mostly) unscathed--I won't subject my daughter (or son, if I ever have one) to it and assume they would survive it.

The second was watching waht happened to my fundie friends.

I wanted to post these in Knight's thread (Knight--if you're still reading, chew on this when you say it's not a 'complete failure'--what percentage has to be a success for that to be the case? How many crappy outcomes are acceptable to get the 'veneer' of faux happniess that the royalty present?)

Let me just list a few (keeping in mind I've lost track of many) where I know their stories--these aren't strangers or bloggers or even people I hung out with once on a friday night--these are friends. Real friends:

-Moved to a mountaintop w/ her 10 siblings where she was first horribly handicapped then died of a treatable disease

-Entered into abusive relationships (2 people that I'm 100% sure of)

-Allegedly was the abuser in a relationship (2. these aren't the same as the previous 2. One was fundie 'royalty' of sorts)

-Nearly lost her battle with depression because needing help was a sign of spiritual weaknesss

-Gave up a awe-inspiring 'calling' (note, I'm not talking about a job, or even a career. I'm talking a ..well, a God-given vocation) to live the 'higher calling' of SAHM--even when she's bad at it (not a slam, just an observation of personalities) and it spirals the mental illness in the house out of control

-The drudgery of watching countless (I can think of 3 off the top of my head) women I know who are/were vibrant people barley manage to handle their kids--and then they get knocked up again.

All of this (on TOP of the normal 'life angst'--like divorce and kids and what not.) is not 100% the FAULT of Fundie-dom, but I have watched it make these things worse. I've watched it prey on people I thought were smarter/better/etc than that.

I've come to the conclusion that if the difference between your beliefs being used for 'good' and being used for 'evil' is SUBTLE, the beliefs are ill founded. And I found myself snarking :lol:

(damn, that was long)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I was raised Catholic, but when I was 10 my Presbyterian friend invited me to her Sunday School class. It certainly wasn't fundie, but it was pretty conservative on a lot of matters. They were so welcoming there though. They made me see God (whom I had no reason not to believe in) in a whole new light. I stayed. I was attending both churches.

I was a geeky kid with few friends, so being in Bible study and Bible camp gave me a circle. I was also very comforted by the "personal" God presented to me. I was raised in part by my very strict and pathologically anxious grandmother, who gave me a fearful attitude, so I was a very "good" kid who never got into trouble and Christians told me that it was good that I be that way.

Despite years of trying to be saved, I never felt saved. I kept praying that I wanted to be saved, but nothing really happened. Nothing changed. I never felt different on the inside. There was no spiritual awakening for me unless I was surrounded by other people who were happy in praising The Lord. I tried reading the Bible, but felt no real inspiration from it.

Even though I felt nothing, I tried to be good on the outside. I became very self-righteous and judgmental. I let everyone know I thought I was better than they were because I was such a good, clean-living person. I think many of my more adventurous and rebellious friends, tended to keep sides of their lives away from me because they knew I would give them a hard time about their drinking or experiments iwth the opposite sex. While I know one or two of my friends graduated from high school still virgins, I'm sure many of the others I thought were virgins most likely were not, but they didn't want to hear it from me. Hell, I gave my mother a hard time about her lack of Christian values at time (after all, she was a practicing Catholic and should do Jesus's bidding, no?)

I realize how horrible my behavior was sometimes. Religion made me judgmental and afraid (of Hell, of the Devil, of an empty meaningless life, of sex) and I realize I never found happiness from it.

I am still fascinated by all religion now, which is why I love learning about fundies. But I think there is part of me that wants to show I'm better than they are. They tried to make me think they were superior to the secular world, tried to get me to buy that idea. Now I feel like I've turned the tables a bit. I know it's wrong to think that way. No one is better than anyone else. I know Christianity truly does bring happiness and peace to some people, but I don't see that with so many of these fundies and that's why I can't seem to look away when they put themselves out there.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Why do I snark? Because I can :lol:

Seriously, though. I was baptised Anglican and brought up and confirmed Roman Catholic to two loving parents that both had minor anger issues. For the first 7 years of my life, I was the doted-on only child, and since I am a girl, was encouraged by both of my parents to be anything I wanted to be. My mother was very interested in politics, and instilled in me a deeply cynical and questioning mind. My father was a chef, and taught me to cook from the moment I could hold a measuring cup. He made me feel as if it would be ok if I entered any of the more "male" professions.

All of this was outlined by the fact that my mother and I attended Mass and CCD (aka Sunday School), every weekend, and as soon as I was old enough, I entered altar serving. I was also allowed to sing in choir/ act in pageants and cantatas.

For much of my childhood, probably until about 15, I fully believed in what the church taught. I was the brainy, annoying one in confirmation class that asked all the painstaking theological questions. The priest loved me. The bishop asked me to join the sisterhood. I had what protestants would term "a giving heart" and a brain like a steel trap to boot.

I must say, I never had any problems in the church I was brought up in. Then when I was about 16, a series of events started to happen:

-it was a big deal during confirmation to cultivate a personal, meditative relationship with God, during which I was told, he would speak to me. He never did.

- the larger church taught that my best friend was hell bound because he was gay.

- I was raped at 17. I couldn't understand that I had done everything I was supposed to do: save myself, be modest, not pay attention to boys, and this still happened.

I left for college, and once there, had a hard time finding a church family. I'm only, to this day, comfortable at Mass (there's a pattern to it) and none of the churches are appropriate. So I don't go.

So several years ago, I started reading TWOP for Duggar spoilers, which lead me here. Once here, I learned about the plethora of other personalities in fundiedom and about such disturbing ideas as fundamentalism, patriarchy, and Dominionism. I am quite frankly scared shitless by Dominionism, and am now ensconced in exposing it for what it is. I am liberal in my politics, and FJ was the last push I needed to declare myself an atheist... although I really haven't come out to family.

The American public needs to be educated about Dominionism and QF. They need to realize the rampant ignorance existant in large sectories of the population. They need to stop taking things for granted, get scared, and start doing something about how the Christian Right and the Moral Majority has infiltrated so many aspects of our daily life... to the detriment of anyone who is not a specific brand of Protestant. This is why I snark. I need to be educated, and educate others.

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I snark because I was raised in a household where NO ONE dared question Daddy. Ever. I don't wanna say too much... but it was bad.

  • Rufus Bless 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Wow, I'm in awe of how so many of you have overcome horrible stuff and confronted what was wrong with a patriarchal world-view.

My story's kinda boring in comparison. I snark because:

1. I was raised in an anti-patriarchal home. My grandmother was a Jewish socialist who would wake me up at 3 am to argue politics. As a child of the 1970s, I had "Free to Be You and Me" playing constantly on my Mickey Mouse record player. My parents actually liked it when I participate in family political debates, encouraged me to become a lawyer and even had me take books on women and the law to summer camp (yes, I was a bit of a geek).

2. Once I actually became an evil feminist divorce and child protection lawyer, I discovered that all families were not like mine. I'm horrified by domestic violence and child abuse. I'm also appalled by the tremendous human and societal cost of dysfunctional family relationships. When I have cases with cultural or religious factors that fuel abuse and dysfunction, it drives me crazy. It should add that I live and work in a multi-cultural area, so my clients come from everywhere and are part of many different religions.

3. I've become more religious over time, and now identify as an Orthodox Jew. There are many things that I love about it - but I DON'T like what I see as creaping fundie tendencies, which totally go against my values and even against what I had always associated with Judaism. At one point, I was spending a lot of time ranting, under a different screen name, on a website for Orthodox women.

  • Thank You 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I snark because I can. I have always been fascinated how other people live and especially how they believe. I love controversies.

I was raised as Lutheran as majority of Finnish people but I have never been religious type. I had my child faith and after preteen years I went through different kind of religions and religious beliefs from monotheism to panentheism to polytheism to pantheistic monotheism and kind of settled as socially and govermentally secular but personally humanism leaning Noahide (quite a mix, eh). I am all for religious freedom and I can't snark on someone's personal belief. If someone says he sees pink elephants I can't doubt that. I don't see and that is fine for me. I will stand for believing in pink elephants if believing in them would come forbidden but I would certainly stand against if pin elephanter would want to mix his religious beliefs with law, for example. But I will certainly snark stupid religious customs. Personal belief is ok but don't try to shove it in my or anyone else's face, please.

I love knowledge, I need to know as much as I possibly can when I find something interesting subject. I am interested in relegions in every possible levels: theological, social, cultural, biological, political... And American fundies, a gold mine! We don't really have fundies so I have to find them elsewhere.

I am more lurker than active writer but I try to participate more :)

Edit: My home was agnostic-atheist, we didn't really have different kind of chores for boys and girls nor gender based works in general. We were raised to be whatever we wanted to be and we were encouraged to learn more all the time. Maybe because of that I have never really felt that I should be something that is socially expected or behave in a certain way. Everything I decide is basically my own business and I will bear the consequences. In my culture equality is honoured but of course everything is not perfect. Patriarchality is something from outer space.

  • Thank You 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Good topic, thank you!

I object strongly and everlastingly to what these people (Gothard, Phillips, Pearl, et.al.) are doing to distort Christianity and smear its name.

I am a Christian and thus, I snark.

Ditto! I'm a Conservative Christian, but what they're doing is exactly what Jesus rebuked the pharisees for doing in Mark 7- rejecting the commandments of God for the tradition of men-"thus making void the word of God by your tradition that you have handed down." I don't think they are flat out wrong on every point, and I believe many of them love their families and are trying to do what they have come to believe is best for them, but it grieves me to see Christianity become a culture instead of the relationship with God that it is meant to be.

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I snark because I learned a long time ago that if you can laugh at the things that used to control you, those things lose their power in your life.

I snark because I see how ridiculous and desperate patriarchy is. It deserves a really good 'point and laugh.'

As several have said before me, I snark because I can. :)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

This thread has been fascinating!

No real story here. I was raised by a former Catholic mother (she married a non-Catholic (my father) and also later got a divorce) and while for some early years we belonged to an Anglican church and I was baptized as such, I can say really was never given a religious upbringing, and was raised in quite a secular manner. I would say my mother was actually at that point quite liberal and a feminist who was educated and worked outside the home (and still is). We did not pray or anything of that nature - the only thing my mother would get upset about is if I said "Jesus" as a swear ;) I certainly was never pressured to get married/have kids or told my value was only as a mother/wife. Rather, I was encouraged and supported to do what was right for me, and definitely encouraged to get a higher education. I often tagged along to friends churches, temples, etc, but more for hanging out with my friends, not for the religious side of it.

I don't believe in a God, but I do believe in a human connection/spiritual connection, so I am not really sure what that categorizes me. I generally refer to myself as agnostic. I am a firm believer in the separation of church and state, I still remember my early school years and having prayer in school and finding it uncomfortable (especially for those kids who had to leave the room for it, like the Jews & Muslims!) and it felt "wrong" to me. I still feel that way about any public gathering, etc, where "prayer" or other religious tones are "forced" upon others.

I despise the use of religion to "enforce" or create rules for all of society (like the use of religion as "evidence" against gay marriage, or abortion, egalitarian relationships, etc). My brother is gay (and engaged to his long-time partner), I have had an abortion (which I have never regretted), and I am in a thriving and egalitarian marriage with a wonderful man where we can both laugh at the idea of "obeying". I find it scary that certain people in power are willing to push to revert rights that were gained with so much difficulty. I believe I am a genuine, and authentic human being who is still good and valuable, whether my choices fit with some other person's standards or not. I believe feminism is about both men and women having choice and autonomy, not about man-hating as is so often espoused by the far right groups.

I am very liberal. I grew up in a rather socialist province with a very diverse mixture of people and faiths, but did not have that much exposure to fundamentalists personally. I moved to a much more conservative area of the country about 2-3 years ago for work. The city I am in has a VERY strong Mormon population, along with some FLDS. Two of my husband's coworkers grew up in polygamous FLDS households (one, a woman, grew up being told to "keep sweet" throughout her youth...*gag*). The Mormon's basically founded this part of the province and you can see it in the designs of towns, etc around here. There is also huge Hutterite and Mennonite populations around here. I grew up in province where there were Hutterites and Mennonites as well, but I rarely saw them in the large city where I lived, and most of the Mennonites I knew were "Mennonite-lite" and not the ones who dressed in their matching dresses and head coverings. Now since the small city I live in is central for many of the colonies, etc, I see groups of people out with their matching dresses or suits, and see the little girls in their little dresses with the hoods. Many of the Hutterites and Mennonites around here follow their respective dress codes all the time. Initially it was strange to see multiple fundie sightings everyday, now I don't even think of it. It is completely normal to stop at Walmart for some bread and have multiple fundie sightings within the 5 minutes I am there. It is just the way life is around here! Anyway, it is a very different environment from that I grew up in and so I find it interesting to learn more.

I have always found it fascinating to learn about others - their cultures, religions, beliefs. I have had friends and acquaintances who came from many faiths over the years (though I would say none were fundamental at the time) who were very open and accepting. I have had others tell me that I was going to hell for practicing yoga, or believing in equality, or reading Harry Potter (obviously, these were not the friends).

I am here as I find fundamentalism/religion both interesting, and terrifying. I am fascinated by the cultures of others, and horrified when religion/culture/belief systems are used to abuse and control others (even those outside the belief system). I find the cult-like situations that I see just frightening. I find the evangelical movement to change the laws of a free and democratic society incredibly scary. I hate hypocrisy. I despise the idea that others think they know best for me, or alternatively, see me as a heathen. I find it sad when I see very, very young and uneducated woman around here rush to get married (to whomever they can find) and pop out babies due to pressure from family and their "belief system". I think patriarchy sucks.

And on, and on....I am here as I want to be for a multitude of reasons!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I grew up Southern Baptist and had some brief interactions with ATI through a family in our church. They were the sweetest people in the world (I still love the mom sooo much) but when they took my mom and I to the Basic Seminar when I was in junior high, it freaked me the fuck out. I never really bought into the patriarchal tendencies of the church, although I always tried to be an excellent Christian, and was, at least until late college.

A disastrous mission trip and sexism in the church, combined with my continued singleness (I was doing everything right; why wasn't God blessing me with a husband?) made me lose some faith in the church, but what really drove me away was when I started taking an interest in Jesus' ministry of social justice, and was called a communist for it, along with an interaction with a church "leader" who was knowingly spreading lies. I read the Bible again, and was amazed at all the contradictions and vulgarities it contained. It was a long two years after that before I would call myself an atheist, but it only took about six weeks for me to become an "unchristian" after having being a part of it all my life. Luckily I had the support of a similarly struggling cousin to lean on in that hard time.

Now, I have an agnostic husband, no religion, and am expecting our first child in May. I couldn't be happier with where life has taken me since I gave up loving Jesus and started loving myself.

Why am I back making comments about the fundamentalists? Some of it is gratitude for my own escape. Now that I'm free of it, I can see how close I was to getting swept into this kind of lifestyle myself. Even in college, it was what I aspired to. Mostly I'm back to try to figure out what can make the nicest people in the world (and I'm still convinced that some of these people are the nicest people in the world) so very WRONG about so much. Also, to cheer on anybody else who tries to escape.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I grew up in the Episcopal church. Wandered briefly over to an apostolic church. When my family got chastised because we inadvertently entered the door reserved for the Bishop :?: , and the congregation paid for a private jet for the Bishop :?: and the church refused to give a partial scholarship to my damn near destitute SIL for her kids to attend the school :evil: - I said kiss my ass.

My mother briefly was taken in with PTL and dragged me in :oops: , but she eventually got over that.

I snark because I am a flaming liberal. The idea that there are people who want to legislate their values into my life absolutely enrages me. The idea that men want to control my actions, movements and thoughts enrage me. I am hyper-vigilant about the issues discussed here on FreeJinger.

I snark, not only because I can, but it's the right thing to do!

  • Thank You 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest Anonymous

My backstory is downright boring, even to me. I had a Lutheran mother, Church of Ireland father, and was brought up Lutheran (I still am). While my parents were strict with me and my sister in some ways, they gave us a lot of freedom in others. Growing up, we could read/listen to/watch/think anything we liked. The closest my parents came to censorship was asking us to lower our music because it was loud enough to annoy the neighbors. But we still weren't told what music we could hear, nor were we told we couldn't buy records by certain artists. Patriarchy and fundiedom disgust me not because I was raised this way myself, but because I wasn't, and the idea of other people growing up without the freedoms I enjoyed is sick-making to me.

I found FreeJinger when the news about Lydia Schatz broke. I was horrified that someone could murder their child and follow the ravings of a religious dumbass like Michael Pearl, and followed the links given on some websites.

Snarking on these people isn't a random pastime to me. I consider it my civic duty. Besides, it's fun!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I read freejinger (though don't do much snarking, snarking is pretty much against my nature) for quite a few reasons.

I discovered the whole fundamentalist issue via blogs. I'm into frugality, green living, DIYing and all, and I'd be reading blogs on the topic, and then I'd see so much stuff in it that didn't make sense, and some stuff that seemed totally cuckoo to me. I read Emily's blog and discovered FreeJinger through comments there, and then learned about other fundies. I guess I pretty much got appalled by certain things she and other fundies were doing that were either crazy, ridiculous, or absolutely dangerous or wrong. And I HATE people trying to proselytize, people who think their way of serving God is the only one, and that everyone else is going to go to Hell. And so I read.

And then there's the fact that from the outside, I might seem like a fundie to some. Hair covering, modest dressing, God fearing, stay at home mom... but that's pretty much where the similarities end. It amuses, shocks, and horrifies me that some people on the outside can seem similar to myself, but have gotten it all wrong to the extent that they're abusive and uber problematic and spewing such hatred!

(Come on, you all want to sing Black Eyed Peas' "Where is the Love?" when you read those fundie blogs.)

But really what gets me the most is fundies who try to pretend to be Orthodox Jews, and might fool people into thinking that that's what Orthodox Judaism is about, but its not. Do you know how many times I've read blogs thinking they were orthodox Jews, and only discover that they're not when I read something between the lines that makes me do a double take?

And oh, Anna T pisses me off because I hate how she teaches "Judaism this, Judaism that" when she is so Fundamentalist Christian in mindset! I've sent her emails pretty much admonishing her that she should please please please speak to a rabbi to clarify what the Jewish opinion is on this topic, so she could see that even Ultra Orthodox Judaism doesn't agree with the whole wifely submission, stay at home daughter, anti feminist type thing. But no, she ignores my missives...

  • Upvote 1
  • Thank You 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Everyone's stories are so interesting! I've probably yammered enough about myself on this site that my story is old news but here goes:

My family background is diverse. My father was the product of an interfaith Jewish and Christian marriage, back when such things were fairly uncommon. My grandparents chose to raise him completely secularly. My mother descends from a long line of Lutheran ministers, several of whom immigrated from Germany in the 19th century as part of a movement to proselytize to the Native Americans and to minister to the German communities of the midwest. Her grandfathers, at least 2 great-grandfathers, her uncles and a number of her cousins were or are Lutheran ministers, and she was brought up in a devout household. As an adult, she rebelled against her background, feeling that as a 1950s era Lutheran girl, she was indoctrinated to take on a subordinate role. I am pleased to report, however, that most of my religious Lutheran relatives are delightfully liberal and cutting edge. My grandmother has evolved with the times, as has the Lutheran church, and she now attends a church with a woman minister.

I was raised in a secular household and consider myself a cradle atheist. My parents were both nominally feminist, although the actual operation of our household was hierarchical, with my father firmly in charge and throwing his weight around. I think he has a narcissistic personality disorder which caused him to inflict what I consider both physical and mental abuse on me (part of why I am zealously opposed to spanking). Also in the 1970s, in my kind of Leave-it-to-Beaver/Stepford community, it was pretty clear that women were second class citizens. The disparity between my parents' theoretical feminism and the way things actually worked in our family and community made me very sensitive to feminist issues from very early childhood. Whenever I saw someone like Gloria Steinem on television, I was like, "Oh thank God, I'm not crazy! Here is someone who is talking sense in a topsy-turvy world!"

A couple other things influenced my interest in feminism and religion. As a young teenager, my family moved to a country with a predominantly Islamic population and a poor history in the area of women's rights. My experiences there (including having rocks thrown at me despite my best efforts at modest dress) made me even more adamantly feminist and more interested in religion. Then, in college, my roommate converted to a scary cult (The Boston Church of Christ) that took over her life and had shockingly retrograde views of women. That experience led me to minor in religion.

All of those experiences have made me fascinated with how religious belief (or lack of belief) influences people, and also how women can get into the mindset my roommate did of accepting their own subordinate status. As a child, feminism was obvious to me. For many years, I naively assumed that all women believed in feminism. When Phyllis Schlafly became feminist when I was around 9 or 10, she blew my mind. Thus my lifelong quest to understand why some women would actually fight to be subordinated.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I grew up in a conservative Catholic household, where we went to church every morning(as well as most of the kids and famillies in the school) before school. We only work skirts, and never celebrated Halloween. We also went by the bible verse only one type of cloth can be worn, well pretty seriously anyways which made for very Amish looking clothing. We would have been described as quiverfull but thankfully my mother kept having miscarriages so there is only 2 siblings. It could have been hell with 9 kids. I was to be married to my highschool sweetheart at the age of 22 after he finished college. And I was to be a SAHD until then. We always had chaperones and we were allowed to hold hands but there was to be no kissing or anything. I convinced my parents to allow me to go to college for early childhood education and at that time I woke up(or as I say stopped drinking the Kool-Aid) and realized the lifestyle wasn't for us.

Ten years later I am still with the same person and luckily we have escaped. My parents are "okay" with it in the sense they will love a child no matter what but his parents have disowned us. Sh*tty but it happened.

I am intrigued by why it happened to me and that there are other religions that do this. I had no idea. It started with a fascination and acceptance of polygamy and it just went from there.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I feel like there's an alternate-history me out there who's a bitter, abused (or maybe dead of pregnancy, since my pregnancy was life-threatening) wife of an alcoholic fundamentalist, and I follow the fundy movements and snark because of that. I have a friend whose parents told her they wouldn't help her go to college because she should get married instead, but really it was because her addict dad was burning through all the money and hiding that from his submissive SAHM wife - I can see my family having fallen down that hole with just one more mis-step. My mom's "Christian" friends were certainly encouraging her to let my addicted, impulse-driven father take over all the finances.

My parents are/were pretty mainstream United Methodist, but my mom was a SAHM and my dad was a drunk, so she was really vulnerable to Evangelical "ministry". At the lowest point in their marriage, when he was out of work, she started selling Amway and we got taken to a bunch of those big-box Evangelical churches, only listened to Christian music, tried really hard to be submissive, etc etc. Luckily we moved away from those people when my dad found new work, and my mom decided to go back to school and leave the drunk asshole (which, despite what he says, was good for him too - he got sober soon after moving out, and his second wife is AWESOME and pulls off the fundy trick of pretending to be sweet and submissive but actually keeping him on a very tight leash.)

  • Rufus Bless 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • 7 years later...

I wasn't really raised religious, but I went to a religious school, and I rejected the misogyny, the obvious untruths and what I saw as ridiculous and misogynistic rules that I resented (such as modesty).

Those are things I see in other religions too and I find it all appalling.

  • Upvote 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I know this is kinda an old thread but I thought I’d contribute! 

Although I’m an atheist, I’ve always found religion pretty interesting. I went to a Church of England primary school, and then did Religious Studies/Philosophy until I was eighteen. I think I first came across the Duggars in a book called “Schott’s Almanac”, basically a round-up of all the various events that had happened that year. It was a short thing, saying that they were expecting their eighteenth child. It listed the names of all the kids, and then stated that they were canvassing suitable names (as we all know, that kid was Jordyn). 

Then, back in 2014, I joined GOMI, although I have no idea why. My gateway fundie was Erika Shupe. I’ve also long found big families fascinating, particularly when there’s no religious reason for having loads of kids. I then joined FJ about a year later, and eventually abandoned GOMI as the fundie section was kinda small and didn’t get much traffic. I don’t get TLC over here, but I have watched a couple of Duggar episodes because I thought I should (educational reasons only). I watched the early specials, as well as other episodes like the one about Josie’s birth and about Jubilee. I also saw maybe one or two episodes of United Bates of America... all of this being courtesy of YouTube. I don’t spend a huge amount of time in the Bates/Duggar subforums, but I keep up with the weddings and babies etc. 

I also have ASD. I have a tendency to focus on the negative things about ASD such as the social difficulties etc, but one good thing is that when I get into something, I can REALLY get into it, which is a fairly big reason why I did that Maxwell summary in the relevant sub forum. 

As for *why* I snark... it’s kinda obvious :pb_lol: I guess, being an atheist, I find fundies fascinating because their beliefs are the total opposite to mine. It’s not just the big families thing, it’s also the modesty, the courtship/no kissing before marriage, the relative isolation from the outside world, all that kinda thing. 

  • Upvote 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Interesting reading all the different reasons! Indirectly I snark because of the Rapture. I grew up in a very Bible Beltish town, and while I went to the liberal, left-leaning, social justice oriented church a lot of my school friends were AoG or other brands of Evangelical, and going along to their events is where I encountered the whole Rapture thing. A couple of decades later (no idea why) I went "where the hell did all that come from,  it's bizarre" and started trying to find out. I followed Slacktivist closely for a while and was following a few other things including Razing Ruth when life stuff happened and I dropped out for a couple of years. Then - via falling down a home birth rabbit hole of all things -I came across FJ and my interest sparked up again. Mostly I snark because I find a lot of it so fascinating, some of it pretty scary, and some absolutely hilarious. It amazes me that in the 21st century we have people actively rejecting education and medicine, and restricting their own and their children's (particularly their daughter's) lives so comprehensively. I also am kind of peeved that the term "Christian" has almost come to mean "small minded bigot" - and that the reported words and directions of Christ are ignored so completely (do not get me started on Prosperity Gospel). Also it's entertaining and I learn stuff, especially through thread drift.

  • Upvote 3
  • Thank You 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now



×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.