Animal fat obsession

[BlondeAgent007]

I am in college currently to be a dietician. Many people are lactose intolerant. However, a lot of food specialists believe that giving cows milk to children while their immune system is in its infancy causes more people to become lactose intolerance. Children under one year old shouldn't be given cows milk, only breast milk and formula.

Unless u have a medical condition or are a person under heavy physical training, about half ur calories should come from carbs, next abundant is fat, and the smallest percentage from protein. Americans grossly overestimate how much protein they need. I also think people don't understand that almost all foods contain carbs besides straight protein or fat sources. According to my food table charts, and the 15+ dieticians I have met, this has remained consistent. Roughly, all the calories in fruit is from carbs, as are most of the calories in vegetables, there is quite a bit in in dairy products, as well as from traditional carbs and starches. The food pyramids in china, india, and the middle east are very different from ours. very little. meat based protein. The brain functions exclusively from energy from carbs thus --not getting enough can lead to temporary insanity. I wish people would get more information from CADE accredited sources who have the chemistry and biology background I am strruggling through, and not just from books that can be written by any dick, jane, or sandy. http://Www.eatright.org. sorry this is long winded, im at school bt classes on my phone and I just had to speak up

[Wolfie]

The natural lifespan of a cow is approximately twenty years. Dairy cattle live for approximately 3-5 years, and are killed when their milk production declines, because it's more cost-effective to breed another to convert feed into milk more efficiently.

I eat meat, as long as the butchering is done humanely this isn't an issue.

Within that time they are repeatedly impregnated in order to produce milk.

And if they were left in a pasture with a bull, they would naturally breed again within a day after birth, too. This is common among many mammals to always be pregnant. So people controlling their animals to follow unnatural cycles is more humane to you?

The babies are taken away within a day or so of birth, a few females are kept for future dairy production, the rest are slaughtered for veal.

Again, I eat meat. I've actually helped friends with bottle baby goat kids from dairy productions, not a big deal to me. (BTW- a few top quality males are kept too, just not as many as females)

That's how it works on every dairy farm, before you look into issues of confinement, or feed, or how hormones and breeding for overproduction lead to frequent mastitis, or transportation or slaughter. Even if all of those variables are done in the least awful way, it's still an inherently cruel process.

I grew up with a cattle ranch in the family, I have friends involved in animal production. Very few producers are using hormones anymore- they found that they caused more issues than extra milk. Look at the grocery store and you will notice that the vast majority of the milk is now labeled as hormone free. Mastitis happens occasionally in ANY mammal, and if the USDA catches them milking a cow and including it in their milk for human consumption they will get in big trouble- the whole lot will be thrown out, and they can get fined. It's not worth it, so preventing it is preferred. But it happens.

I'm more concerned about how much time the cattle or goats spend outdoors, what kind of pasture they are on, and how they are fed. I don't generally buy generic grocery store milk, but get milk from friends with small goat flocks, or a couple of different brands from the natural foods store. I also don't buy into a lot of the animal rights crap that tries to tell me that animals are like humans and have human wants and needs.

BTW- I don't care if somebody doesn't eat milk for various reasons, but don't try to pull the "you're a horrible person who has no clue" card.

[PraiseSeitan]

Well, if you think that breeding an animal just to use her like a machine to convert feed into milk, knock her up, kill her babies so they don't use any of that profitable milk, and then kill her at less than a quarter of her lifespan because she's not as efficient at converting feed to milk as a younger cow would be is anything but cruel, you have a different definition of cruel than I do. And honestly, your definition sucks.

[Wolfie]

Well, if you think that breeding an animal just to use her like a machine to convert feed into milk, knock her up, kill her babies so they don't use any of that profitable milk, and then kill her at less than a quarter of her lifespan because she's not as efficient at converting feed to milk as a younger cow would be is anything but cruel, you have a different definition of cruel than I do. And honestly, your definition sucks.

No, I see you as somebody who has bought into animal rights LIES. An animal doesn't really know if they are going to live or die. They have a drive to reproduce, and some of them can have major issues if they are not allowed to reproduce. (which is why we spay or neuter dogs and cats rather than just keep them confined and allow their hormones.) If an animal has a healthy, decent life while they are alive, how long they live doesn't really matter unless we want to apply human emotions to it.

[BlondeAgent007]

umm, i guess since i helped to derail this thread (sorry), i will go back to the topic at hand. I think it really comes down to personal preference. Many margarines you can buy now do not have trans fats. Most of those are lower in calories than butter, and are made with mono and polyunsaturated fats (the good ones). The plus side is that many are, by the content of the fat, better for you, and since they have less fat and calories you can use more. However, they make a lower quality baked good, do not pan fry foods correctly, and do not taste like natural butter. As i am not a huge fan of butter unless i am making pierogies (i rarely eat plain buttered bagels or toast), i usually use tub margarine. I don't mind the taste. However, if you really like the taste of real butter, i don't think there is anything wrong with eating it, so long as it is used sparingly. I wouldn't claim it is better for you than tub margarine, but I don't think it is a particularly unhealthy choice either.

[Lillian]

Definitely not just a fundie thing to use animal fats. My grandma uses lard and butter all the time, and our family has never had any issues major issues in regards to that at all. Though I was told horror stories when I was younger of my father's favorite food being lard sandwiches...uggghh...

[debrand]

Well, if you think that breeding an animal just to use her like a machine to convert feed into milk, knock her up, kill her babies so they don't use any of that profitable milk, and then kill her at less than a quarter of her lifespan because she's not as efficient at converting feed to milk as a younger cow would be is anything but cruel, you have a different definition of cruel than I do. And honestly, your definition sucks.

I understand some of your issues with dairy cows but I'm curious about the mating one. Isn't Wolfie correct that in the wild animals breed everytime they are in heat? That is why there are so many feral cats in my neighborhood.

For the record, I try to limit my intake of meat so I am nearly a vegetarian. It isn't as though I am defending the treatment of dairy cows. I am just curious about this one issue though

[deelaem]

No, I see you as somebody who has bought into animal rights LIES. An animal doesn't really know if they are going to live or die. They have a drive to reproduce, and some of them can have major issues if they are not allowed to reproduce. (which is why we spay or neuter dogs and cats rather than just keep them confined and allow their hormones.) If an animal has a healthy, decent life while they are alive, how long they live doesn't really matter unless we want to apply human emotions to it.

(HUGS) for this very sensible post.

[Wolfie]

Thank you.

[TaylorMaid]

Lardo (cured back-fat from special pigs raised primarily on acorns) has less saturated fat and cholesterol than butter, and fewer potentially damning repercussions for one’s health than artificially produced fats.

[debrand]

Lardo (cured back-fat from special pigs raised primarily on acorns) has less saturated fat and cholesterol than butter, and fewer potentially damning repercussions for one’s health than artificially produced fats.

My grandmother used to cook with something called Fat Back. It is salty and fatty. Is that the same thing as Lardo?

[manatees]

In Gascony, France they eat a whole lotta duck and goose fat, and have very low incidences of heart disease. For cooking I like coconut oil.

[acheronbeach]

No, I see you as somebody who has bought into animal rights LIES. An animal doesn't really know if they are going to live or die. They have a drive to reproduce, and some of them can have major issues if they are not allowed to reproduce. (which is why we spay or neuter dogs and cats rather than just keep them confined and allow their hormones.) If an animal has a healthy, decent life while they are alive, how long they live doesn't really matter unless we want to apply human emotions to it.

If I understand your position, I completely disagree.

Animals will fight to save their fellow members of their group when it appears they are in mortal peril, especially the young; and if they are unsuccessful, they appear to grieve. Grief when confronted with death is one emotion that animals - especially higher-order animals - share with us. Elephant young have been witnessed screaming in their sleep after the death of their mothers; crows collect around the dead of one of their flock and watch over it for a few minutes in silence; chimps collect around dying unit-mates and comfort the dying chimp.

I am no longer a vegetarian, but I don't comfort myself when I eat meat by thinking that we as humans are so vastly superior to animals that we can't share some of the same capacity for emotion or understanding death. I also have trouble with the idea that as long as an animal is kept in comfort, we as humans have the right to total dominion over it to the point of life and death.

[eohiken]

It takes 4 years fo a cow to mature, so all these 'old' dairy cows are only just barely adult animals when they are sent to slaughter. It's just plain wasteful, just from an economic standpoint, not to mention ethics. Beef breeds have way better feed conversion if you want meat. The profit margin of the mega-agro-industry is not the best way to make livestock policies. Animals are not inherently capitalist in nature.

I eat meat too, but I still have ethical priorities about how I do so. But then, I'm a crazy hippie that raises dairy goats, so that tells you how far I carry my ideologies.

[NurseNell]

A story just now on MN TV news about organic eggs contaminated with salmonella. Organic doesn't necessarile mean safer.

[dairyfreelife]

This.