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Carlin & Evan 11: Scary Health Situation


samurai_sarah

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My youngest learned to bounce himself in his bouncer at about 4.5-5 months old. He learned that if he moved his leg just so, he could bounce bounce bounce for a long time. He still bounces. I guess you could call it rocking. It’s the same as what a lot of children with autism do. He just sits on the couch and rocks when he’s tired. He is 7 and still does it. 

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My youngest grandchild was crawling at top speed when she was five months old; she had two older siblings to keep up with, and she figured out how to do it.  She couldn't sit up perfectly, but she was on the move.

 

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I have a 10 month old (my third) in the US and I actually don’t know anyone who doesn’t have a bassinet attachment to their stroller. But I’m in the NYC metro area, so maybe it’s different here?

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28 minutes ago, Johannah said:

I have a 10 month old (my third) in the US and I actually don’t know anyone who doesn’t have a bassinet attachment to their stroller. But I’m in the NYC metro area, so maybe it’s different here?

They’ve become very very common in the last couple of years!! Probably even more so in more walkable cities like NYC. 

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In the UK, all babies are in prams. Generally stroller frames come with two different units, a bassinet one for the baby to lie flat, and then a stroller for when the baby is older and can sit unaided. Bought together as a set. 

In Denmark prams are massive, and can be used lying flat up till 3 years. You can actually get a smaller bassinet inset to fit into the big bassinet, so the baby is more snug, because the pram is so big. Often the pram and the stroller would be two separate units. 

It is not recommended for babies to be in car seats for longer than 2 hours at a time. 

Edit: Just had a look at the actual picture of Zade, and yeah, that seems weird for a two-month old to be sitting like that. Better off lying flat. 

Edited by SorenaJ
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Carlin is supposed to be off her seizure meds right now in preparation to do her tests to determine what's happening. They haven't been posting about how it's going with her off the meds as far as I can tell. They're moving houses next week.  

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It might be my PMS but I when I finally watched the yt video showing Carlin collapsing at her in-laws' house I felt so bad for her I cried... twice.

Before I just thought it was callous of Kelly not to be more involved in helping Carlin and caring for her and her family. Now that I've seen how bad it was (and probably is) and how scared and frustrated Carlin was I can't believe how Kelly could ever stay away when she knew what was going on!

When she talked about going to see the Stewarts in that video with Lawson and mentioned missing her grandbabies Carlin was just an afterthought! Not single word about her health or helping her.

Sure, Kelly has other responsibilities and there might be things that she's dealing with that we don't know about but if she had time to transport all of Lawson's stuff she could have made time to support Carlin more.

Does she really not care or is she pushing this aside because she's unable to deal with difficult situations?

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54 minutes ago, Paperplate said:

Does she really not care

I think Kelly is very selfish and doesn’t actually care in a way most parents care. These mega-family mothers who, in Kelly’s case, hand off the babies the second they were born, aren’t going to behave like parents who spent years caring about the well being of their children. She never has cared about the health and safety of her children, why would she start now?

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Katie flew in from NJ to help Carlin. From the videos of the moving, other people are helping, Kelly is sitting around and cuddling babies. Which, sure watching the kids is needed but when it is all you are doing, it is not particularly helpful. 

 

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3 hours ago, formergothardite said:

I think Kelly is very selfish and doesn’t actually care in a way most parents care. These mega-family mothers who, in Kelly’s case, hand off the babies the second they were born, aren’t going to behave like parents who spent years caring about the well being of their children. She never has cared about the health and safety of her children, why would she start now?

When Kelly talks about her kids on their birthdays, she often talks about what a help they have been to HER. That’s how she sees her children. How they can help her in some way. She loves babies so she will shower attention on the babies of her children while seemingly ignoring the adult children. Even if they are sick or hurt. She may not be as blatantly narcissistic as JillRod, but she does see people as those that can help her in some way. How they can meet her needs. Not the other way around. 

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When Erin was sick with Covid and then her surgeries, Chad's mother came to stay with them in their tiny house and care for the kids. Now Chad and Erin are moving to Florida to (likely) be closer to his family. It is Evan's family that has been helping Carlin through her health crisis. I think the Bates girls all know they can't count on their mother and many have looked for that comfort elsewhere. 

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4 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

When Kelly talks about her kids on their birthdays, she often talks about what a help they have been to HER. That’s how she sees her children. How they can help her in some way. She loves babies so she will shower attention on the babies of her children while seemingly ignoring the adult children. Even if they are sick or hurt. She may not be as blatantly narcissistic as JillRod, but she does see people as those that can help her in some way. How they can meet her needs. Not the other way around. 

I have a different impression about the baby stage. Kelly might love her grandchildren/babies. Probably because she is only there to cuddle them. But she is not actually loving babies. She didn’t care for her own children as babies but only got more involved when they were older. So she likes her children age 10-21 (Callie, Jud and Jeb are just lucky to be her last ones so they get it earlier). She loves them when they can do things for her, act more as her friends without needing her. It holds up as long as they don’t bring her in a situation where she should step up though. So Carlin is great when she is happy and fit and produces lots of grandchildren, Kelly can love on for 5 minutes. But that’s not enough to actually help (cook, shop, clean, babysit, maybe just be there to encourage…) her very sick daughter. I wonder what Evan and the other in-laws think about this. To realise that you won’t get any substantial help if things get though…..

I mean sure, some people find the baby stage harder and prefer the day to day with older age groups. And it seems to be true that being a grandparent gives you another way of taking care of/connecting with the grandchild. Less responsibility, more time to just enjoy…. But Kelly’s behaviour towards her own children was really bad (neglectful and abusive is my take away), and her mindsets is so strange that those normal explanations just don’t cut it for me.

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How can she love her children in a meaningful way? There are too many of them. She can't possibly really know them. I have 3 kids and some days I feel like I don't have enough for all of them. I can't even imagine having 19. 

With 19 kids and all those pregnancies, how can you possible take time to savour the moments and to have special memories with each child and see them as individuals?  

The same also goes for why I am not surprised why there are siblings cliques because it seems impossible to have the same level of bond with 18 people with such a wide age range. 

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6 minutes ago, CanadianMamam said:

How can she love her children in a meaningful way? There are too many of them. She can't possibly really know them. I have 3 kids and some days I feel like I don't have enough for all of them. I can't even imagine having 19. 

With 19 kids and all those pregnancies, how can you possible take time to savour the moments and to have special memories with each child and see them as individuals?  

The same also goes for why I am not surprised why there are siblings cliques because it seems impossible to have the same level of bond with 18 people with such a wide age range. 

It’s easy to love. She probably loves her kids. But you can love your kid and neglect them, blanket train them, and ignore them when you have better things to do. I would say she may not have bonded with her kids when they were young. But she probably loves them. 

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28 minutes ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

It’s easy to love. She probably loves her ks. But you can love your kid and neglect them, blanket train them, and ignore them when you have better things to do. I would say she may not have bonded with her kids when they were young. But she probably loves them. 

I mean in one sense yes, she loves them because she is not a monster but to me part of love requires knowledge and I just don't thi k she can know them well enough to love them as individuals. 

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11 hours ago, CanadianMamam said:

Katie flew in from NJ to help Carlin. From the videos of the moving, other people are helping, Kelly is sitting around and cuddling babies. Which, sure watching the kids is needed but when it is all you are doing, it is not particularly helpful. 

 

Yeah, I also noticed that in all of Carlin’s Instagram stories, other family members are working on the house and Kelly is sitting in a lawn chair in the living room holding the baby. 

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On the Bates family subreddit, they call Kelly a "fair-weather mother". 

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I don't think Evan's parents or any of the Bates in laws are surprised to see how little Kelly cares about her children. They're in the same fundie circle after all. It's the norm. 

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The little Berries were all built different. Berry 1 was built like a football player, massive shoulders and a HUGE head. She was solid, but never had the chubby baby thing going. Berry 2 was soft, squishy, lousy muscle tone, but also not chubby. Berry 3 was scrawny, just so scrawny. he, in fact was..ugly. But we discovered he was in heart failure so of course he was scrawny. We got him on meds and he got cute. One day, though, I took him to the pediatrician because he seemed to be developing edema in his wrists and ankles. So I expressed my concern and the Dr kind of giggled and said, “BBG, that’s baby fat!” Said kid is now 6 foot 5.and damn good looking.

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On 6/14/2022 at 6:07 AM, CanadianMamam said:

Katie flew in from NJ to help Carlin. From the videos of the moving, other people are helping, Kelly is sitting around and cuddling babies. Which, sure watching the kids is needed but when it is all you are doing, it is not particularly helpful. 

 

They have a bunch of young adults around to help with the actual physical sorting and packing and moving — it is at least as important to have someone occupying the kids.  Moving with little kids around is really tough! It would be weirdly performative to insist Grandma move boxes while some strong 20 something cuddles toddlers. 
 

eta: this isn’t in defense of Kelly in particular, but of annoyance that Grandma helping keep babies out of the way is seen as “not helpful” or doing nothing. 

Edited by Mama Mia
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22 minutes ago, Mama Mia said:

They have a bunch of young adults around to help with the actual physical sorting and packing and moving — it is at least as important to have someone occupying the kids.  Moving with little kids around is really tough! It would be weirdly performative to insist Grandma move boxes while some strong 20 something cuddles toddlers. 

I suppose it’s foreign to me because my mom is such a physical worker type of person. She actually has a harder time coming up with good games to play with my kids. Maybe because she never had sons. She has to really put a lot of thought into what kind of things the kids might enjoy. But when it comes to moving, cleaning, organizing, yard work, cooking, etc, she can do it without much effort. It comes more natural to her. My mom is 67 so I’m not expecting her to move a couch. But if I was moving and she was around, I would have to force her to stay out of the organization and cleaning. It seems to me Kelly has always hated cleaning, cooking, laundry or any type of physical work. Which is ridiculous when you remember she chose to have 19 children. 

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1 hour ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I suppose it’s foreign to me because my mom is such a physical worker type of person. She actually has a harder time coming up with good games to play with my kids. Maybe because she never had sons. She has to really put a lot of thought into what kind of things the kids might enjoy. But when it comes to moving, cleaning, organizing, yard work, cooking, etc, she can do it without much effort. It comes more natural to her. My mom is 67 so I’m not expecting her to move a couch. But if I was moving and she was around, I would have to force her to stay out of the organization and cleaning. It seems to me Kelly has always hated cleaning, cooking, laundry or any type of physical work. Which is ridiculous when you remember she chose to have 19 children. 

Yea, as always, we relate it mostly to our own experiences. In my family one of my kids might like me helping with organizing or packing ( because he dithers worse than I do lol)  - but almost certainly the rest would rather have me watch the kids, because I’m better at that.  My mom would have driven me out of my mind if she was helping me move - but I 100% would have sent the kids to her house for the weekend. 

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I think part of the critisicm is that Carlin should be the one sitting down and resting. Her health is so fragile and ad her mother, Kelly should be trying to make things easier for her, encouraging her to take it easy. In normal circumstances, I would never Criticize a grandparent for watching the kids because that is an important task but honestly with Carlin's fragile health, it should be all hands on deck. 

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I know this is a Carlin/Evan forum, but on the subject of Kelly, they went to visit Alyssa last week.   And I know I shouldn't be surprised. But, Carlin is very sick.  They went to Florida for a vacation? I shouldn't be surprised. She's 'fair weather Kelly' but OMG. 

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