Remnant Fellowship 20: Popping Popcorn, Waiting for the Bewigged Tiger King....

[MomJeans]

I think Gwen was a true believer of her non-trinity doctrine. I don't think it was a test.  She would have had more followers by dropping it.

She was raised in a very conservative Church of Christ branch.  (Branch isn't really the right word, but it's the best way I can explain it).  I was in the Church of Christ during college and graduate school. In the more conservative branches, the trinity is never spoken about. As a whole the CofC does not deny the trinity.  But there is obviously a part within the CofC that doesn't preach the trinity. 

And in these more conservative branches, patriarchal authority is everything.  To me, that was why the trinity was downplayed/not discussed.  Congregants, especially female congregants, were not equal to authority, and there was no holy spirit on equal par with the authority of God.  It was God, which could only be known through an approved translation of the Bible > Church Authority > Your Husband or Father (and if you didn't have one in CofC, skip this step) > Women > Children.  

In the same church, appearing perfect was highly valued.  No one said it, but you did not show up for church in jeans and no make up, like you just rolled out of bed.  You better look like your life was together. 

I'm explaining this terribly, but I think the root of some of Gwen's beliefs are from her Church of Christ upbringing. And that is not to say that her experience was universal for Church of Christ. JMHO

[Baba O'Riley]

I am taking a deep dive into All Things Gwen.  I have read all the threads.  I know she was discussed elsewhere on FJ before she had her own thread.  Could someone please tell me where discussions about her took place before?  Thanks kindly...I think!😐

[RFIntrigued]

5 hours ago, SnarkyLawyer said:

Well, it was pretty convenient that another man popped up so quickly. Btw, did Shambles make an exception and approve a divorce for the 1st marriage, or did Mr. Langsdon just file for divorce anyway, and escape The Raggedy Remnant?

I couldn't get the 1st one to work, but the others popped up.

I think in another thread a long time ago someone mentioned that former husband Langsdon is gay. Hence the “incompatible” rumors on why they got divorced. 

[SnarkyLawyer]

1 hour ago, RFsurvivor said:

Sure! One of the biggest things is giving everyone a job and be clear with what they do. If you are in charge make sure you don’t assume they know what to do. Over communicating is better than under communication and every one thinks someone else is picking up the cake. 
 

Have a point person who is managing the details. For a wedding it would be the day of coordinator. They make sure people are where they need to be, that no one is missing something and gets the last minute issues solved before they become problems. They greatly benefit from having a few trusted people to go get things done. When families are involved having helpers who know the family members help a lot because you don’t have to explain the family tree, the helper can get the right flowers to the right person. 
 

Random things for weddings:

pack the couple to go containers once food is available. They will not eat enough at the ceremony. This makes sure food doesn’t run out and the couple gets to try the food they paid for. This is especially important for Buffett style receptions. 
 

Have someone checking in to make sure they are atleast drinking water and have had something to eat to avoid fatigue. 
 

emergency kits for dress repairs, get a person in a dress or out of one if they got sewed in. Also products to remove makeup from wedding dresses. Do research first but i had to get lipstick out of a wedding dress about 10 minute before she was walking down the aisle. Stressful as hell 

 

have a list of photos you want in advance for all the family combos and bridal party. Have two copies. One for photographer and one for a helper to check off and help find grandma for the next one on the list. 
 

anything that can be prepped in advance, do it. 
 

This one always bothered me, have real food before the event so you aren’t starving! I had real lunch brought in for my bridesmaids and they were so happy because most remnant brides had cheese and crackers. We had chicken nuggets 😂

have a clear schedule with who goes where, exact location of where, what to bring. This will stop many last minute texts of what time do I need to be at the venue.  

Designate a person to be the point of contact for last minute questions that is NOT in the couple being married! They don’t need to worry or know the last minute issues! Less stress for them the better!

 

if I think of any more I’ll respond again but it’s getting late and I should go to bed 

See, this is why I went to law school, instead of being an Events Planner. 😂 I would have been HORRIBLE at it. Thank you, for such a great list. Sounds like this has been a major factor in the beautiful weddings, within RF. I may hate what the church stands for, but as someone else pointed out, the weddings are gorgeous. 

Can I just say that it seems a bit ironic to list To-Go Boxes, so the bride and groom can eat, within the context of this thread? 😉🤔

[RFIntrigued]

On 9/30/2021 at 2:27 PM, Roscoe said:

One thing I do have to say, especially after having conversations with other ex RF members over the past few years is how insanely pervasive gaslighting is around RF. There was big control of information and you'd often get conflicting explanations from different leaders.

Whenever Gwen or leadership would do or say something crazy, or you'd hear about how someone was hurt, there would be an immediate clampdown on information. The church had an active "anti-rumor" position and all complaints were immediately seen as "divisive" and the "voice of Satan." People were terrified of speaking about anything, even things they were directly involved with. It made it deeply isolating to live through.

As a kid, even having basic questions and confusion was something that could get me into huge trouble. One time I remember vividly noticing that Gwen had completely misquoted a piece of scripture and blatantly misinterpreted its context. I was a kid who was expected to have daily 2 hour devotionals reading the Bible, so I was very aware of scripture. I told a parent that Gwen had gotten something wrong. I didn't even say it snottily or as a know-it-all, I just said "that's not what the Bible says." I got screamed at, smacked, then dragged into speak with my small group leader to apologize for thinking "I had a better idea than Gwen." I remember the leader basically telling me that I heard Gwen wrong and that she never made that obvious mistake and I was told to apologize for being divisive. 

It bugged me so much. Every time I heard that message (which was frequent because I was often replayed), I noticed the error and was reminded how I had been brutally punished for even seeing it. My own memory was frequently called into question and I was quite literally told that certain things (like women being told to go back to physically abusive husbands or kids being hit by their parents) never happened and I was remembering it wrong. I could have photographic and video evidence and still be told I was hearing it wrong and it actually said something else.

It wasn't until I got out and began speaking to other former members that I realized how much of the insanity I had witnessed had been real. I'm still working through a lot of the number RF did on my mind.

I have a friend and former coworker that finally felt free to divorce her abusive husband once Gwen got a divorce. May be the only silver lining to her divorce and remarriage to Joe Lara. I’m so thankful my friend is happily remarried and living the life she wanted now. 

[formergothardite]

6 hours ago, MomJeans said:

was God, which could only be known through an approved translation of the Bible > Church Authority > Your Husband or Father (and if you didn't have one in CofC, skip this step) > Women > Children.  

The funny thing is she could have kept the trinity and still believed this. This is pretty much exactly what most of the people we discuss here believe. Except I would say most believe the husband has more authority than any church. Women and children can only know the version of God that their husband/father/male church leader tells them exist. 

 

I agree that she must have really believed that there was no trinity to have let it cost her so many followers(and money).

[Pecansforeveryone]

There are fundies that believe in the Trinity and even let women preach. (Think AOG and "Charismatic flavored" mega-churches, i.e. Hillsong type churches and anyone of the Joyce Meyers crowd.) I agree Gwen must have really not believed in the Trinity to let it cost her so many followers and a guest appearance  on TBN

[RFsurvivor]

9 hours ago, MamaJunebug said:

@RFsurvivor, Just the tips about staying hydrated and having real food for the bridal party pre-ceremony has surely prevented  a lot of faintings!

Love the lists - and adore the delegating. That’s my downfall - I think I can do more than I can and get flustered.

Thank you and if you think of a part 2, kniw thst I’ll be taking notes again!  

The to go food was a life saver after my own wedding. We didn’t realize how hungry we were until we had gotten home and I remembered the to go boxes!

[quiversR4hunting]

9 hours ago, SnarkyLawyer said:

Can I just say that it seems a bit ironic to list To-Go Boxes, so the bride and groom can eat, within the context of this thread? 😉🤔

YES!!! Hopefully Elizabeth and Gwen wannabes were never in charge of to-go boxes. I remember one of my aunts telling me that her and my uncle went through drive thru - in their wedding dress & tux- after their reception because they were starving. 

@RFsurvivor your list is great, thank you for sharing. The aunt and uncle that were my hostess/host were the ones dealing with all the details the day of the wedding. I would add this role has to be someone that is decisive and can tell the hall/food/cake/dj, etc. what to do and where to go when things get dicey. I didn't know until about 30 minutes into my reception that the reception hall didn't have power until 30 minutes prior to the reception because someone dropped a tree on the power lines down the road. My aunt extended appetizer time and that is when my ex and I greeted all our guests (I highly recommend doing it before dinner if you have an appetizer/cocktail time). She also kept us moving to cut the cake, etc. A funny part of the wedding weekend, rehearsal dinner (the night before) we all got evacuated to the basement of the hotel because of tornado watch. It was very stormy the day before I got married to my ex. Foreshadowing?  🤣

[MamaJunebug]

18 hours ago, Alisamer said:

why did she stick a white, non matching tulle petticoat under it?

Honestly I kind of like the deconstructed post-apocalyptic look of the dress, but I can't imagine wearing that to a wedding, much less when officiating one. 

Is it "Magnolia Pearl" that has the apocalyptic-leftovers look? The one favored by that fundie who refused to get her children birth certificates?

[MamaJunebug]

I'm a little frazzled this morning so won't be able to find the OP who wrote, "When a church tells you they're the only ones that have it right, run! It's a cult."  But I thank them for writing it.

Earlier this week I binged the The Way Down AND then the series about Heaven's Gate.  One of the wrap-up comments on that disaster was, "When a church tells you they have all the answers, run! It's a cult."

Difficult watching and it's triggered my depression (I have talk therapy this afternoon, I'll be ok).  But it's also reminded me not to think I am, nor that anyone I love is, immune to the danger of a destructive cult.

About the Trinity.  I never have had a problem with the concept.  The ancient graphic included in TWD series explained it logically to my young Lutheran mind and still does.  My old, semi-Lutheran mind has come up with this explanation, which may/not be helpful:

God the Father creates

God the Son redeems

God the Holy Spirit converts (inspires, persuades ... a little foggy on words today)

And to wrap up with a bit of graveyard-adjacent humor: After watching the HG documentary, i will never ever again in my life wear my eyeglasses with a neck cord! I'll buy the eyeglasses that go around the head like goggles and come apart at the bridge!  All those wan, floundering people with their eyeglasses cords hanging there.  For me, it's now such a sad image.

[Alisamer]

26 minutes ago, MamaJunebug said:

Is it "Magnolia Pearl" that has the apocalyptic-leftovers look? The one favored by that fundie who refused to get her children birth certificates?

Magnolia Pearl is more "hobo-chic" but yes that's who you're thinking of. I like post-apocalyptic touches sometimes - asymmetric hems, maybe the occasional raw edge. I like Steampunk too. But Magnolia Pearl mostly has a "woke up sick with consumption in the attic of a falling down mysterious mansion in the middle of the woods and found random moldy clothing stuffed under the bed, then did some gardening" aesthetic, IMO. I tend to think more along the lines of Mad Max when post-apocalyptic fashion is mentioned. 

I have long thought Gwen should have checked out Magnolia Pearl, it seems like something she could make work. It's crazy expensive and all for the aesthetic. Spend hundreds on a shirt that looks like the Goodwill wouldn't even take it. 

[RFIntrigued]

On 10/1/2021 at 7:15 PM, Truth sets you free said:

The Walter’s home is now for sale: https://www.remax.com/tn/brentwood/home-details/910-calloway-dr-brentwood-tn-37027/6474221324687196738

 

My friend just told me she and her husband put in an offer on that house, but Remnant beat them to it.

[RFIntrigued]

On 10/1/2021 at 8:40 PM, Destiny said:

Oh sure, I don’t disagree re: older houses and plantations. That sort of makes sense, but I got the impression these were newer builds. It just come across as ‘look upon me and despair because I’m 500% richer than you plebs’. I fully admit that that may be a cultural difference at work though. I couldn’t imagine naming my house and expecting people to use that name, no matter how big (or small ‘cause I’m poor) that house may be. It just seems pretentious and gratuitous to me.
I can’t imagine taking care of and cleaning that big a space. I barely have the patience some days to clean my significantly smaller place most days.

They are 100% old plantation homes/historic homes. I would never in a million years live on any former plantation, but alas we have many in Brentwood/Franklin. A lot of the plantations have been turned into subdivisions with "Farms" as the second word of the subdivision.

[Tibby]

Life With Gwen and Joe - How to Live a Life of Good Deeds at 1:27. 

Gwen: 

Joe replies:

I gasped when I heard that. Told me all I needed to know about him. What a jerk.

 

[RTR]

25 minutes ago, RFIntrigued said:

My friend just told me she and her husband put in an offer on that house, but Remnant beat them to it.

Not surprised. Heathrow Hills is super close to the church, and I can see them wanting to keep the property in the family, so to speak.

[Tibby]

13 hours ago, MomJeans said:

I think Gwen was a true believer of her non-trinity doctrine. I don't think it was a test.  She would have had more followers by dropping it.

 

I agree. It is not unprecedented from the earliest of times. The first Christians were not Trinitarians. They knew Jesus and his family. He was a Jew like one of them, not God. The concept of the Trinity was not part of Christianity until 325 AD. And even then it was a concept that was voted on. Twenty of the 318 bishops at the Council voted no. 

If you make Jesus a god instead of a human, then that gives you a really good excuse not to be like him. 

[SnarkyLawyer]

On 10/1/2021 at 6:15 PM, Truth sets you free said:

The Walter’s home is now for sale: https://www.remax.com/tn/brentwood/home-details/910-calloway-dr-brentwood-tn-37027/6474221324687196738

 

It's a beautiful house.

[Animosus]

1 hour ago, Tibby said:

Life With Gwen and Joe - How to Live a Life of Good Deeds at 1:27. 

Gwen: 

Joe replies:

I gasped when I heard that. Told me all I needed to know about him. What a jerk.

 

Did Joe ever do anything for others that didn't serve him?  Not like I knew him personally, but he came across as a pretty self focused individual.

I was a campfire girl and we sold Candy.  I liked the candy better than cookies.  

[rabbitholejulie]

4 hours ago, SnarkyLawyer said:

It's a beautiful house.

What did the parents do for a living to afford that house?

[SnarkyLawyer]

13 minutes ago, rabbitholejulie said:

What did the parents do for a living to afford that house?

Jonathan Walters was the president of a company called, Intraoperative Nueromonitoring. I don't know anything about what that involves, except what I found on Wiki. 

[rabbitholejulie]

9 minutes ago, SnarkyLawyer said:

Jonathan Walters was the president of a company called, Intraoperative Nueromonitoring. I don't know anything about what that involves, except what I found on Wiki. 

Hmmm a real job, unrelated to RF...

[Nonbeliever]

46 minutes ago, rabbitholejulie said:

Hmmm a real job, unrelated to RF...

And yet…still a scam

https://www.justice.gov/usao-mdtn/pr/largest-independant-provider-intraoperative-neuromonitoring-services-hospitals-agrees

 

[RFIntrigued]

7 hours ago, RTR said:

Not surprised. Heathrow Hills is super close to the church, and I can see them wanting to keep the property in the family, so to speak.

Have you considered an FJ handle such as VFL instead of RTR? 😜

[Baxsmom]

I am watching the live webcast service right now.  After hearing the uplifting testimonies, the defense of Gwen, the beautiful family pictures, all 52 standing ovations, I decided I am leaving Los Angeles to move to Brentwood and and join....

 

 

OH HELL NO.