(CW&CSA) Josh & Anna 52: Sweeping Crackers for a Lower Sentence

[Dandruff]

1 hour ago, fundiefan said:

II would have serious reservations if my hypothetical kid came home & said he/she was dating the child of a serial child abuse doing time or recently released from federal prison,

Especially if the child's mother believed he was innocent.

[Smee]

I mean, it depends. If my kid came home with a girlfriend or boyfriend and said “oh yeah you might see their mum a few times but they’re not very close because she supported their dad. I’ve never met the dad by the way and I don’t plan to, he’s a pedophile creep.” Then I’d just want to offer love and stability to my child’s new partner as they left their family of origin. But if they announced that they were “courting” an 18 year old whose dad just got out of jail for possession of CSA materials and had given his blessing, but it was ok, he’s repented and found Jesus and was probably innocent anyway, and besides he’d be fine with any grandkids because his supportive wife will be there too… 

The M kids have a long slog ahead of them trying to form healthy relationships, whether in the cult or out.

[neuroticcat]

I think if Anna & the kids are still in the cult when they are young adults, there will absolutely be families lining up to court/pursue them. Just look at the defense letters! People are brainwashed and probably a good number believe Josh is innocent. Even if they don't, they might pity the kids or have some warped sense of Christian duty that means "forgive and forget" for Josh. Either way, it's narcissistic supply for the parents, and the whole cult revolves around that. 

I would hope that anyone who believes the allegations is having serious second thoughts about the cult, Duggar brand, all the false promises and gets the heck out. 

[Audrey2]

2 hours ago, fundiefan said:

I have to wonder how much luck they'll have marrying off their kids. I mean, Josh's brothers are still marrying post scandal, but they're brothers. It's easier to disassociate and in fact it's a good thing to not hold his brother's responsible for his actions. But, Josh's kids? The fruit of his loins? Does anyone think there will be seven families lining up to marry their kids to a Josh Duggar kid in the future? I would have serious reservations if my hypothetical kid came home & said he/she was dating the child of a serial child abuse doing time or recently released from federal prison, I don't think kids should be held accountable for their father's action anymore than brother's should be - but the connection is closer & as in laws you'd share grandkids & have to associate with him....nope. And, going back to what has been said, the M kids are begin told their father is a godly man - so they will have a very skewed idea of what that means as adults. I would be very scared as a parent of what they think it means to be "godly". 

 

I think Jill Rodrigues would be fine marrying one or more of her daughters to Josh's boys. Her sons are a bit older, so they would be less likely.

[Kayleigh83]

My guess with Anna and Amy is that Anna just doesn’t follow her, but hasn’t blocked Amy. Reason being that Anna is tagged in the post, and I don’t believe you can do that with someone who has blocked you.

My feelings regarding what Amy said? Short version is: she’s right and she should say it.

This horrific cult her family is in thrives on secrecy and lies and hiding things. Given that context, speaking out publicly like this really feels like the right move. I do feel like it’s maybe a little performative if you want to put it that way, but I also feel like for her, being a little performative doesn’t make it inauthentic? It’s kind of part of her personality.

Whether it will have any impact with Anna is besides the point, it was obviously something Amy needed to get off her chest. And given the horrific things that Josh has done (and Anna and the rest of the Duggars have enabled) and the ripple effect that has on so many people including Amy, in my eyes she’s more than entitled to get her two cents in.

 

[SorenaJ]

4 hours ago, Audrey2 said:

I think Jill Rodrigues would be fine marrying one or more of her daughters to Josh's boys. Her sons are a bit older, so they would be less likely.

I agree. Jill wouldn't mind a Michael/Marcus/Mason match with Olivia/Sadie/Sofia/Janessa. 

Perhaps a Spivey as well. I don't think Hilary Spivey would mind a Carson(girl)-Marcus/Mason, Taylor(boy)-Meredith, or Wyatt-Mackynzie match. 

She would do a thumbs up to that! 

 

[Alisamer]

On the kids marrying, I think it totally depends on the situation at the time. Dad's been in prison for several years and is expected to get out soon? I could see a potential spouse's parents being like "Yeah, let's get them married and out of the house before that pervert is sent home again." I think the girls might not have trouble too much, people might be super sympathetic and happy to have them marry in to a more functional (hopefully) family. The boys, they might have to deal with the "sins of the father" suspicions, but hopefully not. 

Mackenzie is what, 13? I hope Josh is behind bars long enough for her to become an adult and get out of the house, whatever form that takes. I really think Josh's older kids might be the ones who end up leaving and telling all - they are old enough to begin to understand what Josh did, and no amount of sheltering will keep them away from the gossip, most likely. I could see one of them noping out of the family once they got a chance. Hopefully getting therapy, as well.  

[samurai_sarah]

posted in the wrong thread

Edited May 20, 2022 by samurai_sarah

[Dandruff]

I doubt that many families would be OK with Josh as an in-law, especially given the probability of sharing grandchildren.

[Hane]

Their blithe use of the term “Godly” nauseates me. It’s code for “I’m all Jesusy and saved, and blather the right jargon, so I’m automatically better than those outsiders and thus deserve a free pass.”

[Shannonsnarks]

13 hours ago, Audrey2 said:

I think Jill Rodrigues would be fine marrying one or more of her daughters to Josh's boys. Her sons are a bit older, so they would be less likely.

Jill despite her statements otherwise would severely love to be famous 

[hoipolloi]

On 5/19/2022 at 4:59 AM, Alisamer said:

To them, there's only "good" and "evil". You're "saved" or you aren't. You are going to heaven or you are going to hell. It's either eternal wonderfulness or eternal suffering. 

This + the widespread fundie practice of sin-flattening, in which all evils are equally bad. Sin-flattening allows those who push this "doctrine" to equate, e.g., underpaying your tithes with pedophilia. Just say you repent and you're all good, no matter what sin you committed! 

I doubt that Anna is or can be a competent parent to her children. At best, sheʻs incredibly stupid or naive. I also think she should divorce her monster of husband but it appears there is little or no support for that option in her immediate milieu -- especially the family & other adults that she sees or communicates with regularly.

Not only that, AFAIK, there is no case in that crowd where a criminal husband or father was brought to justice AND his victims were supported in the way that the SʻMortons rallied around Katie and her children or the Willis family came together to denounce their father & stand together. Anna has no template for taking such an action and it looks like the fucking assholes around her -- Jim Bob, Michelle, her parents -- will never allow her to do so.

 

 

[Hazelbunny]

5 hours ago, Hane said:

Their blithe use of the term “Godly” nauseates me. It’s code for “I’m all Jesusy and saved, and blather the right jargon, so I’m automatically better than those outsiders and thus deserve a free pass.”

The Bible-passage with Jesus, the Temple and the Pharisees comes to mind... 

And I guess it is also lack of vocabulary... 

[Duggadict]

I am surprised nobody mentioned Matthew 18:4-6 in any of their IG 

4Therefore, whoever takes the lowly position of this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven. 5And whoever welcomes one such child in my name welcomes me

6“If anyone causes one of these little ones—those who believe in me—to stumble, it would be better for them to have a large millstone hung around their neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea

 

 

I shook the pest’s hands many years ago at a UARK games… still scrubbing 

Edited May 20, 2022 by Duggadict

[Father Son Holy Goat]

22 hours ago, neuroticcat said:

I think if Anna & the kids are still in the cult when they are young adults, there will absolutely be families lining up to court/pursue them. Just look at the defense letters! People are brainwashed and probably a good number believe Josh is innocent. Even if they don't, they might pity the kids or have some warped sense of Christian duty that means "forgive and forget" for Josh. Either way, it's narcissistic supply for the parents, and the whole cult revolves around that. 

I would hope that anyone who believes the allegations is having serious second thoughts about the cult, Duggar brand, all the false promises and gets the heck out. 

There’s other variables at play here like the finances of the M kids, can Jim Bob afford to help launch the M kids? Will the Duggar connection still mean money? There’s also the M kids’ attractiveness, which might be all a potential young fundie looks at like Jessa and Ben did. 
 

7 hours ago, hoipolloi said:

This + the widespread fundie practice of sin-flattening, in which all evils are equally bad. Sin-flattening allows those who push this "doctrine" to equate, e.g., underpaying your tithes with pedophilia. Just say you repent and you're all good, no matter what sin you committed! 

I doubt that Anna is or can be a competent parent to her children. At best, sheʻs incredibly stupid or naive. I also think she should divorce her monster of husband but it appears there is little or no support for that option in her immediate milieu -- especially the family & other adults that she sees or communicates with regularly.

Not only that, AFAIK, there is no case in that crowd where a criminal husband or father was brought to justice AND his victims were supported in the way that the SʻMortons rallied around Katie and her children or the Willis family came together to denounce their father & stand together. Anna has no template for taking such an action and it looks like the fucking assholes around her -- Jim Bob, Michelle, her parents -- will never allow her to do so.

 

 

Thank you for posting this, I never knew the term sin flattening but I certainly know what it is.
 

3 hours ago, Duggadict said:

I am surprised nobody mentioned Matthew 18:4-6 in any of their IG 

4Therefore, whoever takes the lowly position of this child is the greatest in the kingdom of heaven. 5And whoever welcomes one such child in my name welcomes me

6“If anyone causes one of these little ones—those who believe in me—to stumble, it would be better for them to have a large millstone hung around their neck and to be drowned in the depths of the sea

 

 

I shook the pest’s hands many years ago at a UARK games… still scrubbing 

Enjoy your millstone Josh! 

[onekidanddone]

Right before Josh’s arrest, a flurry of the howlers were married off in quick succession. Jim Bob knew this was coming and figured not many fundy fathers would want their daughters to be under a Duggar umbrella of horrors authority. 

[Bluebirdbluebell]

46 minutes ago, onekidanddone said:

Right before Josh’s arrest, a flurry of the howlers were married off in quick succession. Jim Bob knew this was coming and figured not many fundy fathers would want their daughters to be under a Duggar umbrella of horrors authority. 

I respectfully disagree. I think Jim Bob for the most part just wants his kids married. He made that clear on television. JB himself was 19 when he got married and he married off most of his kids around the same age. I also think that a lot of fundie families have trouble making matches early on, but once they figure out a strategy a lot of their kids get married. The families of the last three brides seem to still be as close to the Duggars as they were before the news broke. Hillary Spivey supported Josh at trial, The Nakatsus still live in Arkansas, and the Wissmans' daughter married after the verdict. 

[Jackie3]

10 hours ago, hoipolloi said:

Not only that, AFAIK, there is no case in that crowd where a criminal husband or father was brought to justice AND his victims were supported in the way that the SʻMortons rallied around Katie and her children or the Willis family came together to denounce their father & stand together.

The Willis family is not a good example. Brenda had known for over a decade that Toby was raping their daughters (a daughter told her). She chose to look the other way. Then when he was arrested, she suddenly decided to denounce him.

Brenda Willis handled things a lot like Anna is handling them--by being in denial. And sacrificing your children to maintain that denial. Brenda denounced her husband AFTER he was arrested--when she had no other choice.

In a way, Brenda is much worse than Anna, since we have no evidence the M children have been harmed. The Willis girls were repeatedly raped over a period of many years. 

Edited May 21, 2022 by Jackie3

[Jrodseyeliner]

3 hours ago, Jackie3 said:

The Willis family is not a good example. Brenda had known for over a decade that Toby was raping their daughters (a daughter told her). She chose to look the other way. Then when he was arrested, she suddenly decided to denounce him.

Brenda Willis handled things a lot like Anna is handling them--by being in denial. And sacrificing your children to maintain that denial. Brenda denounced her husband AFTER he was arrested--when she had no other choice.

In a way, Brenda is much worse than Anna, since we have no evidence the M children have been harmed. The Willis girls were repeatedly raped over a period of many years. 

I am going to say that Brenda was also probably a victim of Toby and DV as well… 

[Jana814]

1 hour ago, Jrodseyeliner said:

I am going to say that Brenda was also probably a victim of Toby and DV as well… 

I think she was. I think I heard that somewhere. 

[Red Hair, Black Dress]

Anyone besides me think that Anna will get knocked up with M #8 and announce the pregnancy in hopes of the judge giving a light sentence?  Can't have the gody Joshly sent away for 15+ when he's got to be a daddy to #8.

If he is sent away for 15+ think of the optics of poor Anna struggling to have #8 all alone and then raising her howlers while "godly Joshly the Innocent" is unjustly imprisoned.  Appeals for a early release would abound.

I wouldn't put it past JB to suggest this plan.  Anyone else thinking this or am I too cynical?

[Cheetah]

13 minutes ago, Red Hair, Black Dress said:

Anyone besides me think that Anna will get knocked up with M #8 and announce the pregnancy in hopes of the judge giving a light sentence?  Can't have the gody Joshly sent away for 15+ when he's got to be a daddy to #8.

If he is sent away for 15+ think of the optics of poor Anna struggling to have #8 all alone and then raising her howlers while "godly Joshly the Innocent" is unjustly imprisoned.  Appeals for a early release would abound.

I wouldn't put it past JB to suggest this plan.  Anyone else thinking this or am I too cynical?

She would have had to get pregnant back in early December at the latest for that to happen... so would be nearly 6 months along by now.  

[Mama Mia]

9 minutes ago, Red Hair, Black Dress said:

Anyone besides me think that Anna will get knocked up with M #8 and announce the pregnancy in hopes of the judge giving a light sentence?  Can't have the gody Joshly sent away for 15+ when he's got to be a daddy to #8.

If he is sent away for 15+ think of the optics of poor Anna struggling to have #8 all alone and then raising her howlers while "godly Joshly the Innocent" is unjustly imprisoned.  Appeals for a early release would abound.

I wouldn't put it past JB to suggest this plan.  Anyone else thinking this or am I too cynical?

I’m fairly certain if it was a possibility, Anna would loooovvveee to have an M8. But he’s been locked away since M7 was 6? Weeks old. So unless Anna somehow got pregnant super fast, that’s not an option. Currently her only shot at an M8 is if Josh gets a short enough sentence to play  beat the clock with her fertility. 

[anjulibai]

I said this on the Priscilla and David Waller thread, but Anna has about 9 years of fertility left, so Josh needs a sentence of at least 9 years to avoid another M'kid. I'm really hoping for at least 12, as that will really put away any possibility. 

[imokit]

If Josh is still with Anna when he gets out (at this point he's just as likely to leave her on getting out of prison as she is to leave him), I can see them going down the fertility treatment route for a miracle late 40s/early 50s redemption baby.