Extremists Making Inroads Into Orthodox Churches

[47of74]

Now reich wingers are infiltrating orthodox churches. 

Quote

When Sarah Riccardi-Swartz moved from New York City to a small Appalachian town in West Virginia in the fall of 2017, she was searching for an answer to a puzzling question. Why had a group of conservative American Christians converted to Russian Orthodoxy?

"It's typically an immigrant faith, so I was really interested in that experience and why it spoke to converts," said Riccardi-Swartz, a postdoctoral fellow in the Recovering Truth project at Arizona State University.

Riccardi-Swartz's study focused on a community of mostly former evangelical Christians and Catholics who had joined the Russian Orthodox Church Outside of Russia (ROCOR). The West Virginia location, in addition to having a church parish, was also home to the largest English-speaking Russian Orthodox monastery in the world.

Over a year of doing research, Riccardi-Swartz learned that many of these converts had grown disillusioned with social and demographic change in the United States. In ROCOR, they felt they had found a church that has remained the same, regardless of place, time and politics. But Riccardi-Swartz also found strong strains of nativism, white nationalism and pro-authoritarianism, evidenced by strong admiration for Russian President Vladimir Putin.

Article goes on to mention a former Russian orthodox member in an interracial marriage whose African American husband was accepted when they married 40 years ago but not so much now. She left for a different branch of orthodoxy when her Russian orthodox priest refused to condemn Vlad the Invader’s attack on Ukraine. 

[danvillebelle]

I used to occasionally send donations to that monastery in WV.  Nothing they ever put out struck me as extremist, but I know that ROCOR attracts diehard fundies who get disillusioned with Protestantism, and the parish there may have attracted some of those.  We briefly attended a ROCOR parish around 2005-06.  The priest has since gone completely off the deep end IMO and become more and more Orthodox fundie.  

The parish where we converted in the 90's was very Russian-oriented but ultimately ended up in the Bulgarian jurisdiction.  There are good people there whom I will always love, including Ukrainian friends, whom they are wholeheartedly supporting. 

All that said - I'm glad I left Orthodoxy.  I'm much happier without it.

[hoipolloi]

7 minutes ago, danvillebelle said:

ROCOR attracts diehard fundies who get disillusioned with Protestantism

Exhibit A would be Rod Dreher who started life as a Methodist, converted to Roman Catholicism as a young adult and then left the RC Church over pedophile priests to become Orthodox, which he still is. He used to be a somewhat whiny conservative who promoted a "crunchy" lifestyle as being more godly but has become much worse over the years -- extreme homophobia & transphobia mixed in with a major Xtian persecution complex. Canʻt say I blame his soon-to-be-ex-wife for filing divorce papers. It would be awful to share a home with someone like Dreher.

Re: ROCOR in the US. Canʻt find it in a google search now, but some years ago there was a long-form piece of reporting on the role Russian Orthodox immigrants in the Pacific NW played in hate crimes directed at BIPOC and LGBTQ communities. IIRC, many of these immigrants belonged to churches that fomented hatred of the "others" although the churches themselves were careful not to call openly for violence. The links were pretty clear, though.

[danvillebelle]

I didn't know about his divorce, but I'm not surprised.  He's pretty fucking insufferable.

ETA: your mention of Rod made me think of Frederica Mathewes-Green (because she mentioned meeting him in one of her books).  I went and did a little Googling and found out Frederica's daughter Megan is now a Unitarian pastor, married to a woman (and still on good terms with her Orthodox family).  That made me smile.

Edited May 10, 2022 by danvillebelle

[47of74]

3 hours ago, hoipolloi said:

Exhibit A would be Rod Dreher who started life as a Methodist, converted to Roman Catholicism as a young adult and then left the RC Church over pedophile priests to become Orthodox, which he still is. He used to be a somewhat whiny conservative who promoted a "crunchy" lifestyle as being more godly but has become much worse over the years -- extreme homophobia & transphobia mixed in with a major Xtian persecution complex. Canʻt say I blame his soon-to-be-ex-wife for filing divorce papers. It would be awful to share a home with someone like Dreher.

Yeah he seems nice - he was once sued for posting pictures from a 15 year old girl's Instagram account as a way of harassing the girl and her family.

Quote

Two parents who claim their daughter was expelled from a Louisville Christian school for celebrating her birthday with a rainbow-themed cake are suing the school as well as a conservative news outlet. 

The lawsuit accuses Whitefield Academy of breach of contract by not following its disciplinary procedures before expelling the 15-year-old girl and effectively outing her as gay.

It accuses The American Conservative magazine of defamation and invasion of privacy through an article headlined "Rainbow Cake Girl: The True Story" that shared photos from the girl's Instagram account and accused her mother, Kimberly Alford, of duping "the mainstream media" regarding her expulsion.

Other defendants are Bruce Jacobson, head of school at Whitefield Academy; Rod Dreher, author of The American Conservative article; and the American Ideas Institute, which publishes the magazine.

 

[hoipolloi]

Rod Dreher has also spent the past few years leg-humping Viktor Orban of Hungary -- as if we need more proof he's a fucking asshole.

[MamaJunebug]

Interesting.  Various parts of Orthodoxy “speak” to me, and I’m satisfied that it has to do with some Eastern European / Western Asian DNA.
 

 I looked into one pan-ethnic Congregation that had set up operations within easy distance of my nest.  Know what sealed the deal to cease investigating right then LP & there?

ALL-male clergy.
I mean, Duck-Dynasty-bearded,

clerical headwear indoors wearing,

gathered around a lunch table post-service with a few layMEN, MAYBE,

with plates of food prepared by … I'm just gonna guess … some ladies of the congregation, as no cleric’s robes showed signs of spaghetti sauce stains.

Ha ha ha. 
 

Nope-ity noped it right off my list. 
 

Although I do plan soon to visit a Ukrainian Orthodox Church in a friend’s neighborhood.  Just to show solidarity and share in a prayer. 

Edited May 11, 2022 by MamaJunebug

[Hane]

When I was in high school in the late ‘60s, one of the girls got married during her junior year—and wasn’t pregnant. She was Russian Orthodox, and the only thing I remember her saying about her religion was that the Mass was two hours long. IIRC, she did graduate from high school.

(Another non-pregnant but secular girl got married at 17, and also went on to graduate. It wasn’t usual, but wasn’t considered nearly as strange back then as it is now.)

[MamaJunebug]

2 hours ago, Hane said:

When I was in high school in the late ‘60s, one of the girls got married during her junior year—and wasn’t pregnant. She was Russian Orthodox, and the only thing I remember her saying about her religion was that the Mass was two hours long. IIRC, she did graduate from high school.

(Another non-pregnant but secular girl got married at 17, and also went on to graduate. It wasn’t usual, but wasn’t considered nearly as strange back then as it is now.)

In my research, I read that “visitors may be a little confused to see parishioners arrive st various times during the service & seem to walk around the sanctuary without regard for what the priest is doing at any given time,”. Thus a two-hour Mass might not mean a full 2-hour commitment. But I also distinctly recall reading that in some churches there are few pews snd those thst are there are reserved for old folk.  
 

Which I am!  But I’m well prepared to make a drop-in, drop-out appearance !! All done with utmost discretion and respect, of course! 

[Coconut Flan]

First it's usually called Divine Liturgy in English.  When they reference people walking around, they're usually lighting candles or honoring Icons.  Many churches try to discourage this once the actual liturgy starts and it shouldn't be regardless of what the priest is doing.  During prayers, processions, reading the Gospel, the sermon, etc., parishioners should remain still.  

I attended a parish with pews which a lot of American Orthodox churches now have.  Some Greek churches in the US have gone so American as to have organs.    

Divine Liturgy is usually a 2 hour and possibly more commitment.  I do know one priest who can manage a 90 minute liturgy, but he's a bit rare.  His sermons never exceed 5 minutes.  

Edited May 11, 2022 by Coconut Flan

[MamaJunebug]

6 hours ago, Coconut Flan said:

Divine Liturgy is usually a 2 hour and possibly more commitment. 

Thank you for the insights. I did attend an orthodox infant baptism snd it was wonderful on many levels. 
 

And the church had pews! 

[danvillebelle]

In my limited experience, Greek churches (which have often been around much longer) tend to have pews and be more assimilated into the American church milieu.  

Yes, Liturgy is around 2 hours long.  When you're a reader and leading all the music and the chanting, which I did for a brief period, it goes by in a flash.