Alyssa & John 9: It’s All About Dressing Up and Looking Perfect on Instagram

[Mrs Ms]

I am so excited for the girls! Even if what they learn from the “likeminded people” is no better than the drivel they are currently subjected to, at least they FINALLY get to interact with the teacher and experience classmates. 
Hopefully the co-op proves to be such a success that they spend more than one day a week there and maybe this can be a stepping stone to a Christian school.

[JermajestyDuggar]

Braggie loves to brag about how she graduated homeschool at 16 so she could start college early. She finished college early and got married. Zoo bragged about Solomon finishing at 16. He started working full time very young. So did Isaac. I think a lot of these fundies do this. But I bet the younger ones won’t graduate as early. 

[SassyPants]

I think her vanity will protect Alyssa from becoming Kelly Jo.

[GreenBeans]

15 hours ago, JermajestyDuggar said:

I think fundies do this because they want their kids to graduate early. It’s how they cut off homeschooling by years. She will do bare bones homeschooling and get Allie done by 15.5 so Allie can have time to homeschool the younger ones for her. 

I think fundies like to claim their method of homeschooling is superior to evil public school, and what better way to do that than by having your kids graduate early? - “Look, my daughter finished high school 2 years earlier, because homeschooling is so efficient!”

The question is not so much what “grade” they are enrolled in at age 4, 5 or 6, in the long run it’s about what they actually learn. And videos and workbooks can only go so far. I guess it’s not as noticeable during the first couple of years, because with basic reading, writing, math it’s so easy to just sit a kid in front of a workbook a year early, and a lot of it is memorizing rather than understanding (or at least memorizing can compensate lack of thorough explaining/understanding).

[SassyPants]

And I’m not sure if these people even meet state requirements for graduation.  IMO, for most, it’s closer to dropping out than graduating early. They leave school early because education means little in their circle/life plan etc…

Allie is 6 and entering 2nd grade per Alyssa. She writes in cursive and has been shown reading. My GD is 7 and entering 2nd grade. She reads, prints, is really good at math and art, knows a good amount of science and geography, is starting to tell time, knows money and is fully bilingual. I’m not so sure Allie could keep up in a real 2nd grade class. And quite frankly, I’d say my GD is pretty middle of the road, but what she has that no fundies have is a wide range of exposure and engaged parents-

Edited August 3, 2021 by SassyPants

[JermajestyDuggar]

I think it’s probably fairly easy to graduate a kid early if you get rid of all the extras. When I was having to homeschool my kids last year, it was very easy for me to throw those aside and focus only on the reading, writing, and math. I imagine this is another reason fundies seem to be extremely ignorant about science. The science they teach their kids is wrong (creationism), and then they forget the rest. The history is whitewashed and the social studies is probably non-existent. 

[Jackie3]

Quote

I think it’s probably fairly easy to graduate a kid early if you get rid of all the extras.

What does "graduate early" even mean? These people call a walk in the wood "science." Reading to their little siblings is "English." A video about the government is "civics." If you read Cynthia Jeub's account of her homeschooling, it's eye opening. She basically wrote her own transcript, based on one that she googled. 

I think "graduate early" means "your mother decided you are done."

[SassyPants]

I also think that once she started the Abecca program with Lexi,  followed closely by Zoey, she realized it might be more than should could handle with a baby in the mix. So a co-op was her out. And rest assured, if the co-op becomes demanding, she’ll most likely make further changes. 

[GreenBeans]

11 hours ago, Jackie3 said:

What does "graduate early" even mean? These people call a walk in the wood "science." Reading to their little siblings is "English." A video about the government is "civics." If you read Cynthia Jeub's account of her homeschooling, it's eye opening. She basically wrote her own transcript, based on one that she googled. 

I think "graduate early" means "your mother decided you are done."

This.

Those poor kids suffer so much educational neglect, and unfortunately, in many regions of the US, education only seems to be viewed as a parental right, in tens of the parent being free to determine how their children will be (home)schooled (or not). It’s a shame that children are not entitled to an actual education, and even to the extent they are, no one seems to enforce that right on their behalf. Once they are old enough to realize (if they do realize at all), the damage has been done. 

[Jackie3]

22 hours ago, Melissa1977 said:

What I like about her is that she seems to care for herself, which sometimes can be kinda selfish, but sometimes is good for her and her family. We all see she was overwhelmed and bored with the 4 girls at home, but she has found a solution with the co-op (happier mom, happier girls). She avoid pregnancy  when she was ill... Other fundies would have had a baby while they were sick, or would stay at home with the kids and be more and more frustrated. 

I think Alyssa is vain and dumb, but she protects herself, which somehow makes her smarter than other fundies.

 

You are liking her for a reason you invented. We have no idea why she put the girls in a coop. Maybe they complained of loneliness and bored. Maybe Allie was testing below grade level. It may have nothing to do with "protecting herself." It's fine to like Alyssa, but that doesn't mean assigning good motivations for her actions, without any basis in fact. 

If she were truly protecting herself, she wouldn't have had Maci. That pregnancy may have caused her heart problems to re-appear. In terms of self-love, she'd have stopped at three.

[lumpentheologie]

In Alyssa's latest stories she says Maci is sleeping through the night at 5 months. It makes me so sad that that's probably because of her abusive baby training. 

 

(And before anyone claims their kid slept through the night at that age, we know she starves/neglects those babies.) 

[MaryOrMartha]

5 minutes ago, lumpentheologie said:

In Alyssa's latest stories she says Maci is sleeping through the night at 5 months. It makes me so sad that that's probably because of her abusive baby training. 

 

(And before anyone claims their kid slept through the night at that age, we know she starves/neglects those babies.) 

I haven't been following for as long as most, where has it been known she starves/neglects her babies?

[marmalade]

4 minutes ago, MaryOrMartha said:

I haven't been following for as long as most, where has it been known she starves/neglects her babies?

She has admitted to following the Ezzo method.

[Melissa1977]

3 minutes ago, MaryOrMartha said:

I haven't been following for as long as most, where has it been known she starves/neglects her babies?

She uses Babywise training. It means babies are neither hold nor feed at night, no matter if they are hungry. Babywise had caused babies to be underfed or dehydrated. But to be fair, Alyssa said she is flexible (who knows what flexible means, though). What she and John said very clear is that the babies are left crying, in order to be sleeptrained.

[lumpentheologie]

14 minutes ago, MaryOrMartha said:

I haven't been following for as long as most, where has it been known she starves/neglects her babies?

She has admitted to using Ezzo's Babywise method. Basically that means rigid control of feeding times and not feeding the baby at night starting at 7 weeks. Also not cuddling, rocking, or feeding the baby before bed, just putting them in the crib totally awake, leaving, and letting them cry for as long as it takes. It's been condemned by the American Academy of Pediatrics for causing malnutrition, emotional disorders, delayed development, and failure to thrive. 

 

ETA: It also makes me feel really bad for Allie, whose sleep was probably disrupted by the baby crying. And it must have been hard for her to just lie there and listen to her sister cry, since I'm sure they told her not to interact with her or try to soothe her. I wonder if part of the reason they put Maci with Allie and not the younger ones is that Allie was old enough to understand and obey those directions. 

Edited August 4, 2021 by lumpentheologie

[nolongerIFBx]

22 hours ago, Jackie3 said:

What does "graduate early" even mean? These people call a walk in the wood "science." Reading to their little siblings is "English." A video about the government is "civics." If you read Cynthia Jeub's account of her homeschooling, it's eye opening. She basically wrote her own transcript, based on one that she googled. 

I think "graduate early" means "your mother decided you are done."

ABeka provides a curriculum and it sounds like Alyssa is following the curriculum by using the videos. Back when I was enrolled, you could get a diploma for completing the work assigned in the curriculum (you mailed that in to be graded) but since ABeka sought accreditation for the program, only those using the video can get the accredited diploma. https://www.abeka.com/AbekaAcademy/Comparison.aspx#FACCS I'm not trying to say that ABeka is perfect but it is a far cry from what Cynthia Jeub experienced. My siblings and I all went on to graduate from secular accredited colleges/universities, one with a masters and one with a graduate certificate (requires 15 hours of graduate level classes).

Edited August 4, 2021 by nolongerIFBx

[Jackie3]

40 minutes ago, nolongerIFBx said:

ABeka provides a curriculum and it sounds like Alyssa is following the curriculum by using the videos. Back when I was enrolled, you could get a diploma for completing the work assigned in the curriculum (you mailed that in to be graded) but since ABeka sought accreditation for the program, only those using the video can get the accredited diploma. https://www.abeka.com/AbekaAcademy/Comparison.aspx#FACCS I'm not trying to say that ABeka is perfect but it is a far cry from what Cynthia Jeub experienced. My siblings and I all went on to graduate from secular accredited colleges/universities, one with a masters and one with a graduate certificate (requires 15 hours of graduate level classes).

I wasn't talking about Abeka specifically. That seems like a pretty structured curriculum. I was talking about families that have a "relaxed" homeschooling style. 

On 8/3/2021 at 7:34 AM, JermajestyDuggar said:

I think it’s probably fairly easy to graduate a kid early if you get rid of all the extras. When I was having to homeschool my kids last year, it was very easy for me to throw those aside and focus only on the reading, writing, and math. I imagine this is another reason fundies seem to be extremely ignorant about science. The science they teach their kids is wrong (creationism), and then they forget the rest. The history is whitewashed and the social studies is probably non-existent. 

Kelly Crawford has written blog posts about how her high schoolers don't "need" chemistry, physics, etc. In other words, it's hard to teach it so the kids dont' need it. 

[freethemall]

1 hour ago, nolongerIFBx said:

ABeka provides a curriculum and it sounds like Alyssa is following the curriculum by using the videos. Back when I was enrolled, you could get a diploma for completing the work assigned in the curriculum (you mailed that in to be graded) but since ABeka sought accreditation for the program, only those using the video can get the accredited diploma. https://www.abeka.com/AbekaAcademy/Comparison.aspx#FACCS I'm not trying to say that ABeka is perfect but it is a far cry from what Cynthia Jeub experienced. My siblings and I all went on to graduate from secular accredited colleges/universities, one with a masters and one with a graduate certificate (requires 15 hours of graduate level classes).

Erin, her own sister, commented on the curriculum to say that with Carson she found you couldnt just plop them in front of the videos, you needed as the "teacher" to still be around and keep them active. She seemed a bit more critical of it being video-based. At the time some of us felt her comments were a bit passive aggressive to the way Alyssa does it.

[Heidijoey]

She has admitted to using Ezzo's Babywise method. Basically that means rigid control of feeding times and not feeding the baby at night starting at 7 weeks. Also not cuddling, rocking, or feeding the baby before bed, just putting them in the crib totally awake, leaving, and letting them cry for as long as it takes. It's been condemned by the American Academy of Pediatrics for causing malnutrition, emotional disorders, delayed development, and failure to thrive. 
 
ETA: It also makes me feel really bad for Allie, whose sleep was probably disrupted by the baby crying. And it must have been hard for her to just lie there and listen to her sister cry, since I'm sure they told her not to interact with her or try to soothe her. I wonder if part of the reason they put Maci with Allie and not the younger ones is that Allie was old enough to understand and obey those directions. 

Maybe this is due to the criticism she received in the past but she did post several “late night” feeding sessions with Maci. It could have just been for show but it may have made her more aware that the Enzo method is wrong

[SassyPants]

I abhor Alyssa’s approach to education, mothering, religion …but Maci is clearly well fed and thriving. She is neither being starved nor under stimulated/ignored.

[VineHeart137]

13 hours ago, lumpentheologie said:

ETA: It also makes me feel really bad for Allie, whose sleep was probably disrupted by the baby crying. And it must have been hard for her to just lie there and listen to her sister cry, since I'm sure they told her not to interact with her or try to soothe her. I wonder if part of the reason they put Maci with Allie and not the younger ones is that Allie was old enough to understand and obey those directions. 

Is Maci in Allie's room now? I remember Alyssa saying that was going to be the plan eventually but she also said (at that time) that Maci would be in her and John's room for the time being. If Maci is rooming with Allie now maybe they waited until she was sleeping through the night to move her.

Edited August 4, 2021 by VineHeart137

[SassyPants]

50 minutes ago, VineHeart137 said:

Is Maci in Allie's room now? I remember Alyssa saying that was going to be the plan eventually but she also said (at that time) that Maci would be in her and John's room for the time being. If Maci is rooming with Allie now maybe they waited until she was sleeping through the night to move her.

Maci’s  crib is in Allie’s room, but that doesn’t mean that she’s sleeping in it-

[FaithAndReason]

14 hours ago, lumpentheologie said:

In Alyssa's latest stories she says Maci is sleeping through the night at 5 months. It makes me so sad that that's probably because of her abusive baby training. 

 

(And before anyone claims their kid slept through the night at that age, we know she starves/neglects those babies.) 

My two oldest children slept through the night at six weeks and never looked back. They were not starved, or baby trained or anything. They were horrible nappers during the day and my guess is that is why they slept at night. It's pretty crappy of you to accuse someone of starving/harming their infant because they sleep through the night at five months. All babies are different. 

[byzant]

@FaithAndReason except she has posted about abusive parenting manuals and sleep training.

Edited August 4, 2021 by byzant
Sp

[JuanitaBanana]

No one thinks she's harming her baby because Maci sleeps through the night. People think this because she has admitted to using an abusive sleep training method.