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[JermajestyDuggar]

I personally have had my maiden name mispronounced all my life and now have my married name mispronounced. Neither name is long. One has 6 letters and one has 5. They are names that are German and English. They are just fairly uncommon (in the US). So no one pronounces them right. It’s very annoying so I made sure to choose very easy to pronounce and easy to spell first names for my kids. Because no one will ever pronounce their last name right. 

[AprilQuilt]

34 minutes ago, SassyPants said:

This is why I do not advocate for people in say America to name their kids such because where the kids live, are educated and socialize will constantly be correcting pronunciations or spellings. You can’t expect people around the globe to recognize and differentiate all other languages, pronunciations and spellings. Just the reality… I would not burden my kids like that. And yes, continually having to correct , repeat your name would get old reallllllly quick.

I really disagree with this. If someone is from X place or culture, why should they not name their children from that place or culture? The onus being on minorities to assimilate rather than on the majority culture to accommodate or accept really grinds my gears. As a kid I went to a school with quite a high Sri Lankan population, ie Tamil refugees or their children. A couple went by, say, Abby instead of Abhirami, or Nisha rather than Nishanthini but for the most part it was the full Tamil name no compromises or nicknames. Teachers would always stumble over them and we would always laugh at them because they were straightforward enough once you were familiar with their principles. I'm really grateful I went to such a multicultural school (after my first school was tiny and rural and white northern English) and learned through exposure that I can learn to pronounce anyone's name and it's my duty to do that.

I understand that these things look complicated when you're totally new to them but learning how to pronounce a name even when it seems daunting is a mark of respect and one we'd probably all want to have extended to ourselves. Nobody's name is too complicated to learn to pronounce properly: it's their first identity and it's part of acknowledging them as a whole human, not the version of them that is most convenient to us. None of us know where we're going to end up so trying to pre-empt acceptance through naming is not necessarily going to work.

Edited January 25, 2023 by AprilQuilt

[viii]

Nobody should have to sacrifice their identity and culture for my comfort. I have zero issues learning how to pronounce new names. It might take me a few tries but I will always attempt my best. After all, there was a time when names like Smith and Johnson were brand new names to North America as well… 

[Cam]

I have a common last name, my first name is not common. I always give my last name when the situation calls for a name to be given, like a reservation or food pick-up. I can tell you, I love the simplicity of never needing to decipher or spell it for someone. It really does make life simpler. This would be in fast paced environments where you’re not getting to know another person. 
 

In more long term circumstances, I remember correct pronunciation of names and always honor what a person wants to be called. Back in the 90s, I remember asking a young girl her name and then repeated it:” Oh, Rhiannon!” I could instantly tell by the look on her face she was relieved I knew exactly what she’d said. I was of course a huge Fleetwood Mac fan, but I’m sure she encountered plenty of people who’d never heard the song and had no clue what her name was. I used to get the confused looks when I was a child with an unusual name. People wanted to hear Susie, Judy or Linda. Anyway, I told her it was a beautiful name. Of course its heard more frequently these days and this year Rhiannon is headlining Superbowl halftime.

Edited January 25, 2023 by Cam

[Shannonsnarks]

As a Shannon I feel the names that once were popular and don’t seem to be making a comeback 

was a big 70s name and moderately popular up until 2000s I was born in the 90s and now you never hear it. 

[libgirl2]

My last name is a first name. When I go to the pharmacy, I will say it and they always say "the last name". I've learned to say "that is the last name" right off the bat. 

[kittykay]

I have a very simple first name...Mary.  I cannot begin to say how many times, when asked my name, it is misspelled as Marry.  Countless.  I do not pronounce it as "marry" as in to wed.  Simple Mary.  Still can't get it right.

[KWLand]

2 minutes ago, kittykay said:

I have a very simple first name...Mary.  I cannot begin to say how many times, when asked my name, it is misspelled as Marry.  Countless.  I do not pronounce it as "marry" as in to wed.  Simple Mary.  Still can't get it right.

I pronounce merry, marry and Mary the same but would assume a name is Mary.  Haven’t seen a Mary spell it with two Rs

[SassyPants]

4 hours ago, Cam said:

I have a common last name, my first name is not common. I always give my last name when the situation calls for a name to be given, like a reservation or food pick-up. I can tell you, I love the simplicity of never needing to decipher or spell it for someone. It really does make life simpler. This would be in fast paced environments where you’re not getting to know another person. 
 

In more long term circumstances, I remember correct pronunciation of names and always honor what a person wants to be called. Back in the 90s, I remember asking a young girl her name and then repeated it:” Oh, Rhiannon!” I could instantly tell by the look on her face she was relieved I knew exactly what she’d said. I was of course a huge Fleetwood Mac fan, but I’m sure she encountered plenty of people who’d never heard the song and had no clue what her name was. I used to get the confused looks when I was a child with an unusual name. People wanted to hear Susie, Judy or Linda. Anyway, I told her it was a beautiful name. Of course its heard more frequently these days and this year Rhiannon is headlining Superbowl halftime.

Yep. When you live this everyday you have an experience that affects your perspective. When I used to be asked my last name before I married, I always said, “I’ll spell it.” If I just pronounced the name, people would never be able to identify or spell it. Again, it’s an unnecessary burden when it’s something that affects your daily encounters-

[Cam]

17 hours ago, Shannonsnarks said:

As a Shannon I feel the names that once were popular and don’t seem to be making a comeback 

was a big 70s name and moderately popular up until 2000s I was born in the 90s and now you never hear it. 

You probably know Shannon was a big 70s name due to a massive 1976 hit song of the same name. First, I think Shannon is absolutely beautiful. But I hated the song even tho it was a huge hit. I didn’t care for the falsetto vocals and the story was about a dog which was way too sad for me. (Even now, I won’t post the lyrics here). Thing is, my boyfriend at the time whom I was mmmadly in love with, totally loved this song. He was kind of a hardass so I was surprised he was so into it. Years later after we split, he married and named his first daughter Shannon. His brother also named a daughter Shannon!

 

15 hours ago, KWLand said:

I pronounce merry, marry and Mary the same but would assume a name is Mary.  Haven’t seen a Mary spell it with two Rs

I had a seventh grade substitute English teacher who taught us merry, marry and Mary are actually pronounced differently.

merry - mare-y
marry - maa-ry (like a sheep saying baa, only maa)
Mary - may-ree

Why have I never forgotten that all these years later?! Of course I say them all the same.

 

Edited January 26, 2023 by Cam

[Knight of Ni]

There is a little girl named Khaleesi in my daughter's karate class. I really don't think that name will age well.

[KWLand]

I was in college when I discovered I pronounce my first name and the word crayon incorrectly.  Both are regional and I went to a college in a different region. Less than 4 hours from where I grew up and was asked regularly where down south was I from.  They didn’t believe it was the same state.

I recently discovered I had been saying my maiden name incorrectly.  Mom and I drop the last sound, dad says it but there isn’t much emphasis.

my kids make fun of me for saying pin for pen.  I really can’t hear the difference so to say them differently takes effort.

My youngest asked me to take a video, where she spoke to her grandma to let her know one plays in a creek and not a crick.

different pronunciations of words intrigue me.  Names especially.  

[Meggo]

11 minutes ago, KWLand said:

I was in college when I discovered I pronounce my first name and the word crayon incorrectly.  Both are regional and I went to a college in a different region. Less than 4 hours from where I grew up and was asked regularly where down south was I from.  They didn’t believe it was the same state.

I recently discovered I had been saying my maiden name incorrectly.  Mom and I drop the last sound, dad says it but there isn’t much emphasis.

my kids make fun of me for saying pin for pen.  I really can’t hear the difference so to say them differently takes effort.

My youngest asked me to take a video, where she spoke to her grandma to let her know one plays in a creek and not a crick.

different pronunciations of words intrigue me.  Names especially.  

Weirdly- my mom, who has lived in almost all the places I hate - says Min and pin for men and pen. It's regional - and one would expect that she-who-taught-me-to-speak would have the same accent/inflection on those that I do - but we don't. 
Crayon - I could go either way... 

[lumpentheologie]

23 hours ago, AprilQuilt said:

I really disagree with this. If someone is from X place or culture, why should they not name their children from that place or culture? The onus being on minorities to assimilate rather than on the majority culture to accommodate or accept really grinds my gears. As a kid I went to a school with quite a high Sri Lankan population, ie Tamil refugees or their children. A couple went by, say, Abby instead of Abhirami, or Nisha rather than Nishanthini but for the most part it was the full Tamil name no compromises or nicknames. Teachers would always stumble over them and we would always laugh at them because they were straightforward enough once you were familiar with their principles. I'm really grateful I went to such a multicultural school (after my first school was tiny and rural and white northern English) and learned through exposure that I can learn to pronounce anyone's name and it's my duty to do that.

I understand that these things look complicated when you're totally new to them but learning how to pronounce a name even when it seems daunting is a mark of respect and one we'd probably all want to have extended to ourselves. Nobody's name is too complicated to learn to pronounce properly: it's their first identity and it's part of acknowledging them as a whole human, not the version of them that is most convenient to us. None of us know where we're going to end up so trying to pre-empt acceptance through naming is not necessarily going to work.

I think two different things are being talked about in this discussion. The first is that everyone has a right to have people try to pronounce their name properly, including people with “foreign” names, and I think we all support that.

The second is whether names sound like they’re spelled, which is much more debatable. In the US names and things that go in official documents are assumed to be spelled in the English alphabet. We don’t, for example, let people spell their names in Cyrillic, Greek, Arabic, or other alphabets. It’s  supposed to be readable in the main language of the country we all live in. Irish uses Roman characters so it slips in unnoticed, while having pronunciation rules that are about as different from English as you get. 
 

If you (general you) name your kid using the Irish alphabet in the US you’re giving them a name that’s only spelled how it sounds in a language that virtually no one that child encounters will ever learn. It’s totally your freedom to do that, but then you can’t really expect people to think it sounds like it’s spelled. And having a name that’s constantly mispronounced because it’s in an alphabet no one knows can be othering and a hardship. If you view that hardship as worth it in the face of preserving culture though, that’s up to you. And historically, I understand why the Irish may not give a fuck if their names are pronounceable in English. 

[Scrabblemaster]

I pronounce my first name different from what it would be spelled in german if it was a noun. I suppose it is a regional accent, I spell the first vocal ( it is an 'e') short instead of long. The same does my best friend with her name, although she grew up in a different region. Everybody knew us as and called us like we introduced us. Except this one woman, the wife of our german teacher who told us that we pronounced our names wrong. Shy girls we were ( I think we were 17) told her very politely tha this is how we always were called and that we call ourselves like that.  She insisted she was right. She was annoying. If that happened to me again I would be polite at first, but after that arrogant insisting I would absolutely tell this bitch to fuck off. Well, of course now I am older, at that moment is would have been not wise to tell  your teachers wife to fuck off. 

@KWLand It is your name, you own it, you pronounce it.  You do not pronounce your own name wrong. You pronounce it the way you were named. 

Excuse the harsh language but your post ringed a bell that always felt wrong. 

 

[Mama Mia]

20 minutes ago, KWLand said:

I was in college when I discovered I pronounce my first name and the word crayon incorrectly.  Both are regional and I went to a college in a different region. Less than 4 hours from where I grew up and was asked regularly where down south was I from.  They didn’t believe it was the same state.

I recently discovered I had been saying my maiden name incorrectly.  Mom and I drop the last sound, dad says it but there isn’t much emphasis.

my kids make fun of me for saying pin for pen.  I really can’t hear the difference so to say them differently takes effort.

My youngest asked me to take a video, where she spoke to her grandma to let her know one plays in a creek and not a crick.

different pronunciations of words intrigue me.  Names especially.  

They aren’t “wrong” pronunciations , they are just different based on region. There are lots of fun on-line quizzes that will pin-point where you are from based on questions like if you hear/say Mary, merry and marry as the same or different (they are all the same to me) .  And words you use for common objects/events/greetings. I’ve done several and they always get my general area right, to within 100 miles.  

[JMO]

On 1/4/2023 at 2:02 PM, Meggo said:

I'm a Meghan. And growing up in the 70s - I think I knew exactly two, and they were Megan's. Add in a few Irish Setters and Golden Retrievers.... 

Now we're apparently everywhere. 

I was born in the 70's and had 4 friends named Meghan/Maeghan/Megan/Megan, at one point 3 of them were in the same friend group at the same time.  Made things interesting. 

[KWLand]

I definitely shouldn’t have used the word wrong in regards to pronunciations that are regional.  Thanks for pointing that out.

I do mispronounce my name based on the English language. It’s probably a mixture of regional and my speech impediment.  I just laugh that it wasn’t until college that it was questioned.  

[medimus]

2 hours ago, lumpentheologie said:

If you (general you) name your kid using the Irish alphabet in the US you’re giving them a name that’s only spelled how it sounds in a language that virtually no one that child encounters will ever learn. It’s totally your freedom to do that, but then you can’t really expect people to think it sounds like it’s spelled. And having a name that’s constantly mispronounced because it’s in an alphabet no one knows can be othering and a hardship. If you view that hardship as worth it in the face of preserving culture though, that’s up to you. And historically, I understand why the Irish may not give a fuck if their names are pronounceable in English. 

But it isn’t a different alphabet, just different orthography and pronunciation, like French or Norwegian or German. Irish is not unique in being a language that isn’t English. Of course depending on country you live in you can’t expect random people to know how to pronounce it off the bat if they are reading it for the first time, but if someone tells you what their name is please just call them that, if you can’t make the sounds fine, but do your best.

7 hours ago, Cam said:

You probably know Shannon was a big 70s name due to a massive 1976 hit song of the same name. First, I think Shannon is absolutely beautiful. But I hated the song even tho it was a huge hit. I didn’t care for the falsetto vocals and the story was about a dog which was way too sad for me. (Even now, I won’t post the lyrics here). Thing is, my boyfriend at the time whom I was mmmadly in love with, totally loved this song. He was kind of a hardass so I was surprised he was so into it. Years later after we split, he married and named his first daughter Shannon. His brother also named a daughter Shannon!

 

I had a seventh grade substitute English teacher who taught us merry, marry and Mary are actually pronounced differently.

merry - mare-y
marry - maa-ry (like a sheep saying baa, only maa)
Mary - may-ree

Why have I never forgotten that all these years later?! Of course I say them all the same.

 

Accents are funny and interesting. I do pronounce all three words differently, but definitely not as you have written out.

Merry: meh-ree

marry: mah-ree

Mary: Mare (as in a female horse) ree

[Smee]

Certain Irish names are popular enough to be instantly recognisable to me, and I guess as more of them are used outside of Ireland, that familiarity will grow. Siobhan is one that I must have encountered somewhere in childhood (though I don’t remember having a childhood friend by that name) because I feel like I’ve always just KNOWN how it’s pronounced and thought nothing of it. Kind of like how if I was a teacher looking at a class list and saw Javier I’m not going to say “jay-vee-uh”. I bet there are a lot of names common to America that I wouldn’t recognise/intuitively pronounce because they are popular amongst Latinx communities. Likewise in Australia, Lachlan and Hamish have been in the top 100 for decades, but that doesn’t mean they’re so well known in other English speaking countries. 

[Irishy]

Often an Irish name will be pronounced differently in different parts of the island which is even more confusing. Saoirse Ronan is from the east and she’s leaning towards Seer Shah. In the north it would be more like Sur Shah. Máire is the Irish for Mary and it would be pronounced Moira in the south, east and west and Moya in the north. 
 

But I love that as an English speaking country (through colonisation), we have revived and retain our culture somewhat through names. Irish names are still really popular.

Edited January 26, 2023 by Irishy

[patsymae]

9 hours ago, Cam said:

You probably know Shannon was a big 70s name due to a massive 1976 hit song of the same name. First, I think Shannon is absolutely beautiful. But I hated the song even tho it was a huge hit. I didn’t care for the falsetto vocals and the story was about a dog which was way too sad for me. (Even now, I won’t post the lyrics here). Thing is, my boyfriend at the time whom I was mmmadly in love with, totally loved this song. He was kind of a hardass so I was surprised he was so into it. Years later after we split, he married and named his first daughter Shannon. His brother also named a daughter Shannon!

 

I had a seventh grade substitute English teacher who taught us merry, marry and Mary are actually pronounced differently.

merry - mare-y
marry - maa-ry (like a sheep saying baa, only maa)
Mary - may-ree

Why have I never forgotten that all these years later?! Of course I say them all the same.

 

I say Merry Meh-ree, marry MA (a like in apple) re, and Mary like MARE-ee. New Jersey here.
Then again, my name is spelled Patricia and pronounced Pa-TREE-sha, which was not uncommon where and when I was growing up. I use a nickname, but if I say my full name the way it should be (and I like it) pronouned, I get either a blank stare or a Pa-TRISH-a right back. Not going to die on that horse, though.

[Hera]

13 hours ago, Cam said:

You probably know Shannon was a big 70s name due to a massive 1976 hit song of the same name. First, I think Shannon is absolutely beautiful. But I hated the song even tho it was a huge hit. I didn’t care for the falsetto vocals and the story was about a dog which was way too sad for me. (Even now, I won’t post the lyrics here). Thing is, my boyfriend at the time whom I was mmmadly in love with, totally loved this song. He was kind of a hardass so I was surprised he was so into it. Years later after we split, he married and named his first daughter Shannon. His brother also named a daughter Shannon!

 

I had a seventh grade substitute English teacher who taught us merry, marry and Mary are actually pronounced differently.

merry - mare-y
marry - maa-ry (like a sheep saying baa, only maa)
Mary - may-ree

Why have I never forgotten that all these years later?! Of course I say them all the same.

 

I’m a Mary pronounced “mare-y” and I’ve only ever heard it pronounced “may-ree” by one person in my entire life and…I guess I just realized that she may have learned that was the right way? Huh. Annoyed the hell out of me. But…huh. 

[nvmbr02]

9 hours ago, Knight of Ni said:

There is a little girl named Khaleesi in my daughter's karate class. I really don't think that name will age well.

I know two girls named this but spelled Kaleesi. One is 5, the other 12.  Not a name I would choose, but there are worse names. 

[lumpentheologie]

11 hours ago, medimus said:

But it isn’t a different alphabet, just different orthography and pronunciation, like French or Norwegian or German. Irish is not unique in being a language that isn’t English.

Maybe this is splitting hairs, but I would consider each language as having its own alphabet. They each have their own pronunciation rules, and often have different letters or additional symbols. Wikipedia seems to agree: “The French alphabet is based on the 26 letters of the Latin alphabet, uppercase and lowercase, with five diacritics and two orthographic ligatures.“ “The modern German alphabet consists of the twenty-six letters of the ISO basic Latin alphabet plus four special letters.” “The Norwegian alphabet is based upon the Latin alphabet and is identical to the Danish alphabet. Since 1917 it has consisted of the following 29 letters.” 

Of course Irish isn’t unique in being a language that isn’t English. If you name your kid in the French or German or Norwegian alphabets the names also wouldn’t be pronounced like they would be in English. But Irish is in a bit of a special situation for two reasons. First, its alphabet is pronounced a lot more differently from English than other languages. Second, hardly anyone outside of Ireland learns Irish, and even in Ireland many people do not speak it.  

In the US at least, that makes Irish names much less readily pronounceable than a name like Javier, both because little Javier will likely have access to a community of native Spanish speakers and because learning a little Spanish as a second language is so common that many people have an idea of the basic pronunciation rules. 

None of this is to say that people shouldn’t try to pronounce Irish names properly! I just think it makes a lot of sense that people particularly struggle with them, and don’t think they sound like they’re spelled.