2020 Election Fallout Part 16: Public Hearings Are Underway

[AlmostSavedAtTacoBell]

11 hours ago, Howl said:

From CNN: Hutchinson was 1 of the witnesses Trump world sought to influence, sources say

How do we know it was Trump behind trying to intimidate witnesses?  Because that's a mob deal, and Trump has been mob adjacent his entire life. 

It would not surprise me if it was Donald Trump making the actual phone calls.  

Trump has a history in the 1990s of inventing fake personas to call in and brag about this and that to media. 

"Hey Cassidy, this is ummmm...... Ronald Crump calling.  I'm here with my friend George Glass......"

[Howl]

Yeah, warrants for electronic devices, including cell phones, have probably already been written and possibly served.  The good thing about this?  Those who might be testifying to the J-6 Committee, holy crap will they be under surveillance and know that lying will be a YUGE risk - a flop sweat and desperation scenario as they try to work out the calculus of where things swill be in 2024 and the possibility of a pardon. 

And the person who made the original "be a shame if something happened to your standing in Trumpworld" call?  Probably thinking s/he should have used a burner! 

 

2 hours ago, AlmostSavedAtTacoBell said:

"Hey Cassidy, this is ummmm...... Ronald Crump calling.  I'm here with my friend George Glass......"

I had to look up George Glass -- this is an utterly brilliant reference! 

"George Glass is an imaginary boyfriend of the character Jan Brady from the 1960–70s sitcom The Brady Bunch"

 

Edited July 1, 2022 by Howl

[Ozlsn]

Long thread on twitter, but these two stood out:

Full thread here (unrolled).

[Howl]

One of the talking heads on an MSNBC show this morning (Saturday) referred to the person making a threatening phone call to Cassidy Hutchinson as an "associate" of Mark Meadows.  That is a fascinating choice of words, because the word "associate" almost always has a criminal connotation. 

My impression is that the name is known, at least to the committee, but is being kept under wraps in hopes that the person will testify to the committee, in that "be a shame what would happen if you refuse to testify" kinda way. 

Cippiloni could be a hard nut to crack.  Apparently he DESPISES Congress and especially the House of Representatives and the way the People's Business is done.

His job at the WH was to make sure that no legal lines were crossed.  If he doesn't testify  honestly and forthrightly, he can be considered accessory after the fact/guilty of misprision ("the deliberate concealment of one's knowledge of a treasonable act or a felony").  Huge exposure.  He better be praying about doing the right thing.  I wonder who HIS lawyer is.  

He's probably Opus Dei, has 10 kids, hard core Catholic. 

[fraurosena]

10 hours ago, Howl said:

My impression is that the name is known, at least to the committee, but is being kept under wraps

They know. The use of this type of brackets [a person] is a dead giveaway. I don’t have a screenshot of the image used during the hearing, but that is how they showed it. In academic and legal papers, this type of bracket is used to either signify the author left out parts of a quoted text, or when quoting part(s) of a sentence or paragraph to make a chopped up sentence more legible, or…to signify that a name or or other trait that can doxx someone has been disguised.

Simply by using those brackets, the J6C is telling everyone that they know who [the person] is.

[Howl]

4 hours ago, fraurosena said:

Simply by using those brackets, the J6C is telling everyone that they know who [the person] is.

Thanks for this nuanced take!  And that person is gold, because [s/he] could give up who gave them the orders to call Cassidy. 

But again, Trump is wily; trained in mob ways by his father and mentored relentlessly by the horrible and infamous mafia lawyer Roy Cohn, who, by the way,  also prosecuted Julius and Ethel Rosenberg. 

In the past, it was reported that Trump called Cohn 15 or 20 times a day - constant contact. Trump knows how to apply pressure through an associate (or two) without it being traced back to him, but he's also a bully and a thug, so not much finesse. 

If you can access Vanity Fair,  AUGUST 2017:  HOW DONALD TRUMP AND ROY COHN’S RUTHLESS SYMBIOSIS CHANGED AMERICA

This is a short, extremely interesting read, that appeared in USA Today Jan 20, 2021 and shows how long ago Roger Stone would have been in Trump's (and Roy Cohn's) orbit: 

 Trump is a lot like his mentor, my cousin Roy Cohn. Now he's leaving like him, in disgrace.   Cohn was disbarred, shamed and defeated by a disease he denied. He was Trump's mentor, but the departing president failed to learn some key lessons.

<snips>

Like Trump, Roy grew up with parents who had a dysfunctional marriage. Like Trump, he needed adulation. I watched politicians and developers waiting for an audience with him, sitting in the hallways of the six-floor townhouse off Park Avenue that doubled as Roy’s office and home. Regular visitors included Roger Stone and Terence Cardinal Cooke, the archbishop of New York. And John Gotti, aka “the Teflon Don” — before he was convicted of five murders. 

and this seems like the most New York thing ever: "On New Year’s Eve 1985, shortly before Roy turned 59, he threw a party that I and the other guests sensed would be his last. Carmine DeSapio, the Tammany Hall boss, mingling with Norman Mailer, William F. Buckley and Steve Rubell. Andy Warhol stood in a corner. As usual, Trump arrived late and stayed just long enough to give a toast and get photographed for the gossip columns." 

 

[GreyhoundFan]

Maybe we'll have some more surprise witnesses soon:

 

[GreyhoundFan]

Ooh, Rudy, Lindsey, and John Eastman have been subpoenaed by the Fulton County DA. 
 

https://www.cnn.com/2022/07/05/politics/fulton-grand-jury-giuliani-eastman-graham/index.html

 

[47of74]

1 hour ago, GreyhoundFan said:

Ooh, Rudy, Lindsey, and John Eastman have been subpoenaed by the Fulton County DA. 
 

https://www.cnn.com/2022/07/05/politics/fulton-grand-jury-giuliani-eastman-graham/index.html

 

Things could get interesting now.  How did that distraction work out for you the other day, Rudy?  Maybe that's why he did that because he didn't know he was being taped and thought it would distract from what the Fulton County DA did.

[Howl]

14 hours ago, 47of74 said:

Things could get interesting now.  How did that distraction work out for you the other day, Rudy?  Maybe that's why he did that because he didn't know he was being taped and thought it would distract from what the Fulton County DA did.

The grand jury is seated in Fulton County, and the subpoenas are issued by the Fulton County DAs office, yes? 

What happens when the Eastman/Rudy/Lindsey clown car decides to ignore those subpoenas?  Are there repercussions?  None of those three live in Georgia.  Can they send the state troopers out of state to retrieve them?  In general, google says there could be fines or confinement, but can find anything specific to Fulton County, GA. 

Rudy testified in a Georgia hearing in December 2021 but don't know what came of that. 

Can people plead the 5th in front of a Grand Jury? 

[GreyhoundFan]

This is so sad:

 

[Xan]

19 minutes ago, GreyhoundFan said:

This is so sad:

 

These people have always been with us.  I rewatched "Mississippi Burning" the other day and those KKK guys were the same sort of bullying bigots as the ones making these phone calls.  They're ignorant and hateful and proud of it.  

I used to have one of these asses in my family.  My late father-in-law was a hateful bigot and thought that, even if he didn't make much of his own life, he was still better than women and people of color.  Understanding him didn't make him better or change him in any way.  When he finally died, I don't recall anyone crying for him.

I don't think we can change these people in any appreciable way.  They refuse to be educated and will turn violent if pushed.  The best we can do is minimize them and hope that the numbers drop away with each succeeding generation.  Public education helps (although it can only go so far).  The late Mr. Xan rejected everything about his own father and gave a lot of the credit to his high school teachers.

[AlmostSavedAtTacoBell]

2 hours ago, Xan said:

These people have always been with us.  I rewatched "Mississippi Burning" the other day and those KKK guys were the same sort of bullying bigots as the ones making these phone calls.  They're ignorant and hateful and proud of it.  

I used to have one of these asses in my family.  My late father-in-law was a hateful bigot and thought that, even if he didn't make much of his own life, he was still better than women and people of color.  Understanding him didn't make him better or change him in any way.  When he finally died, I don't recall anyone crying for him.

I don't think we can change these people in any appreciable way.  They refuse to be educated and will turn violent if pushed.  The best we can do is minimize them and hope that the numbers drop away with each succeeding generation.  Public education helps (although it can only go so far).  The late Mr. Xan rejected everything about his own father and gave a lot of the credit to his high school teachers.

Joining you in the "have these asses in my family" club.  I have cut them off.  Some of the other family members have as well.  The asses are crying on social media about it (or so I have been told, as I have blocked them.)  Of course their whining is sandwiched in between horrible memes, outright lies (despite people trying to educate them by posting the fact-checked links); and terrible reposts from gross people like Ben Shapiro.  I have no time for their shit.  If they aren't willing to listen, learn, and grow as humans, I am not going to waste my time or breath.  

[47of74]

4 hours ago, GreyhoundFan said:

This is so sad:

 

<sarcasm>Just some more of the typical polite and civilized behavior we've come to expect from garden variety Branch Trumpvidians.</sarcasm>

I hope they track these sacks of shit down and put them in jail for making these sort of threats. 

[SPHASH]

5 hours ago, GreyhoundFan said:

This is so sad:

 

Notice they all have southern dialects.  Coincidence, I think not.

[GreyhoundFan]

"Former White House counsel Cipollone to testify before Jan. 6 committee"

Quote

Former White House counsel Pat Cipollone will testify Friday morning after receiving a subpoena from the House select committee investigating the Jan. 6, 2021 attack on the Capitol by a pro-Trump mob, according to people familiar with the matter.

It’s unclear what limits there may be on his closed-door testimony, which is scheduled for about half a day, according to one person familiar with the matter. The session will be videotaped, but there will be some limits on what he will testify to regarding direct conversations with former president Donald Trump.

Cipollone had been reluctant to testify to the committee, citing presidential privilege, but he has been regularly mentioned in the hearings and is key to a number of episodes being plumbed by the committee.

The individuals spoke about the committee’s plans on the condition of anonymity to freely describe private deliberations. News of the plan was earlier reported by the New York Times.

The committee issued the subpoena last week after blockbuster testimony from a former aide, Cassidy Hutchinson, identified the lawyer as having firsthand knowledge of potential criminal activity in the Trump White House.

The decision followed extensive negotiations between Cipollone and the committee, as well as sharply escalating pressure on him in recent days to testify. Committee members have come to believe that the former counsel’s testimony could be critical to their investigation, given his proximity to Trump and presence during key moments before, during and after the attack on the Capitol.

Cipollone sat for an informal interview with the committee on April 13, according to a letter from the panel’s chairman, Rep. Bennie G. Thompson (D-Miss.), but he has declined to cooperate further.

“In the weeks since, the Select Committee has continued to obtain evidence about which you are uniquely positioned to testify; unfortunately, however, you have declined to cooperate with us further, including by providing on-the-record testimony. We are left with no choice but to issue you this subpoena,” wrote Thompson.

A statement from Thompson and the panel’s vice chairwoman, Rep. Liz Cheney (R-Wyo.), said the committee’s investigation had “revealed evidence that Mr. Cipollone repeatedly raised legal and other concerns about President Trump’s activities on January 6th and in the days that preceded.”

Hutchinson in her testimony portrayed Cipollone as one of the last firewalls blocking Trump’s efforts to overturn the elections. She testified that on the morning of Jan. 6 Cipollone came to her with an urgent request, saying “something to the effect of: ‘Please make sure we don’t go up to the Capitol, Cassidy. Keep in touch with me. We’re going to get charged with every crime imaginable if we make that movement happen.’”

Cipollone has been mentioned often over the past month as various witnesses who have appeared in the committee’s public hearings have cited his steady presence in off-the-rail meetings and sage, though at times unwelcome, legal advice. But he has remained invisible to the American public, neither agreeing to sit for taped interviews nor appearing as a live witness at a committee hearing.

A cigar smoker with deep ties in the Federalist Society, Cipollone has kept a relatively low profile since leaving the White House, eschewing high-profile media interviews and public appearances. Though Cipollone has been a fairly reliable public ally to Trump, he is not close to the former president, according to multiple people in Trump’s orbit.

For all of the loyalists Trump surrounded himself with, Cipollone was closer to an apostate in the West Wing. The lawyer repeatedly pushed back against some of Trump’s most conspiratorial ideas and told aides he needed to be in some of the meetings with outside advisers during which plans regarding the attempt to overturn the 2020 election results were discussed. Cipollone never agreed with Trump’s claims that the election was stolen, according to people who talked with him at the time. After Jan. 6, he argued against broadly distributed pardons.

“Him and the team were always saying, ‘Oh, we’re going to resign,’” Jared Kushner, Trump’s son-in-law and White House adviser, told investigators of Cipollone’s response to Trump’s potentially illegal activity, according to a taped deposition played in public by the committee. “'We’re not going to be here if this happens, if that happens.' So I kind of took it up to just be whining, to be honest with you.”

Trump often castigated Cipollone, saying in private that he was one of the worst lawyers of all time. He even mocked Cipollone to his face in front of other advisers, saying, “Why do I have the worst lawyer ever?”

Trump yelled that Cipollone always said no to him, according to a former senior administration official. Some former White House officials, however, have criticized the counsel’s office for not doing more to push back against Trump.

 

[GreyhoundFan]

On 7/5/2022 at 4:32 PM, GreyhoundFan said:

Ooh, Rudy, Lindsey, and John Eastman have been subpoenaed by the Fulton County DA. 
 

https://www.cnn.com/2022/07/05/politics/fulton-grand-jury-giuliani-eastman-graham/index.html

 

It's not a big surprise that Lindsey is fighting the subpoena. Sadly, it doesn't matter that he doesn't have a legal leg to stand on, he'll cry up the chain to SCOTUS, where his GQP buddies will let him off.

 

[GreyhoundFan]

 

[AlmostSavedAtTacoBell]

4 hours ago, GreyhoundFan said:

 

Slow golf clap for you, buddy. Lost your delegate position, convicted in federal court, going to club fed, probably fucked your future employment prospects, and my guess is at least some of your family and friends are ashamed of you. Was it worth it? Trump pay for your attorney? Give you a hug on your all expense paid trip to Mar-A-Loser? Tell you what a good patriot you were? How’d that whole overturning the election thing work out? 
Congrats, ya moron. You got played by a buffoon in a badly fitted suit. 

[47of74]

These people need to be doing 500 to life in a supermax somewhere

Quote

The Justice Department released new details Friday evening of the alleged extensive planning by the Oath Keepers to prepare for violence in Washington, DC, on January 6, 2021, including lessons to conduct "hasty ambushes," a "death list" of Georgia election officials and attempts to acquire homemade firearms.

The details, many of which have not been alleged publicly before, were revealed in a court filing from the government, which includes a list of evidence that prosecutors intend to use against the Oath Keepers during their trial in September.

Prosecutors will attempt to prove that nine Oath Keepers charged with seditious conspiracy -- Stewart Rhodes, Kelly Meggs, Kenneth Harrelson, Jessica Watkins, Roberto Minuta, Joseph Hackett, David Moerschel, Thomas Caldwell, and Edward Vallejo -- extensively prepared for violence and plotted to stop Joe Biden from assuming the presidency.

Among the new details in the government's allegations is a document with the words "DEATH LIST" that the government says it found in Oath Keeper Thomas Caldwell's home through a search warrant in the weeks after January 6.

 

[Howl]

Stewart Rhodes is currently in jail, wants to testify to the J6 Committee, but only if he can do it live.  J6 would be crazy to let him do this, because he'd surely have a plan to disrupt. 

Things are looking worse and worse for the core Oath Keepers who have been charged (I think) with sedition. 

Meanwhile J6 keeps marching on. It's beyond awesome. 

[Howl]

 

[Shrubbery]

I would make a joke now about the orange one „barely knowing Cipollone,“ but, you know, it was funnier with the first twenty or so people. 
 

Meanwhile, the next hearing has been scheduled for Tuesday at 10 am Eastern, a really inconvenient time for European viewers! 😂 (https://january6th.house.gov/legislation/hearings/071222-select-committee-hearing)

I haven’t yet seen anything scheduled beyond that, I wonder whether they’re planning to take a break, not have public hearings any more, or have hopes to bring in more surprise witnesses at short notice …

[GreyhoundFan]

I would be thrilled if Ronny went down as part of the investigation.

[Ozlsn]